Restoration Question

[Jim_Coleman]

   When an architect is hired to do a restoration (as opposed to a renovation or a master plan) does he ever consider whether, in his opinion, the hole will be made worse if he changes it to where it was 100 years ago? Let’s say with a bunker placement. 

[Tim Gallant]

Jim,


I suppose it depends on your definition of 'restoration' and how strict you are to the term. There's a difference between returning it to what it was, knowing that it will likely be a different challenge than it was 100 years ago (with technology having moved on so far), and a restoration where you're restoring certain shots/challenges.


To specifically answer your question, I remember Doak saying that in building the Lido at Sand Valley, the only change he made was to space a few of the holes out a bit more as people were likely to kill one another. I suppose that's an example where an architect gave his professional opinion that jarred with a 'pure' restoration. Though as I'm sure others will say, there's no such thing as a 100% restoration.

[Joe Bausch]

   When an architect is hired to do a restoration (as opposed to a renovation or a master plan) does he ever consider whether, in his opinion, the hole will be made worse if he changes it to where it was 100 years ago? Let’s say with a bunker placement.

Are you talking about greenside or fairway bunkers?


And have tees been moved in the last 100 years?

[Jim_Coleman]

   Any bunker. Or any change for that matter. If the architect believed that changing the hole back to original would make the hole worse, would he nonetheless “restore” it.

[Mike Nuzzo]

Hi Jim
What does worse mean?

If you move any bunker, does it make it worse for some and better for others?
IMO a restoration to a particular time removes the objectivity or whether a bunker is worse or better - as long as the course was better (for enough players).


Peace

[Jim_Coleman]

   I suppose I could give a specific hypothetical example, but I prefer not to. I assume an architect always tries to design the best golf course he can.  What constitutes best will surely differ from architect to architect.  But if the architect believes restoring any particular feature will make a hole worse, in his opinion, should he “restore” it nonetheless?

[Kyle Harris]

Don’t be disingenuous Jim, you could give a definitive example. Maybe try letting the architect work without meddling, for once?

[Jim_Coleman]

   Always enjoy the love, Kyle. I don’t want to give an example because opinions can differ on almost any example. I am positing that the architect doing the restoration prefers the present iteration to the 100 year old one.

[mike_malone]

Jim,


  You said “what constitutes best will surely differ from architect to architect “ so that’s the dilemma a restoration architect faces when confronted with features he thinks would be better in a different spot or even eliminated rather than placed where they were originally. Should he go with his opinion of best?


It’s a tough job.


Also I believe most architects try to look at the entire hole and even the whole course rather than just one bunker. When you do that it’s probably easier to let the original be.
 
 If the restoration architect thinks that many original features should be changed then it’s probably not worth restoration at all.
If it’s a few features that he hates then it’s more significant to maintain the integrity of the original.


Have fun playing it.




 

[Jim_Coleman]

Michael:  I think you have described the issue which I intended to raise very well. 
   Architect A almost robotically attempted to recreate the course as closely as possible to where it was 100 years ago. He removed trees, expanded greens, removed built up sand splashed from bunkers, and placed the bunkers where they were located a century ago. When he was asked how moving a particular bunker made a hole better, he responded. “I don’t think it did; I think it’s worse. But you asked for a restoration and that’s what I gave you.”
   Architect B did everything Architect A did, but he left a few bunkers in their new positions. When asked why did didn’t restore the course exactly as is was, he answered, “I wanted to give you the best course I could. You hired me for my expertise and judgement, and that’s what I tried to give you.”
   I would hire B; I suspect you would hire A.  I suppose neither of us is wrong. We just disagree. Nothing wrong with that.