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Terry Lavin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« on: June 16, 2019, 09:15:10 PM »
As Gary Woodland grinds on to a near certain US Open victory, is it time to play the time-honored blame game?  As others shriveled under pressure, Woodland was Kansas strong and didn’t betray any sense of diffidence. Rose wobbled. Koepka came up short, but showed a lot of mettle.


But can we at least agree that round four was a soporific slog of a major telecast?  In between drone shots of man-made shoring and the boorish loud mouthed spectators, I was sorely and surely bored. Can’t blame the setup. Mike Davis was not an issue. Joe Buck is more like Joe Schmuck, but it wasn’t television’s fault either.


I love me some Pebble and I’m a USGA guy and I’ve met Woodland who’s a great young man but I won’t need the sleep meds tonight.


Goodnight Irene, the party’s over. The grinder was a championship Killjoy. Good on him!  I just wish we were better entertained.






« Last Edit: June 16, 2019, 09:22:57 PM by Terry Lavin »
Nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people.  H.L. Mencken

Jim Sherma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2019, 09:25:12 PM »
The equipment is too good and slight misses are not penalized the way they used to be. Watched the ‘72 UsOpen video and Jack had the ball bend on misses significantly more than anything that happens today. Agree that this was a very dull event. Woodland’s and Rose’s pace of play certainly made it worse. A hold and a half behind all day.

John McCarthy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2019, 09:29:14 PM »
C'mon the early birdie blitz was fun, Woodland made miles of putts all week and did not give it away.  Good on him. 


But the best thing that happened to me today was going to Chinatown for dumplings. 
The only way of really finding out a man's true character is to play golf with him. In no other walk of life does the cloven hoof so quickly display itself.
 PG Wodehouse

John Kirk

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2019, 09:29:30 PM »
I liked it better than you did.  The tournament was in doubt until Woodland's great pitch shot from the green surface on #17.  Koepka needed to get up and down on #18 as well.  So it wasn't over until about 20 minutes before the tournament ends.

It was hard out there.  The greens were quite firm; after the first 7 holes, players were having a tough time getting it close, especially from 12 through 18.  I think you have to take some simple pleasures away from the day.  Woodland's sand wedge from 97 yards onto #11 green was a Herculean effort.  His 3-wood second shot to the 14th hole was another study in power play.

And he made the long final putt to finish in style.

   
 

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2019, 09:30:14 PM »
Pebble is awesome, and I never tire of seeing it in person or on the tube...

But gotta agree with Terry, this was a snooze-fest galore with a few notable shots like the chip on 17 and 3 wood on 14.  I dozed off for 1/2 hour myself during the 9-11 stretch, but at least he ran one in for a few cheers at the end.

Nice win Gary, good to see a quality/grounded guy winning one!!

John Kirk

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2019, 09:31:13 PM »
I'm also feeling home state pride for California style golf, with old tilted greens.

Seems like you gotta be really strong to win a major now.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2019, 09:35:37 PM by John Kirk »

David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2019, 09:34:55 PM »
Jeez, I must have been watching a different tournament for the past 7 1/2 hours. A lot of spectacular shots and truly gutsy play by Woodland down the stretch. What more do you want?

And Koepka shoots 4 rounds in the 60's! How impressive is that?
« Last Edit: June 16, 2019, 09:38:03 PM by David_Tepper »

Peter Pallotta

Re: Now, Who’s to Blame?
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2019, 09:52:14 PM »
I suppose that's why movie stars have always commanded top dollar, ie because a drama is only as good as the characters who enact it, and characters are only as interesting as the men & women who bring them to life. I don't want to see just any alcoholic washed-up lawyer winning the verdict and finding his redemption, I want to see an aging *Paul Newman* winning the verdict and finding his redemption -- and that while up against not just any quality B-level character actors but against the experienced mastery of James Mason and the stunning, haunting beauty of Charlotte Rampling.
This time the USGA got it right by not insisting on the 'director's cut' and instead letting the stars shine; it isn't their fault that, while we had the Clint Eastwood gunslinger, there was no Lee Van Cleef to be found, or even an Eli Wallace, and the Bond character from the British secret service was more a Roger Moore than a Sean Connery.

« Last Edit: June 16, 2019, 09:54:00 PM by Peter Pallotta »

Greg Chambers

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2019, 09:58:14 PM »
Buck and Azinger are absolutely horrid.  Their participation brought the entire event down several notches, which is a shame.  The course was great, the action was great, everything was great...but the announcers killed it for me.  Azinger should be banned from the booth.
"It's good sportsmanship to not pick up lost golf balls while they are still rolling.”

Terry Lavin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who’s to Blame?
« Reply #9 on: June 16, 2019, 10:02:14 PM »
I suppose that's why movie stars have always commanded top dollar, ie because a drama is only as good as the characters who enact it, and characters are only as interesting as the men & women who bring them to life. I don't want to see just any alcoholic washed-up lawyer winning the verdict and finding his redemption, I want to see an aging *Paul Newman* winning the verdict and finding his redemption -- and that while up against not just any quality B-level character actors but against the experienced mastery of James Mason and the stunning, haunting beauty of Charlotte Rampling.
This time the USGA got it right by not insisting on the 'director's cut' and instead letting the stars shine; it isn't their fault that, while we had the Clint Eastwood gunslinger, there was no Lee Van Cleef to be found, or even an Eli Wallace, and the Bond character from the British secret service was more a Roger Moore than a Sean Connery.


Good copy here, my friend. You incorporated The Verdict and Regarding Henry in scribbling about championship golf. Well did.
Nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people.  H.L. Mencken

Brent Carlson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #10 on: June 16, 2019, 10:03:18 PM »
I hear what you're saying but this tournament had some drama.  Sure there were no lead changes today, but Woodland's play is the reason.  Every time things could have turned he was clutch. 


The one thing I enjoy about the US Open is watching players struggle to remain around par.  It's the only time in the year we see that.  This year the conditions were simply to benign.  Props to Gary Woodland on his victory in an excellent US Open.

Mike_Young

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2019, 10:11:21 PM »
I really think the only way to make a golf telecast interesting is to be able to mic the players and caddies...I think that may happen one day and perhaps put it on delay if needed. It's the best way to keep people's attention....That Buck dude reminds me of the Pee Wee Herman character with those small suits etc.
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

Peter Pallotta

Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2019, 10:17:19 PM »
T -
more 'architecturally speaking', I think that's what Pete Dye understood better than any other living architect, ie that pro golf is *show business*. That's why I can't remember a single Players Championship that was ever dull, even when a Fred Funk or Craig Perks (all due respect) came out on top -- because TPC Sawgrass seemed designed to work & be at its best specifically as *televised entertainment*.

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2019, 10:25:16 PM »
Jeez, I must have been watching a different tournament for the past 7 1/2 hours. A lot of spectacular shots and truly gutsy play by Woodland down the stretch. What more do you want?

And Koepka shoots 4 rounds in the 60's! How impressive is that?


+1
Pebble...how could that be boring?
a nonmanufactured setup for a change
damp cool conditions, minimal wind-no sun
Mother nature(and TaylorMade) was in charge of scoring not Mike Davis
awesome seeing Pebble be puttable rather than plinko of 2010
I though Fox was great and much improved.(but I hated NBC and Miller's take)
Curtis was actually good and perfectly appropriate given Koepka's chase for a 3peat
Azinger was pretty good and gets better every telecast.
Give me more Faxon as well.


Given the USGa's equipment impotence,the only way you get an even par Open is to go back to Erin Hills(which I like), play the 8500 yard tees and have the wind blow
or kill the greens and make putting a plinko fest(been there done that).
Pebble's greens are tilted and sloped, and fascinating small surfaces where angles and ability to control spin and approaches matter.
They were in wonderful condition but by no means easy.


Congrats USGA-that's one in a row
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Bill Shamleffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2019, 10:28:01 PM »

The equipment is too good and slight misses are not penalized the way they used to be. Watched the ‘72 UsOpen video and Jack had the ball bend on misses significantly more than anything that happens today. Agree that this was a very dull event. Woodland’s and Rose’s pace of play certainly made it worse. A hold and a half behind all day.


Agree - 1000%
I also watched the 72 Open last week, and agree, Nicklaus had more poor shots than I expected - And it is the equipment they all played.  The equipment only really rewarded excellent shotmaking.
“The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, but that's the way to bet.”  Damon Runyon

Bernie Bell

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #15 on: June 16, 2019, 10:48:29 PM »
Not entertaining?  Best players in the world, classic course, outcome decided by skill not setup or officials.  Woodland’s shots on 14 and 17 were incredible (and called upon by the design).  Outcome in doubt for hours.  Cmon man.  Except for Buck and Azinger it was great.  “If I could stick a knife in my heart, suicide right on the stage, would it be enough for your teenage lust? Would it help to ease the pain? . . . I know, it’s only rock n roll, but I like it “

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2019, 10:57:01 PM »
Jeez, tough crowd here.  They don't script these things, it's up to the players.  Woodland was rock solid all week, and that shot on 17 today, when he was nursing a slim lead, was every bit as nervy of a shot as Watson holing out there in '82.


It seems like 17 always produces the dramatic moment.  The second shot Brooks hit on 18 was pretty good, too, just too bad he couldn't get up and down to increase the pressure for Woodland on 18.  A two-shot lead with one hole to play at Pebble is money in the bank.

Buck Wolter

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #17 on: June 16, 2019, 11:18:24 PM »
Bad take — Woodland was incredible. The second at 14 has to go down as one of the best ever compared to everybody chasing him.


Everybody in Chicago hates Joe Buck —yawn.
Those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience -- CS Lewis

Robert Mercer Deruntz

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2019, 11:24:30 PM »
Those who did not enjoy today's tournament are like wine snobs who won't drink anything less than a Wine Spectator 98 from a winery other than Rothschild or Screaming Eagle!
The course played great, and there were unbelievable recoveries, great putts, superb course management decisions, and unbelievable levels of composure by players in the final three groups!
Anyone think Watson '82 when the pitch shot was struck on 17!

Mike_Young

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #19 on: June 16, 2019, 11:30:33 PM »
I think it was one of the best US Opens in a while and enjoyed watching it...I think what Terry is saying is how do you make golf telecast more interesting...No one enjoys hearing the announcers go on and on etc...
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #20 on: June 16, 2019, 11:36:38 PM »
What exactly was boring?
Turn the sound off if you must, but the golf was compelling, with drama till the end on 18 for Koepka and 17 for Woodland.(who was battling the demons of 0-7 with 54 hole leads)
If they change 6 to a par 4 for par 70(the usual USGA playbook) nobody's double digits till Woodland's putt drops


Bethpage was the snoozefest
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

mike_beene

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2019, 12:05:59 AM »
The tournament and set up were great. Maybe the problem is that I started watching when it came on at 1 central and saw too much golf before it got important. That shot on 17 should join Nicklas and Watson.

Bill Seitz

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #22 on: June 17, 2019, 12:54:32 AM »
For me, coming into this season, Woodland hadn't done much to distinguish himself from all of the other bomb and gougers cashing checks on tour.  But his performance with Amy Bockerstette in Phoenix this year put him on my radar as someone to root for, even if he was in that position as defending champ and not because of some greater commitment to the cause.  But she pretty clearly had a big impact on him.  I have a 16 month old with Down Syndrome, and one of the first things I did after we got our diagnosis was searching the web for whether I'd ever be able to play golf with him.  Her story and others like it calmed a lot of pretty serious nerves for me.  Good on Gary.


As to the Judge's point, I actually thought today's golf was pretty compelling.  I still miss Johnny, and especially would have loved to hear his take on Koepka's second on 8, and countless other shots throughout the day.  But Woodland really rose to the occasion.  His second on 14 didn't quite put it away in the same manner, but it reminded me a lot of Pavin's fairway wood at Shinnecock.  Just a great shot under pressure with danger lurking. 

Mike Bodo

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #23 on: June 17, 2019, 01:28:16 AM »
My wife and I thought it was a great and entertaining final round. The course setup was both fair and challenging and rewarded good-shot making, as any major championship venue should. Outside of Koepka and Woodland, everyone else faded down the stretch - including those such as Molinari, Shauffele and Scott that that had great early birdie runs to get into contetion. Speaking of Scott, what the heck happened to him on his tee shot on 13 that went WAY out of bounds on the right? He had everything going in the right direction at the time and that mistake and the ensuing double-bogey or bogey he took on that hole let the wind out of his sails.


I kept waiting for the pressure and nerves to get to Woodland, but he was as stout a competitor as they come and I swear didn't miss a putt from within 5' the entire weekend. That's ultimately what ended up separating him from Koepka. Justin Rose putted like a mad-man yesterday, but the magic in that wand left him today and his game was exposed as a result. Rory coming out of the gate and getting double bogey on the first hole was a shocker, as I expected more from him. That said, he's my favorite to win the Open Championship.


Great win and theater provided by Woodland, who was as deserving a champion as they come. This was without question Fox Sports best US Open presentation. Great camera work overall and they did an excellent job of going to where the action was. Sure, Joe Buck and Zinger are annoying to listen to, but Joel Klatt's interviews were really good. I'd personally like to see him up in the 18th tower along with Curtis Strange, as the latter is more entertaining than Paul Azinger. Overall I'd give FOX a solid B this year, up from a C+ last year.


I can't say I'm looking forward to the Open going to Winged Foot next year, as I know the setup will be brutal, not to mention there are too many non-descript holes or holes that look similar to each other on TV. Perhaps if they did an Oakmont and removed half the trees I'd feel differently about it. Torrey Pines will be a good venue two years from now, but the one I'm most excited about attending and watching is when the LA Country Club hosts it. I think they will be a great host and put on a top-notch championship.
"90% of all putts left short are missed." - Yogi Berra

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Now, Who, if Anyone, is to Blame?
« Reply #24 on: June 17, 2019, 01:44:53 AM »
Woodlands shot on 14 lucked out. A little short, no good. A little longer, also no good. Lucky easement of the pressure. Lucky win.

However, all were plot elements of a drama. That's what golf tournaments are, drama, entertainment. Majors high drama.

I enjoyed it. Will he or won't he crack? Looked like he would on 17. We all had been waiting for 17 hadn't we. Great drama hole historically. If he doesn't have 2 stroke advantage, does he hit the same pitch?

Are we going to get rid of 64 degree wedges that facilitate bomb and gouge?
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

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