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Patrick_Mucci

Re: Nicklaus on great par 3s
« Reply #25 on: January 07, 2009, 10:06:14 PM »
Pat M,

I think you can have all in a par 3. (Fear, toughness, Fair)

You might be able to have it all for narrow segments of the golfing spectrum, but, it's difficult to achieve for the entire spectrum.


The challenge of, say feathering a 7-9 iron to the right pin at Augusta 12 is similar even if the penalty changes.  If you can hit the target its fair.  If you also have some kind of a bailout, its fair.  If the right side was much shalower or smaller, or if the penalty was more severe, it would be unfair, and even more fearful.  Its a great hole because of how those things balance.

We could discuss the existance or non-existance of a "bailout" area on # 12, and, we could context the discussion is "sets" of golfers ( +6 to 0, 1 to 6, 7 to 12, 13 to 18, 19 to 24, 25 to 32 and 33 and above.

What might be fearful, challenging and fair to the lower sets will probably not make the "fairness" grade with the upper sets, due to the pass/fail nature of the hole, and the existance of water and other difficulties. 

A hole like # 8 at Oakmont might be a better example due to the ability of the golfer to approach the green along the ground.


Its fair because the left side of the green offers a bailout and even the prime target is deep enough and wide enough to give you a chance to hit it. Its borderline, which creates the fear.  I think it can be as shallow as it is because the ball is on a tee and the distance is controlled.  If it was a par 4, some folks might be coming from longer distances and/or the rough.

I'd debate you on the bailout to the left of the green, it's like a linen closet in that area, tiny and tough to get in and out of, with disaster close by.


It also creates fear with the hazard in front but has a recoverable hazard in back. If that size target was a peninsula, making it like TPC 17, it wouldn't be fair unless the target was bigger, IMHO.  If the green sloped away, or even too much to the front where a ball might spin back the slope, it would be a lot less fair. 

The fear factor on # 12 at ANGC is almost universal.
We've all watched train wreck after train wreck on that hole, save for Couples ball's miraculous suspension on the steep fronting slope.  So, when anyone comes to the tee on that hole, they come to it with preconceived notions, a predisposition with respect to what the hole can produce... for the best golfers in the world and average players alike.


In some ways, you can measure the fear (and fair) factor by how many people go for the Sunday pin vs. how many don't.  If nearly zero % go for it, its probably not fair, or too fearful.  If everyone goes for it, something is wrong, too.  If about half try it, then you probably have the right balance.

That's an unfair  ;D and unrealistic example.
You've selected the best players in the world, playing at their best, as your sampling.
That's the narrowest possible spectrum of golfers.


I think Ross said it more succintly than JN or I - a par 3 can be a bit tougher because the ball is on the tee, giving the player a bit of an advantage.

There's no doubt that the golfer has a perfect lie as he's about to hit his approach shot, but, that's only one factor, one that shouldn't be weighted to heavily.



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