[Pete_Pittock]

prior quote deleted

I mean in that scenario, you obviously have a Tesla.  It's a 3 hr drive.  You can get home delivery.
And who's pumping gas this month without wearing gloves?

Oregonians get to join the other 95% by being able to pump their own gas during the shutdown.  It may be beyond their comprehension.

[Tim Martin]

prior quote deleted

I mean in that scenario, you obviously have a Tesla.  It's a 3 hr drive.  You can get home delivery.
And who's pumping gas this month without wearing gloves?

Oregonians get to join the other 95% by being able to pump their own gas during the shutdown.  It may be beyond their comprehension.

New Jersey still has attendant only although I’m not sure if that was suspended during virus.

[Tommy Williamsen]

It strikes me, Bernie, that this is one of the biggest problems we have.  People have grown used to feeling entitled.  So someone wealthy enough to own a second home in, say, Cornwall, thinks they are entitled to move down there from London to sit out the pandemic in rural tranquillity.  The fact that that risks transmission of the disease in an area that can't cope doesn't, for them, over-ride their entitlement to do as they please.  What we are entitled to trumps what we should do.  Welcome to the modern world.  If this pandemic changes that, even a little, it will be one good thing to come out of it.  If it persuades us all to travel less for work, because working from home proves we don't need to, that will be another good thing.

I live in a resort of 1000 homes with only about 300 of us full-timers. While the restaurant only has carry out the golf course is open so many have decided to ride our the quarantine here. If I weren't a full timer now I would have come here as well. Self quarantine is so much easier here than it is in suburban DC.

[Kalen Braley]

Hmm,

Out west here in Utah its basically business as usual for everything.  The governor has held two pressers now and basically only said "Pretty pretty please stay in your homes".

Costcos, Lowes, Wal-Marts, Home Depot, etc all packed like any other Saturday.

P.S.  Salt Lake City went above and beyond making it a misdemeanor to gather in large groups but no practical restrictions on travel and otherwise...

[Peter Flory]

I was looking at the rules for golf courses in Michigan right now.


https://www.wxyz.com/news/coronavirus/golf-courses-will-have-to-close-under-michigans-stay-at-home-order

This summarized the article for your reading convenience:

Someone put in a question asking the state to clarify whether golf is allowed under Governor Whitmer's new order.  Under the old order, golf was allowed as long as the clubhouses weren't open.

The response was:
No. While EO 2020-21 contemplates outdoor activity, opening a golf course to the public does not fall under the designation of critical infrastructure. Consequently, a golf course may not designate employees as critical infrastructure employees and authorize them come to work."

The article goes on:
The state has more than 650 public courses and is a more than $4 billion industry in Michigan alone. 

The Michigan Golf Alliance, which consists of several golf groups around the state, sent a letter Tuesday to Whitmer's office asking for clarity on the stay-at-home order and what it means for courses.
They had asked for workers to be allowed to come in for maintenance on the coureses, but it appears that will not be the case.
"Spring is a critical time for turfgrass, and it cannot be neglected for an extended period or it will be lost, and the community will lose a vital asset," the letter reads. "We are taking all necessary steps to keep maintenance staff safe by considering the health advisories and recommendations by the Center for Disease Control and Prevention. Practices such as social distancing, staggering staff work hours, mandatory glove wearing and sanitizing of hand tools are just some of the maintenance adjustments that the golf industry in Michigan is proactively instituting."

So the question here is whether any golf courses are going to be essentially irretrievably lost due to a lack of maintenance during the growing season.  I have seen courses that go out of business quickly get taken over by weeds and it looks like it would be an enormous amount of work and expense to bring them back. 

[Jon Wiggett]

How does driving to your 2nd home and sheltering there risk spreading the infection?

Because even sheltering and doing the minimum you are going out to shop, or buying fuel.  Those things don't just not count.

I mean in that scenario, you obviously have a Tesla.  It's a 3 hr drive.  You can get home delivery.

And who's pumping gas this month without wearing gloves?

Well I suppose if you bring your own food, don't use local medical facilities and refrain from breathing you might have a point 

[Sean_A]

JK,

I discovered over the past two weeks that Blue Bell has a new flavor, Red Velvet Cake.  I am on my third gallon (ok, my wife has had a scoop or two) while adding three pounds.

Jon W,

Your story about the Edinburgh couple reminds me of a frequent lament/whine/complaint I heard in the Costa del Sol (around Marbella) during the '90s.  It seems that in August of most years, a considerable number of French tourists hauling small trailers with under-powered vehicles descended on the public spaces near the beach.  These would be packed to the gills with supplies, and with the exception of spending a little on gas and a few cheap staples, they left nothing in Spain other than their garbage.

It is somewhat amusing how we think about "entitlements".  From my perspective, if I own something which "entitles" me to some use (there is relevance here to Coul Links, but it is not my major point), perhaps my responsible enjoyment of what is rightfully mine should not be denigrated.  If I am to understand how the good folks in Cornwall would be fearful of a Londoner occupying his own property there and diminishing local supplies, is it reasonable for me to have a burr up my arse about Asians who live in my development but travel frequently to various parts of China and compete with me for scarce supplies?  Don't think so.

In the UK, this is not about entitlements. The government has advised against all unnecessary travel and for good reasons. It doesn't matter if folks think their actions are low risk or if so many others are out why not me. It would be a real kick in the balls if the economy was sacrifed to save lives and yet lives were lost unnecessarily due to folks thinking they gotta a right.

Ciao

[Jon Wiggett]

Jon W,


Your story about the Edinburgh couple reminds me of a frequent lament/whine/complaint I heard in the Costa del Sol (around Marbella) during the '90s.  It seems that in August of most years, a considerable number of French tourists hauling small trailers with under-powered vehicles descended on the public spaces near the beach.  These would be packed to the gills with supplies, and with the exception of spending a little on gas and a few cheap staples, they left nothing in Spain other than their garbage.

Lou,


If I understand your point correctly it is if someone owns something then they should be able to use it as they wish. I would agree with that sentiment but not if it endangers others or is to the great detriment of others. As for the Spanish example it is a little off the mark. The correct analogy would have been if the French had stripped the area of supplies leaving the locals to starve. It is not acceptable to say because I am richer I can outbid those poorer because it is my right.

[Thomas Dai]

Apparently the Police in some parts of the UK are now stopping vehicles, enquiring with the driver where they're going and why and turning them around if the haven't got a good answer.
atb

[John Kavanaugh]

Apparently the Police in some parts of the UK are now stopping vehicles, enquiring with the driver where they're going and why and turning them around if the haven't got a good answer.
atb

The only sad thing about that is it’s necessity. As with any other crime the police have the right to confiscate your clubs.

[Bernie Bell]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/03/28/coronavirus-cases-soar-outside-new-york-rural-countries-hit-hard/2926572001/

[Thomas Dai]

Apparently the Police in some parts of the UK are now stopping vehicles, enquiring with the driver where they're going and why and turning them around if the haven't got a good answer.
atb

The only sad thing about that is it’s necessity. As with any other crime the police have the right to confiscate your clubs.

+1 John.
There are some very pertinent postings on social media at the moment. "Six feet apart or six feet under!" is one that particularly caught my attention.
atb

[John Kavanaugh]

A golfer today has no more business carrying his clubs in his car than a drug dealer his life savings. All it would take would be a few random confiscations of clubs or bicycles to stop the need to allocate valuable resources to parks and golf courses.

[A.G._Crockett]

All of NC goes to a "stay home" order tomorrow afternoon; we've been on essentially the same order in Durham since the middle of last week.
Golf is specifically exempt in both the Durham order and the NC order.  I've seen a variety of measures taken at local courses to make the situation safer for golfers and their employees.


1. Almost all courses have shut down their practice ranges., which seem wise.

2. Most are restricting carts to single riders unless there are two people from the same household playing together.

3. Most, if not all, have done something to the cup to prevent the golfer from needing to touch anything but his or her own golf ball.

4. All, as far as I know, have issued directives to golfers to not only stay an appropriate distance apart, but to NOT touch the flagstick or touch the golf ball or equipment of the people they are playing with.

5. "No cash" seems to be predominant, and the card readers have been moved to the front of the counter for the customer to use, rather than someone behind the counter having to handle my credit card.

6. Some private clubs have gone to a "no guest" policy.  I played yesterday as a guest at a private club in Durham, but I had to settle up with my host on our own; all charges were going to the member's account, with no money or even credit cards changing hands.

7. Plexiglass shields have been put in front of the counter in some places, and lots of places seem to have simply shut down their merchandise operations completely.

8.  A local public course is alternating tee times between walkers and riders; I assume that this is to let family members play together in closer proximity without impacting others.


So yesterday, I arrived at the course, got my Clicgear and clubs and Yeti cup out of the car, hit a few practice putts and chips, and we played as a walking twosome.  I don't think I touched anything that hadn't come there with me the entire time; it felt a LOT safer than going to the grocery store, or buying gas, or any of the other things that are necessary in this Time of the Plague.  It's a LOT easier to stay 6' away on a golf course than on a jogging trail, or even a sidewalk, for that matter.

I will say this, though: there is some resentment among non-golfers toward all of this, and an assumption at least by some that the reason golf is exempt is because of class considerations.  In other words, a magnified version of the "ordinary" land use/water use/chemical use arguments that are made against golf anyway.

Going forward over the next month, it wouldn't surprise me for the rules to eventually be amended to close the courses down; I'd regret that, of course, but I don't think I'd object to it.

[MCirba]

Between our President's spending 80% of his time the past three months playing golf and people acting like we are somehow entitled to go out and play a game instead of sheltering at home in this world crisis the game is not going to come out of this well.
Sorry, but that's reality.

[Erik J. Barzeski]

Between our President's spending 80% of his time the past three months playing golf and people acting like we are somehow entitled to go out and play a game instead of sheltering at home in this world crisis the game is not going to come out of this well.
Sorry, but that's reality.

They’re allowed to go out and walk or jog or whatever. I’ve seen more people walking on the course over the last few days than playing.

I’d request we please keep the politics to a minimum.

[Steve_ Shaffer]

Waiver denied. Oakland Hills plan for members only golf nixed by Michigan Governor:




https://www.freep.com/story/sports/golf/2020/03/28/oakland-hills-country-club-gretchen-whitmer-private-courses-closed/2933980001/

[Peter Flory]

Waiver denied. Oakland Hills plan for members only golf nixed by Michigan Governor:


https://www.freep.com/story/sports/golf/2020/03/28/oakland-hills-country-club-gretchen-whitmer-private-courses-closed/2933980001/

And that is my question for the supers here- in a place like Michigan, what will happen to a golf course if they aren't allowed to tend to the maintenance from now until the end of April for example?  It appears as though MI courses are not allowed to have any employees report to work.  How quickly can a course get to the point of no return?

[Tim Martin]

I will say this, though: there is some resentment among non-golfers toward all of this, and an assumption at least by some that the reason golf is exempt is because of class considerations.  In other words, a magnified version of the "ordinary" land use/water use/chemical use arguments that are made against golf anyway

A.G.-Regardless of where the resentment comes from it’s an optics issue at this point. The vast majority of citizens couldn’t give two shits about golf and most especially at this stage in time. Regardless of where or when you are playing now it just doesn’t look good. Playing golf is not as safe as sheltering at home.

[Ulrich Mayring]

Say what you will about Trump, he has stopped playing:
https://trumpgolfcount.com/displayoutings

[John Kavanaugh]

The thing I don’t understand while I watch New Yorkers dying is how their virus is different than my virus. If it was the same virus wouldn’t we all be sheltering at home now? As you watch loved ones die is there any value in knowing that you did your best? Honestly, I don’t know because I never have.

[A.G._Crockett]

I will say this, though: there is some resentment among non-golfers toward all of this, and an assumption at least by some that the reason golf is exempt is because of class considerations.  In other words, a magnified version of the "ordinary" land use/water use/chemical use arguments that are made against golf anyway

A.G.-Regardless of where the resentment comes from it’s an optics issue at this point. The vast majority of citizens couldn’t give two shits about golf and most especially at this stage in time. Regardless of where or when you are playing now it just doesn’t look good. Playing golf is not as safe as sheltering at home.

Tim, I agree completely with the appearance that it gives when people who don't play golf, but can't go to the gym or a park see golfers playing. 


And, of course NOTHING, golf included, is a safe as sheltering at home, including buying groceries, or going for a walk in the neighborhood, or anything else.  I think the point is, that with proper procedures in place, golf is well toward the safe end of the spectrum IF you are going to allow outside recreation at all.  If the Durham and/or NC rules are changed and golf courses are shut down, it will be much more about the optics than the realities.  I went for a 4 hour walk outside yesterday, using my clubs to hit my golf balls, etc.; I don't think I could have been much safer, really, short of a full quarantine, which is NOT what a 'shelter in place" order is at all.


But again, all of that said, I wouldn't complain if golf gets shut down completely in all of this.  I understand the importance of optics, and golf's optics are bad enough already.

[John Kavanaugh]

In all fairness I did once as my priest that if with all the cruelty and injustice in the world if I should sell all my possessions and dedicate myself to the common good. He informed me that God puts some people in the world to build roads. I suppose God just wants some of you to play golf. Or at least your Governor does. 

[jeffwarne]

Say what you will about Trump, he has stopped playing:
https://trumpgolfcount.com/displayoutings

During his last round on March 8th he said "It's not as bad as the press is making it out to be"

[Bernie Bell]

My Maryland club is closed with all the others, and I'm not jumping in a car to play in Virginia.  I'm fine with that, regardless of whether it scientifically makes much sense; I'll trust Gov Hogan on that.  It is my understanding that our club is allowed to keep up maintenance of the course.   If the game "is not going to come out of this well," which very much remains to be seen, it will have a lot more to do with economic effect of peoples' inability to play for the duration of the lockdown than it will with optics of people playing or trying to play. 

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