[David_Tepper]

"Have you played Pauma Valley Country Club and if so what did you think of it?"

David K. -

I am not Pete L. and you did not ask me, but I did play 2 rounds at Pauma Valley just about a year ago. It was my first visit there and the club was in the middle of a membership drive. It is located in a very pretty valley.

I enjoyed it there. To my untrained eye, it is a classic, relatively untouched Trent Jones course, with his signature "landing strip" tee boxes very much in tact. The routing on the front-9 takes nice advantage of the large grassed in drainage channel that runs thru the property.  The back-9 is routed over a hill and thru some housing that is pretty much out of play.

DT

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Jeff, Congratulations. I am so happy the project turned out so good. And you guys had fun doing it. Life is great!

[David Kelly]

David T.,

Thanks for the info. I'm not much of a Trent Jones fan but that course has always seemed like one of the few in the SD area not encumbered by bad land or running through a housing development.

[Joe Leenheer]

Joe,

In San Diego we have two really good golf courses, Barona Creek and Rancho Santa Fe CC, niether cracks any Top 100 lists though. San Diego CC is great tee to green, but the unsympathetic greens renovation is saddening. I love Neal's greens at Maderas GC but it is a housing track. La Jolla CC has some really good holes, but a lot of pedestrian ones too. You were reaching with Balboa GC (don't worry, I'm a memeber there). I haven't played any of the others on your list to will have to with hold commentary, but Rancho Bernardo and spectacular don't belong in the same sentence! My hidden gem recommendations would be Coronado GC and Marine Memorial at Camp Pendleton.

The CC of Rancho Bernardo and Rancho Bernardo Inn are both very fine courses.  (although I am in no position to pass judgement on courses/architecture as so stated in my intro  ) now about Coronado GC being a hidden gem....Balboa is a hidden gem.  Coronado is better for getting a tan and beautiful views then great golf architecture.  La Jolla CC is my favorite of them all.  I'm assuming by pedestrian you mean flipping awesome.   

How long ago did SDCC do their greens?  Played it circa 2008 or 09 on a visit.

[Peter Ferlicca]

Joe,

I spent 2 1/2 years in San Diego going to school, and working at 2 different clubs.  San Diego has some great landscape for golf, but unfortunately that does not mean it has good golf.  IMO, there are only a handful of very good courses, and then a bunch of medium golf courses, and then A LOT of below average, waste of money tracks.  

Very Good
Rancho Santa Fe  (though it looks like dave fleming made it a little worse)
Barona Creek (pretty setting with a lot of good golf holes)

Medium to Above Medium
Farms  (I worked here for a while, good course but excessively tight off the tee)
Carlton Oaks  (pretty good course, probably the most underrated)
La Jolla
Pauma Valley  ( Very basic RTJ senior stuff here, nothing that is going to blow you away)
Del Mar
San Diego CC
Torrey Pines (Vastly overrated, without the ocean this is a bore fest.)

Everything else is below average IMO, only a couple of courses are pretty good value  for what they are
Coronado  (best kept secret in san diego)
Vista Valley  (very pretty quirky course)

I agree with Pete on Rancho Bernado, nothing to ride home about at all.  Encinitas Ranch is a waste for how good the property was.  I would rather play Goat Hill in Oceanside than a lot of the courses they charge $90 for.  

I have never played La Costa, to tell the truth it never really intrigued me whatsoever before this redesign.  

The new course they built in Carlsbad, the crossings at Carlsbad is the biggest waste of 70 million dollars ever.  

[Mike Nuzzo]

I wouldn't judge a renovation by a best approach yardage book
That fairway shaping isn't real - it's a cartoon.

Cheers

[JC Urbina]

Pete,

I thought the tour course had some really subtle but interesting putts.  It's been many YEARS since I played La Costa and they may have softened some greens since my last visit but simple slopes seem to be the most effective.  I not advocating FLAT greens but as an example  the two greens on the water next to the clubhouse a par 4 and a par 3 had some of the nicest contours on the course.

Maybe years of tour play has rendered these holes lifeless?

That is why I posed the question to Jeff about the greens in general.

[Lester George]

Don,

I should not have assumed that you hadn't seen LaCosta.  However, you telling me that you have spent more time ther than me only illustrates my point further.  Having spent that time there you should know that the drainage portion of the job would be expensive.  Just saying "it better drain" is somewhat parochial when you admit it was "horrible".

It is all relative and based solely on site conditions.  From what I witnessed, 10 million for that job was a "value" because I know the architects and the contractors were chosen largely for their ability to insure that value.  It is relative because every job is different.  For example, I built a course on extreme slopes in the mountains of Japan.  The DRAINAGE PORTION ALONE of that project was over 20 million dollars.  Total cost was 80 million dollars.  I was brought in to insure the project was brought in under budget (90 million) and succeeded by ten million.  Do I believe it was a "value" job, you are darn tootin'.  Saved the client over 30 million when yopu add in  the clubhouse we built. 

It is all relative!
 
Lester

[Don_Mahaffey]

Lester,
When it comes to "expensive," you and I look at things very differently, so I'll just leave it at that.
Like I said to Jeff, good for him if he met the client's goals. Same for you with your course in Japan.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Jim,

We left the right to left contour on 16 (par 3 in front of clubhouse) as was.

Because the hotel/clubhouse expanded outward, moving the first tee, the old 15th green is gone, replaced by one across the pond where the end of the fw was.  The tee was moved across the creek to near no. 2 tee, so we now have a driveable par 4 at 15.  Not sure how the contours compare, but they are subtle on the new one.

Steve Pate of course recalled how greens played at fast speeds, and with new bents we expect them faster than the bumpy poa.  Thus, greens on 4, 6 and 9 were flattened due to experience.

Lester,

Thanks for the backup.  I feel confident for resons stated that it is a value job.  Value is not always cheap, its fixing a problem that needs to be fixed in the best way, considering technologies available and budget.

Don,

I re-read some earlier comments, and I probably came off sounding like I didn't think you or TD knew how to drain a course, and for that I am sorry.  I wasn't complaining about that, but if you got it that I was a bit chafed at the member, you were right on!  It just goes to show that there is no one size fits all design solution, especially when it comes to drainage, soil mixes, etc.
 

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