[Bill_McBride]

There are many great or very good out and back links courses in the links land of the UK, but there are some great American out and back routings as well.

Interestingy, these seem to be mostly top notch courses.  I'm not sure why, but the evidence is interesting.

Pebble Beach, Cypress Point, the Valley Club, NGLA, the Creek Club, Mountain Lake....classics.

Pacific Dunes, Bandon Trails....modern classics.

What other classics am I forgetting?

Since most of these courses are on sites not constrained by narrow boundaries, I assume these routings just worked out best.  Other thoughts?

[Lester George]

Old White

Lester

[Scott_Burroughs]

Bethpage (Black)
Baltusrol (both)
Pine Valley
Merion

[Mark McKeever]

Not as well known, but Wyoming Valley CC also. (Tillie)

Mark

[Tom_Doak]

Rock Creek, Old Macdonald, Black Forest, and St. Andrews Beach from my collection.

The Valley Club and Cypress Point were narrow properties so the out and back was pretty much a given.  Pebble was a given if they wanted to get all the way from the lodge to Carmel Beach, and who wouldn't ?

Generally those are the only two reasons you wouldn't come back to the clubhouse somewhere in 18 holes.  Clients and members generally prefer it if possible.  However, the flexibility not to come back at number 9 makes a huge difference sometimes ... Both Stonewall courses, for example, worked much better by coming back to the clubhouse after 8 holes, and Pacific Dunes does come back after 7.

[Ben Sims]

Couple of old southern gems, Augusta CC, Palmetto GC, and Aiken GC.  All out and backs.

[Scott_Burroughs]

Pinehurst #2 (actually none of the 5 courses at the main clubhouse return)
Pine Needles
Southern Pines
Winchester (MA)

[jim_lewis]

modern:     Forest Creek North

[Mark McKeever]

Rock Creek, Old Macdonald, Black Forest, and St. Andrews Beach from my collection.

The Valley Club and Cypress Point were narrow properties so the out and back was pretty much a given.  Pebble was a given if they wanted to get all the way from the lodge to Carmel Beach, and who wouldn't ?

Generally those are the only two reasons you wouldn't come back to the clubhouse somewhere in 18 holes.  Clients and members generally prefer it if possible.  However, the flexibility not to come back at number 9 makes a huge difference sometimes ... Both Stonewall courses, for example, worked much better by coming back to the clubhouse after 8 holes, and Pacific Dunes does come back after 7.

Tom,

With that new back tee on 9 (usually with people watching from the deck) and the beating I typically take on 8 for being too bold off the tee, its good that I can walk off the old course at Stonewall at that point!

Mark

[Jeff Fortson]

EDIT... already mentioned.

Interestingly enough, George Thomas promoted routing a course that returns to the clubhouse after nine in GAIA. 

I do love the trek of not returning until completing a round like the ones mentioned above.  But, there is something to be said for a routing that returns to the clubhouse after nine.  It enables nine hole rounds to be walked.  Thomas's contention, I believe,  was to have an early hole return to the clubhouse as well (i.e. Riviera #2) so that matches that have to go extra holes can be completed next to the clubhouse.  I can tell you that it was always nice to get off late from work and go play 1,2,10,9,3,18 for a nice six hole round at Riv.  Sometimes I'd only have enough for two holes and play 10 and 9.  It definitely encouraged one to play instead of practice when time was limited.


Jeff F.

[Jim Nugent]

St. Louis CC.  The 9th tee is as far from the clubhouse you can get and still be on the course. 

[Dan Kelly]

Another modern classic: Sutton Bay.

I don't know that any course has ever felt more like a "journey" to me.

(That's a compliment, by the way, in case you wonder.)

Pebble Beach comes close, I guess, in that regard -- but the high-priced real estate next to various holes diminishes the sense of "journey."

[Dave Herrick]

It would appear to me that it is a common occurrence where multiple courses depart from a single clubhouse, e.g. at Pinehurst, and it's not possible to get two greens per course near the clubhouse.

[Sean_A]

An unusual one is Yeamans Hall.  The course doesn't come back until the 18th, but one is never too far from the house.  I am surprised nobody has ever mentioned (that I know of) this about the routing.  Its quite clever and I expect makes it easy for residents to jump on the course in various spots.

"However, the flexibility not to come back at number 9 makes a huge difference sometimes ... Both Stonewall courses, for example, worked much better by coming back to the clubhouse after 8 holes, and Pacific Dunes does come back after 7."

I actually prefer more of a 5-13 or 6-12 split for coming back to the house.  A shorter, longer or full loop is very appealing.

Ciao

[Richard Choi]

Add Old Mac to the list!

[Bill_Yates]

Old Del Monte in Monterey.

[Jim Nugent]

Torrey Pines South.

[Bill_Yates]

...and Spanish Bay

[Tim Bert]

MPCC Shore and Dunes

Seems like a good number of courses in Bandon and Monterey!

Pinehurst #2

[Bob_Huntley]

Bill McBride,

I think you have played these two before.

MPCC, Dunes and Shore.

Bob

[Bill_McBride]

Bill McBride,

I think you have played these two before.

MPCC, Dunes and Shore.

Bob

Bob, I have indeed played the Shore    but not yet the Dunes.

I overlooked quite a few courses I have played, primarily in the Pinehurst area and in Aiken, SC.  My memory is going about the same way my driving distance has gone.........

[Scott_Burroughs]

CC of Rochester
Marriott Seaview - Bay
Leatherstocking
current discussee, Dismal River

[JLahrman]

How are we defining 'out and back'?

Does it just mean that the course doesn't return to the clubhouse after nine holes?

Or does it mean that the course essentially goes out all in one general direction, and then comes back in the opposite direction?

[Phil Benedict]

I used to belong to a course that was out and back with the 14th tee next to the 4th green; hence a convenient 9-hole circuit of 1-4 and 14-18.  I often wonder whether this was a happy accident or part of the architect's (Ross) intent.

[CJ Carder]

Jim, I Hope the Torrey Pines South was a joke.  

I would offer up The Ocean Course @ Kiawah though.... it's not perfectly out & back in that one 9 is out and the other 9 is back.... but both 9's do go perfectly out and back by themselves.

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