[John Kavanaugh]

First communion, Baptism, etc., etc....

[Niall C]

Jon - don’t know but they expect next year to be the first sell out in the championship’s history. Whether they continue the following years we’ll have to wait and see.

Ally

When have they ever put a limit on the crowd ? No limit = no sell out. If this is what they are doing for next year then it's another step away from what it was to a more corporate/money orientated extravaganza. I think it's a shame the way things are moving.

Niall

[Niall C]

Sean

I don't know enough about the other majors, at least from a spectators perspective, but I'll give you several reasons why the Open ain't as good as it was;

1 - the change in qualifying away from local/regional qualifying to players all round the world from all sorts of tours getting exemptions for being second in some comp you've never heard of.

2 - the hike in ticket prices over the last few years.

3 - the extortionate prices for food and beverage once in, and as from this year, once you're in you can't leave and come back in unless you buy another ticket.

4 - exhibition tent now just a shop for high end, very expensive logo'd gear.

5 - despite being a major sporting event, poor public transport tie in. Remember the days of special trains laid on for the Open ?

6 - live coverage no longer on the BBC. For sure, the BBC were largely responsible for pushing the R&A down that route but still.

Bah humbug.

Niall

[Ryan Coles]

Sean

I don't know enough about the other majors, at least from a spectators perspective, but I'll give you several reasons why the Open ain't as good as it was;

1 - the change in qualifying away from local/regional qualifying to players all round the world from all sorts of tours getting exemptions for being second in some comp you've never heard of.

2 - the hike in ticket prices over the last few years.

3 - the extortionate prices for food and beverage once in, and as from this year, once you're in you can't leave and come back in unless you buy another ticket.

4 - exhibition tent now just a shop for high end, very expensive logo'd gear.

5 - despite being a major sporting event, poor public transport tie in. Remember the days of special trains laid on for the Open ?

6 - live coverage no longer on the BBC. For sure, the BBC were largely responsible for pushing the R&A down that route but still.

Bah humbug.

Niall

1. It’s the Open, not the British Open.


2. Compares favourably to any other sporting or entertainment event. It’s not over in 2 hours either.


3. Take a packed lunch or peel an orange in your pocket. Security is sensible and reduces congestion at the gates.


4. Imagine that? Merchandise in the merchandise tent. Try Primark in Dundee. Or just go and watch the golf.   


5. Most Opens have seen local infrastructure, new stations etc.


6. You probably did nothing but moan about Allis, Hay and Co.


Nostalgia isn’t what it used to be.

[Garland Bayley]

Most knowledgeable and respectful galleries. An absence of morons shouting mashed potato.


...

Except when they scream in the middle of the backswing.

[Ryan Coles]

Most knowledgeable and respectful galleries. An absence of morons shouting mashed potato.


...

Except when they scream in the middle of the backswing.

You’re not the only American with a passport....


Whoever it was, disappointing.

[Dean Stokes]

That was disgraceful. I hope the culprit was marched out!

[Mark Pearce]

My 22 year old son went up with a bunch of mates on Thursday and Friday.  They camped and absolutely loved.  Already planning a trip to Portrush next year.  Great for golf.

[George Pazin]

Just another ho hum excellent Open, where the focus is on the players and how they surmount the challenges presented, rather than who set up the challenges.


Refreshing, exciting, compelling, and any number of other superlatives.


I'm happy for Molinari and especially happy the actions of one bozo didn't affect the outcome.

[jeffwarne]

Just another ho hum excellent Open, where the focus is on the players and how they surmount the challenges presented, rather than who set up the challenges.


Refreshing, exciting, compelling, and any number of other superlatives.

+1
I might add the course was a star as well which, along with the play and players, should be the story.

[Niall C]

1. It’s the Open, not the British Open. I never referred to the British Open and neither did I compare the Open to the US Open. I was comparing the Open now to how it used to be not so long ago.


2. Compares favourably to any other sporting or entertainment event. It’s not over in 2 hours either. That's possibly correct but how does it compare to how it was before ? Are you happy that in some regards it is a poorer spectating experience ?


3. Take a packed lunch or peel an orange in your pocket. Security is sensible and reduces congestion at the gates. As it happens I did. A choice of fried food with chips wasn't really what I was looking for, not that I wanted to pay those kind of prices. Mind you, I could have done without being berated on the way by "security" for having an umbrella up when it was raining


4. Imagine that? Merchandise in the merchandise tent. Try Primark in Dundee. Or just go and watch the golf. And I'm tempted to suggest that you should stick to selling water and mars bars in your shop but that wouldn't be very constructive. I know I'm not the only one on here who very much enjoyed the old exhibition tent and it was very much part of the Open experience. The merchandise tent by comparison is fairly sterile.   


5. Most Opens have seen local infrastructure, new stations etc. That may be true but I'm struggling to think of any new rail infrastructure that was put in for any of the Scottish venues. In any case, I was referring to the lack of trains and not infrastructure. In the "old" days of not so long ago they ran Open specials at discounted prices and at frequent enough times that you weren't hanging around and fighting to get a seat.


6. You probably did nothing but moan about Allis, Hay and Co. Oh absolutely, Peter Allis's sell by date was a long time ago, and when they brought in the retired footballer as anchor, you could tell they weren't really interested. That's not to say the likes of Ken Brown and Andrew Cotter and the aussie bloke who's name escapes me weren't very good, they were. However the great thing about the BBC was firstly it was a free to view channel and therefore brought in a larger audience but also being on the BBC it inferred the Open a certain status along with Wimbledon, Boat Race, Changing of the Guard etc. When you think that the Open has been on the BBC since Bernard Darwin did the radio reports, and it's an event that has long sold itself on tradition and its history then not being on the BBC is greatly to its detriment.


Nostalgia isn’t what it used to be. sometimes going back is a step forward

[Sean_A]

Niall

Are you sure there weren't special trains for Carnoustie?

I am not one to fuss over tents and food, but I do agree that the Beeb losing the Open is another feather removed from its cap.  The Beeb has lost its way and it isn't free!  I tried the Sky broadcast this year using NowTv on a weekly £12.99 sport package and watched Beeb highlights.  I think the presentation is better than the Beeb's old version, but not by much.  It wouldn't have taken much for the Beeb to do what Sky does and do it better.

Ciao

[Tony_Muldoon]

Other things that make it special.

I love the huge field on Thursday and Friday, playing from Sun up to Sun down (or at least it feels like that). Slowly the cream rises.

A good no of golfers I meet will have played the upcoming course.  It's a brotherhood without any hint of exclusivity.  Their experiences help build the anticipation.

I have played 13 of the 14 course that have held The Open. The one I need to complete my bucket list has just gone to the back of the Queue.

I can't back a ball up on a green, but I can bump and run. On a links, with the wind in the right direction I can hit a ball 300 yards. I once needed only 5 shots to play 6 & 7 at RSG.  It's much easier to relate what I can do and what I see 'them' do, on a links. In this way the link between the players and the rest of us, hasn't changed as much as it has for the other Championships.



 

[Niall C]

Sean

Trains - the website when you booked the tickets referred to Open trains but then directed you to the normal booking system. Leaving Glasgow was OK because you could time your arrival at the station to when the train was due to leave. The downside was the train was full with many standing all the way to Carnoustie. On the way back, and having an open travel ticket, we got to the station and stood in a queue for the best part of an hour. The queue was then let on to the platform 5 mins before the arrival of the train and it became a free for all. All the carriages were packed ie. folk standing in the aisles.

As far as I know everyone got on the train with no one left on the platform and no doubt Scotrail will congratulate themselves on that but when you're charging full fare and you know there will be a crowd its not a very good effort IMO. In terms of cost, the price of the ticket wasn't that far behind that of the golf. I normally drive to the Open but my recollection of previous times I've taken the train is that the cost was a fraction of the cost of the golf.

Re BBC - yes you pay a licence fee, which goes towards paying for the BBC but you need the licence to watch Sky and any other channel. What you don't have to pay with the BBC is a subscription which you do with Sky.

Niall   

[George Pazin]

A good no of golfers I meet will have played the upcoming course.  It's a brotherhood without any hint of exclusivity.  Their experiences help build the anticipation.

Wonderful point.

[Bruce Katona]

Sean



As far as I know everyone got on the train with no one left on the platform and no doubt Scotrail will congratulate themselves on that but when you're charging full fare and you know there will be a crowd its not a very good effort IMO.

Niall

It appears you've never road on NJ Transit to commute into Manhattan in the AM or on one of their trains attempting to get to Baltusrol for an event.  What you describe above would be a roaring public transportation success for NJ Transit.

[PCCraig]

Most knowledgeable and respectful galleries. An absence of morons shouting mashed potato.

Not sure Tiger would have agreed with you yesterday on the 18th tee.


Besides, the Masters wins this one by a mile.

[Niall C]

Sean



As far as I know everyone got on the train with no one left on the platform and no doubt Scotrail will congratulate themselves on that but when you're charging full fare and you know there will be a crowd its not a very good effort IMO.

Niall

It appears you've never road on NJ Transit to commute into Manhattan in the AM or on one of their trains attempting to get to Baltusrol for an event.  What you describe above would be a roaring public transportation success for NJ Transit.

Yes, and I've never been on one of those Japanese trains where they pack them in to get the doors shut, or one of those Indian ones where they have to ride on the roof or hang off the side etc etc but what they do elsewhere wasn't the point, was it ?

Niall

[Kalen Braley]

And its not just the adults fans yelling in Tigers backswing...


Some couple brought their toddler who wouldn't stop crying/jabbering on 17 when a player was trying to chip.  Had to back off at least twice before the kid settled in.


P.S.  Totally agreed that the Masters is the better all around tournament, even if the The Open is number 2.

[Ryan Coles]

Jon - don’t know but they expect next year to be the first sell out in the championship’s history. Whether they continue the following years we’ll have to wait and see.

Ally

When have they ever put a limit on the crowd ? No limit = no sell out. If this is what they are doing for next year then it's another step away from what it was to a more corporate/money orientated extravaganza. I think it's a shame the way things are moving.

Niall

The road they're going? bringing back Hoylake, bringing back Portrush? They should be applauded as it's a good thing.


If they have to put a limit because it's a new venue, then I'd say the Portrush venture is worth forgoing the option of tickets on the gate. Once they've done a year, I suspect next time at Portrush it will revert back to the walk up option, as works fine at the other venues.


Elsewhere in this thread you bemoan the declining spectator experience. Imagine your ire if an unmanageable amount of people turn up? "They should have for-seen this, why didn't they cap the numbers etc etc"


It's sensible decision to have a handle on numbers in the first year and may well have been at the behest of other agencies outside of the R&A.

[Ryan Coles]

1. It’s the Open, not the British Open. I never referred to the British Open and neither did I compare the Open to the US Open. I was comparing the Open now to how it used to be not so long ago.


2. Compares favourably to any other sporting or entertainment event. It’s not over in 2 hours either. That's possibly correct but how does it compare to how it was before ? Are you happy that in some regards it is a poorer spectating experience ?


3. Take a packed lunch or peel an orange in your pocket. Security is sensible and reduces congestion at the gates. As it happens I did. A choice of fried food with chips wasn't really what I was looking for, not that I wanted to pay those kind of prices. Mind you, I could have done without being berated on the way by "security" for having an umbrella up when it was raining


4. Imagine that? Merchandise in the merchandise tent. Try Primark in Dundee. Or just go and watch the golf. And I'm tempted to suggest that you should stick to selling water and mars bars in your shop but that wouldn't be very constructive. I know I'm not the only one on here who very much enjoyed the old exhibition tent and it was very much part of the Open experience. The merchandise tent by comparison is fairly sterile.   


5. Most Opens have seen local infrastructure, new stations etc. That may be true but I'm struggling to think of any new rail infrastructure that was put in for any of the Scottish venues. In any case, I was referring to the lack of trains and not infrastructure. In the "old" days of not so long ago they ran Open specials at discounted prices and at frequent enough times that you weren't hanging around and fighting to get a seat.


6. You probably did nothing but moan about Allis, Hay and Co. Oh absolutely, Peter Allis's sell by date was a long time ago, and when they brought in the retired footballer as anchor, you could tell they weren't really interested. That's not to say the likes of Ken Brown and Andrew Cotter and the aussie bloke who's name escapes me weren't very good, they were. However the great thing about the BBC was firstly it was a free to view channel and therefore brought in a larger audience but also being on the BBC it inferred the Open a certain status along with Wimbledon, Boat Race, Changing of the Guard etc. When you think that the Open has been on the BBC since Bernard Darwin did the radio reports, and it's an event that has long sold itself on tradition and its history then not being on the BBC is greatly to its detriment.


Nostalgia isn’t what it used to be. sometimes going back is a step forward

1. I would prefer to have balance between the strongest possible field, whilst still giving a window for local qualifying. In this respect, I’d say they have it about right. If anything they should make the entry fee much higher as there’s really too many at Regional Qualifying stage. 12 spots for those who didn’t qualify through the other routes, for a Major Championship, strikes a better balance than the Masters and the USPGA.
 
2. Do you honestly expect the Open to operate in its own sphere, isolated from the rest of the sporting and commercial world? How do the costs of staging the event compare to the good ol’ days? Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but it seems to me that lots of investment has gone into the spectating experience. From the campsite, to the improved and additional grandstands, scoring and “fan zones” or whatever they call them. £60 thurs & fri in advance for a ticket that allows you to watch from 6.30am to 9.30pm and Under 16’s go free. This is tremendous value to anyone who lives in 2018. What would the 1998 price be today, adjusted merely for inflation? Of your other discretionary leisure expenditure, what else has remained the same over the past 20 + years?
 
3. These extortionate F&B prices you refer to:
 
£1 Chocolate Bar
£5 Stella
£2.60 Coffee
£1.50 Water
£4.50 Breakfast Roll
£7.50 Hog Roast
£4.00 Soup with a roll
£9-£11 Pizza
£4.50 Sandwich
£5 Baguette


You’re moaning that you can’t walk in and out of a major event to save a couple of quid by trekking to the Tesco Express a mile and half away. You carried your prawn sandwiches all across Scotland to save £15. tops. And they’re the unreasonable ones!?
 
4. Not sure where you get that I’m a PGA Pro from but I’ll take it as a compliment and hope that you hide your contempt well from the lads who work in yours. Perhaps they used the space for people to camp on site to try alleviate precious petals from having to stand up on the train.
 
5. Our Rail system is pretty useless. Thousands of people stand up on the train and suffer overcrowding on a daily basis on their way home from work on our trains. One of the world’s major sporting events comes to a small town in Scotland and you’re surprised that you had to wait around a while and fight for a seat? They put on extra trains and extra carriages. But can you really expect to leave a major sporting event and not have some form of congestion? To suggest that this hasn’t always been the case at most Open’s and indeed every major sporting event, means you either drove or really are looking through rose tinted glasses. And who it is that should subsidise your trip to the Open by offering a discounted ticket?
 
6. Yes, its shame the BBC decided to withdraw and stop covering it.
 
Whether it’s a lame attempt at contrarianism on your part or not, it’s a very strange kind of mentality, probably unique to certain parts of the UK that leads to someone crabbing on such a fine event with such piffling detraction. 

[Ryan Coles]

Most knowledgeable and respectful galleries. An absence of morons shouting mashed potato.

Not sure Tiger would have agreed with you yesterday on the 18th tee.


Besides, the Masters wins this one by a mile.

Ian Woosman would disagree with you, but yes the Masters has much to be admired for.

[Thomas Dai]

From Mark Calcavecchia, Champion Golfer of the Year 1989, The Open, Royal Troon -
"Pretty sure this wouldn’t happen at Augusta. Part of what makes ⁦@TheOpen⁩ the best!"


atb

[Mike_Trenham]

4. And a fairly new concept...https://www.theopen.com/Spectators/Camping

Ciao

A life long friend of mine and three of his sons found a campground 6 miles from Shinnecock Hills and rode bikes back and fourth to the championship, I think they were inspired by The Open.

[Niall C]

Jon - don’t know but they expect next year to be the first sell out in the championship’s history. Whether they continue the following years we’ll have to wait and see.

Ally

When have they ever put a limit on the crowd ? No limit = no sell out. If this is what they are doing for next year then it's another step away from what it was to a more corporate/money orientated extravaganza. I think it's a shame the way things are moving.

Niall

The road they're going? bringing back Hoylake, bringing back Portrush? They should be applauded as it's a good thing. Clearly my comment was about limiting the capacity rather than the venues but then I suspect you knew that  As for Hoylake, I never thought it had gone away and as for Portrush its great they are able to go back to NI and I fervently hope it works well.


If they have to put a limit because it's a new venue, then I'd say the Portrush venture is worth forgoing the option of tickets on the gate. Once they've done a year, I suspect next time at Portrush it will revert back to the walk up option, as works fine at the other venues. Why would the fact the venue is new make any difference ?


Elsewhere in this thread you bemoan the declining spectator experience. Imagine your ire if an unmanageable amount of people turn up? "They should have for-seen this, why didn't they cap the numbers etc etc"Nice of you to project my thinking and put words in my mouth (roll the eyes once again). With regards to the declining spectator experience, I think it is poorer overall for the reasons I outlined although things like the increased number of grandstands is an improvement.


It's sensible decision to have a handle on numbers in the first year and may well have been at the behest of other agencies outside of the R&A.That is absolutely true, it may well have been at the behest of the police. However whether or not it is due to an outside agency, it is still a shame is it not ?

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