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Eric LeFante

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Knollwood Restoration
« on: August 29, 2017, 09:30:07 AM »
http://www.mgagolf.org/news/knollwood_restoration


Good article about the recent work completed. Congratulations to Ian Andrew.


Some of the area's best players will get to see the course on September 5th for the US Mid Amateur qualifier.


As a side note, I read that Knollwood is where Bobby Jones and Clifford Roberts met and realized they had a mutual friend who owned a hotel in Augusta, GA. Anyone know if this is true?

Jim Franklin

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Re: Knollwood Restoration
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2017, 07:57:55 AM »
http://www.mgagolf.org/news/knollwood_restoration


Good article about the recent work completed. Congratulations to Ian Andrew.


Some of the area's best players will get to see the course on September 5th for the US Mid Amateur qualifier.


As a side note, I read that Knollwood is where Bobby Jones and Clifford Roberts met and realized they had a mutual friend who owned a hotel in Augusta, GA. Anyone know if this is true?

I think there is a letter in the clubhouse denoting this. It has been awhile since I have been there, but I thought that was the case.
Mr Hurricane

MCirba

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Re: Knollwood Restoration
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2017, 09:18:53 AM »
Very exciting to see such ambitious work completed by such a historic club.   Congratulations to all involved.
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

corey miller

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Re: Knollwood Restoration
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2017, 02:01:14 PM »



Yes it seems like it has been under renovation/restoration for many years.  I know with finally settling on Ian that the course was in good hands.

V. Kmetz

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Re: Knollwood Restoration
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2017, 06:24:03 PM »
As to the "ANGC" story...


I've forgotten what artifacts the club displays to this effect, but:


1. Roberts was a Knollwood member;  first met Jones in September 1926 at Baltusrol, immediately after the latter's loss to Von Elm in the US Am. Their acquaintance friendship gained momentum because they shared a common friend in Augusta's Bon-Air Hotel manager and an affinity for Augusta as a favorable winter spot.


2. Roberts' 1976 book (The Story of the Augusta National Golf Club) describes a 10 minute conversation, held shortly after Jones' retirement announcement, which was not as great a surprise to his closer circle as it was to the public (but a surprise nonetheless). But the site of the conversation, Knollwood or otherwise, is not mentioned.


3. Charles Price's 1980 book (A Golf Story: Bobby Jones, Augusta National and the Masters Tournament) repeats a "10 minute conversation" but places it in Atlanta.


4. David Owens' 1999 book (The Making of the Masters) devotes great detail to a volume of the precursor moves at the time of ANGC's "idea" founding, but simply repeats the "10 minute conversation" without alluding to where it took place.


Again, I forgotten if there are artifacts, provenance, anecdotes or such that Knollwood displays to this effect, but I suspect there wasn't just one, single organic moment where the ANGC's idea was born. All of the accounts indicate that:


  • Jones wished to have a place of his own away from the limelight where he could enjoy the game privately.
  • Jones was a magnet idol for a wealthy class of business and investment magnates; Roberts was one such man.
  • All concerned shared an existing affinity and key relationships in Augusta; all played Augusta CC regularly...
  • ...and knew of the distressed property nearby, which lay fallow since 1926 when a resort chain's plans for it collapsed
I don't doubt that Knollwood might've been a venue where this was discussed, but as to whether it was on the veranda by the fifth fairway and putting green where Augusta National was hatched (the story I was aware of), I'm not sure that claim can be made with the exclusivity implied.


cheers   vk

"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

V. Kmetz

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Re: Knollwood Restoration
« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2017, 06:54:14 PM »
As to the restoration, I say improvements were sorely needed. I'm eager to check out #4, 8, 10 and 14 in particular.


Though there are several fine, fine holes (3, 6, 9, 15), and good holes that are reported improved (4, 5, 10, 14) I'm still cool to Knollwood as a first rate course in the larger measure.


#1 is an unattractive hole, #2 is revealed as monotonous with repeat play, #7 is one of the more awful holes you'll find on decent course, 12 is penned in by property margins and 13 is one of the stupidest holes still in use. A lot of people like #18 - and I'm not denying it's a challenging, big boys hole, but it more often leaves a sour note on the average players' day (and often proves anti climactic in match play as my 6 beats your 7X) rather than a zest to head back to the first tee.


The property is a rough, talk walk, enormous slopes that you cover up and back. Unfriendly bounces and the kind of sloped turf that (you know) doesn't hold grassing very well. The neighborhood that grew up around and with the club organically now chokes any further innovative design-oxygen, and so there isn't much to be done


I've played, caddied and thought about Knollwood a lot over the years (it shares a bit of its property with the MGA offices, and so sees many tournament hostings and many visits) and the problem for me comes down to this.


It, as so very, very many fundamental first clubs of this founding district did, should have moved off the original Van Etten-designed property. When you think of St Andrews (5 moves north in first 20 years) and Siwanoy (4 moves around Mt. Vernon/Tuckahoe in first 12 years), Fairview (3 moves in first 12 years) and those that moved or reconstituted to their current home in the 1910 - 1925 period (like Century and Old Oaks) and then you take a look at this property, you may share my view.


cheers  vk
"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

Eric LeFante

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Re: Knollwood Restoration
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2017, 09:49:41 PM »
Thank you for your thoughts and all the wonderful information VK

V. Kmetz

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Re: Knollwood Restoration
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2017, 01:48:36 AM »
One other piece EL (and all)


I forget now if ANGC ever actually built the 19th/Bye Hole that was in the first designs, between 9 & 18, but given the fact that Knollwood has one of the few extant ones, it's not a terrible stretch to surmise that the idea for it at ANGC was born at Knollwood.


Perhaps that is the truthful nugget origin from where the larger, tale grows (that Knollwood was the scene of ANGC's first conception). I can understand how such a thing would be repeated and morphed over the decades, especially since Roberts' death.
"The tee shot must first be hit straight and long between a vast bunker on the left which whispers 'slice' in the player's ear, and a wilderness on the right which induces a hurried hook." -

Bill Crane

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Re: Knollwood Restoration
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2017, 01:20:15 PM »
Walked about 8 holes in a cold rain shower with Ian Andrew the third Thursday in Oct. last year - 2016.


While I have not been there before, the work just looked super.   Some very interesting and unusual features on this course.


Ian's work looks great, very well conceived for the site and respectful of the design.  He clearly had a constructive relationship with the contractor's manager. 


Love the Bye hole. 


Need to go play the course !

_________________________________________________________________
( s k a Wm Flynnfan }

Ian Andrew

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Re: Knollwood Restoration New
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2017, 09:58:01 PM »


Knollwood's finishing hole


Click on photos to expand them



Tee

From 16

From Fairway

Right of green

« Last Edit: September 04, 2017, 10:22:42 PM by Ian Andrew »
With every golf development bubble, the end was unexpected and brutal....

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