[jeffwarne]

Just returned from a 7 day Scotland trip
Thanks to Niall C and Jon Wiggett, Ran and Tom Doak and other GCAers for research

Newburgh on arrival day
Inverallochy-Peterhead
Fraserburgh-Rosehearty(9)
Strathlene-Cullen
Buckpool-Spey Bay
Moray Old-Covesea(9)


Stayed 2 nights each in Peterhead, Cullen and Lossiemouth


Stars of the show? not a ranking
Probably Fraserburgh but I had high expectations going in-which were met-great classic links with lots of elevation change. edit:Holy crap-just looked again at Ran's review and am reminded how good the course is. Too much focus on the game....
Strathlene-one of my new favorites How anyone could play the first 8(with 9 and 10 not being slouches) and not be smitten is beyond me.... Finish is bit exciting with 15, 16, 17 and 18 crammed into a tight piece of land-16 a very cool short 4.Had minimal-low expectations which were greatly exceeded.
Covesea-Shangri-La-the hidden valley of golf (9 holes)
Spey Bay-simply remote, rumply and surprisingly good-probably the place I want to return to the most-super natural and lumpy fairways.Played at 3 pm on a Saturday in 70 degree bright sunshine and never saw another golfer.  Finished dead into blinding sun so hard to see last 5 holes or so.
Cullen-very cool with some mundane thrown in-memorable sea stack blind holes and elevation change. Incredible welcome-a theme at all the clubs.
Peterhead-some very good-great holes and some mundane-finished in a gale the last 5 holes so a bit hard to appreciate.Unique entry to club crossing walking bridge-beautiful first hole(along with many others) along an inlet of the ocean/river. Scene of the slowest play through by a father and his teenage son (in a buggy) searched for both balls on tee shot and second, and played hole out to bitter end-easily 20 minutes to play through-in a cart
Inverallochy-some great mixed with some mundane-excellent views-exceeded expectations-very interesting undulating greens-unexpected.
Moray Old-very good course in a really cool setting-I need to return as I was a bit wiped out to be overly objective-the only course we saw any Mericans or caddies and the result was the longest round of the trip.
Most would rate this very highly and I really liked it(many very good holes but an awful lot of 410-430 yard par 4's) but can't say it had the adventure factor of say Spey Bay or Covesea(reminded me a bit of Dornoch). Hotel room sat right above 18 fairway-stunning view.
Rosehearty-a small 9 holer-very good fun and scenery with several good holes thrown in-check in a pub so needless to say I won that round.
Newburgh-so had been told that the original nine was better but I enjoyed both nines and the variety was great.Rolling front nine with views and flatter back nine(original) more links like.
Buckpool-my only under par round-lots of inland, with some links and seaside thrown in.





Will add some thoughts later
Covesea #8

[Thomas Dai]

Nice summary. I suspected you'd be particularly keen on Covesea.
atb

[David_Tepper]

Jeff -

So near and so far away!

DT

[Tony_Muldoon]

Thanks Jeff,sounds like a brilliant trip.


 I've been angling for a Buda in this area. (likely 3rd in the Queue)


Typically 2 courses with 36, 36 ( 4BBB/Foursomes) and then a singles 18 on the first course.  Keeping driving to a minimum is also desirable. A town big enough to entertain 24 thirsty golfers.


The other courses can be picked up before and after by those who are curious.


So what would you suggest?

[jeffwarne]

Thanks Jeff,sounds like a brilliant trip.


 I've been angling for a Buda in this area. (likely 3rd in the Queue)


Typically 2 courses with 36, 36 ( 4BBB/Foursomes) and then a singles 18 on the first course.  Keeping driving to a minimum is also desirable. A town big enough to entertain 24 thirsty golfers.


The other courses can be picked up before and after by those who are curious.


So what would you suggest?

The simple logical answer is
Staying in Lossiemouth(best town)-several hotel options_I stayed in Golf View Hotel-fabulously situated-a bit run down-my room had a spectacular view
Moray Old, Moray New
followed by Hopeman, Covesea(9)
finishing with Moray Old
or some combination thereof
plenty of suitable pubs lodging


The adventurer in me would go
Stay in Cullen- I rented a house and the house next door is also a rental so there's 8, but also Cullen Bay Hotel and a couple others
 Strathlene, Strathlene (Fri)
Spey Bay, Spey Bay(Sat-wide open tee sheet)
Cullen (Sun)


Alternatively-staying in Fraserburgh
Fraserburg, Fraserburgh
Inverallochy, Inverocally   
Fraserburgh-Rosehearty (9)


Peterhead and Newburgh could also work,Peterhead town was a bit drab-compact area near Cruden Bay and Trump and Aberdeen City

[Peter Pallotta]

Jeff -
This might be hard to answer but I’d be very interested to read your thoughts on this:
You’ve played some of America’s classic-most famous courses and some of their counterparts in GB&I — so you’ve played (with skill) many a very good-to-great golf hole.
How would you compare the very good-to-great golf holes on those courses with the very good-to-great holes on a course like Peterhead?
Are they the same *kind* and *quality* of very good-to-great golf hole? Are they of a different kind and quality? Is ‘very good-to-great’ a relative assessment or an absolute one?
To put it (too) simply: is all greatness created equal?
As I say, maybe hard to answer, but if not please share as extensively as you’d like.
I think there will be something important to learn (at least for me) regarding gca found in your thoughts.
Peter

[Garland Bayley]

Hopeman? It seems from your report that you did not play Hopeman, but yet it pops into your Buda recommendations. From what I've heard, Hopeman would not be one that you would appreciate. If you are going to recommend something you didn't play, why not go with Nairn?

[Jon Wiggett]

Jeff,


glad you enjoyed your trip. Spey Bay and Covesea are both special experiences worth playing. Hope to join up with you next time your in the area.


Jon

[Ally Mcintosh]

An area I’ve played a lot of golf in.


Tony,


Hard call on BUDA, primarily because the North Aberdeenshire / Buchan area is a little more raw than the more gentlemanly Moray. Finding the right small town and accommodation to stay in is almost the first trick.


You could all go and stay in the Pennan Inn, play some beach cricket and relive a bit of Local Hero.


Ally

[Robin_Hiseman]

It's a shame that everyone drives by Duff House Royal and its remarkable Dr. Mac greens. Well worth an inland detour to experience greens straight out of the 1920's.

[David_Tepper]

Yes, Duff House Royal is well worth a visit. A very pretty/scenic spot.

[Jon Wiggett]

Yes, Duff House Royal is well worth a visit. A very pretty/scenic spot.

+2

[jeffwarne]

It's a shame that everyone drives by Duff House Royal and its remarkable Dr. Mac greens. Well worth an inland detour to experience greens straight out of the 1920's.

100% agree.
Literally did drive right by it.(was quite crowded)
Only so much one can squeeze in and if had to do again would sub it in for Buckpool.
Elgin also looked pretty good.
Most fly/drive past this ENTIRE coast, kind've funny I'd catch grief for driving past 1 course-I missed Hopeman and a few others too, but only so much one can play in 6 days.


Garland-I played 11 rounds.They were picked from a logistical geographic standpoint,years of GCA posts, opinions of others I respect, web searching pictures and videos.
Of the 11, every course but one was as expected or better, if not much better, so I'd say I really don't need to play a course to recommend  it in part of a geographically tight potential itinerary that involves 5 rounds.
Secondly Nairn green fees are 180 pounds and 270 for a day ticket(hardly a typical GCA type Buda destination). Hopeman? 35 pounds and 45 for a day ticket.
Thirdly, Nairn is highly unlikely to clear the way for a 24 man event on a weekend, whereas Hopeman probably would be empty and welcoming based upon how empty every course I played was.
Finally, Nairn is 42 minutes from Moray Old, Covesea and Hopeman are just down the road from Moray.


I just looked at Hopeman website-pictures looked fantastic-I've heard it is a bit tight with gorse, but it looks exactly up my ally otherwise.I wish I had seen those pictures before my trip though not sure how I would've fit it in.
What makes you think I would not like it?

[jeffwarne]

Jeff -
This might be hard to answer but I’d be very interested to read your thoughts on this:
You’ve played some of America’s classic-most famous courses and some of their counterparts in GB&I — so you’ve played (with skill) many a very good-to-great golf hole.
How would you compare the very good-to-great golf holes on those courses with the very good-to-great holes on a course like Peterhead?
Are they the same *kind* and *quality* of very good-to-great golf hole? Are they of a different kind and quality? Is ‘very good-to-great’ a relative assessment or an absolute one?
To put it (too) simply: is all greatness created equal?
As I say, maybe hard to answer, but if not please share as extensively as you’d like.
I think there will be something important to learn (at least for me) regarding gca found in your thoughts.
Peter

Peter,
I don't look for great, especially perceived great.
I look for unique, textured and scenic and often stumble upon what I deem to be great. especially when surrounded (I prefer to say protected) by mundane

[Garland Bayley]

...
I just looked at Hopeman website-pictures looked fantastic-I've heard it is a bit tight with gorse, but it looks exactly up my ally otherwise.I wish I had seen those pictures before my trip though not sure how I would've fit it in.
What makes you think I would not like it?

When I investigated playing Hopeman, the word I got is that it used to be recommended, but no longer recommended because they continue to let the gorse squeeze it in. I have seen you complain about courses letting the playing area become too narrow.

I do envy you playing Covesea. I had a choice whether I hit Nairn Dunbar, or Covesea my last day in the area. I mistakenly chose Nairn Dunbar. I remember paying about half of what you say Nairn costs. I believe it was 100 pounds.

[Niall C]

Jeff


Good to hear you had a successful trip and thanks for the name check. Were you travelling with family or was it with a group from the club, and what was everyone else's thoughts ?


Hopeman - it's kind of similar to Buckpool but not nearly as good in my opinion. IIRC it was a nine holer along the cliffs before having 9 inland holes tacked on and they are definitely of a different character and mundane in comparison IMO. Still overall good holiday golf. (Garland - I don't think there has been a conscious choice not to chop back the gorse but instead when you have a one man band type greenkeeping arrangement, it's probably just never been addressed)


I look forward to hearing your further thoughts on Moray Old when you've had the chance to mull it over.


Niall

[Niall C]

It's a shame that everyone drives by Duff House Royal and its remarkable Dr. Mac greens. Well worth an inland detour to experience greens straight out of the 1920's.

Absolutely, all about the greens and the way the fairway bunkering visually blends into the greenside bunkering from the right angle. An object lesson on what to do with a relatively flat bit of land.


Moray has some great holiday golf but in Moray Old, Elgin and Duff House Royal, you have courses that demand to be thought of as more than just holiday golf. I'd probably put them as my top 3 in Moray and in that order, with two out of three being inland courses.


Niall

[Niall C]

Thanks Jeff,sounds like a brilliant trip.


 I've been angling for a Buda in this area. (likely 3rd in the Queue)


Typically 2 courses with 36, 36 ( 4BBB/Foursomes) and then a singles 18 on the first course.  Keeping driving to a minimum is also desirable. A town big enough to entertain 24 thirsty golfers.


The other courses can be picked up before and after by those who are curious.


So what would you suggest?

Tony


We did discuss down at Goswick BUDA and on reflection I'd be happy to organise a Moray BUDA. It would likely be the year after next at the earliest with plans for Kington well on the way for next year. However If I was organising I'd be going for 2 days at Moray Old and 1 day at Elgin. Elgin is only 7 miles away and vies with Duff House as being the second best course in Moray. It has a bit of a heathland/moorland feel to it and would be a contrast to Moray Old's out and out links. I might also try and sneak 9 holes at Covesea somewhere into the format maybe as an optional extra. Covesea is bang next door to Moray so also very convenient.


Accommodation - I'm sure everyone could find digs in Lossiemouth (Moray GC) but there are even more options in Elgin if need be.


Niall

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