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Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
After reading the new book on Tom Simpson I was inspired to go to Google Earth and look for some of his courses which I know little or nothing about.


The most interesting looking of them [strictly from aerial photos and trying to puzzle together the routing] are Knole Park and Huddersfield.  Using the search engine, I quickly found a very good tour of Sean's for Knole Park, which I definitely want to see ... but the search engine turns up no mention of Huddersfield at all.


Surely someone here has played it and can report?

Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
I thought Knole Park was one of Abercrombie's very few courses?

Duncan Cheslett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Tom,


Huddersfield appears in Darwin's famous "Golf Courses of the British Isles" ; I am sure you have a copy. He refers to it by its local name of Fixby and credits the design to Herbert Fowler. Darwin visited en route from Ganton to Hollinwell, so Fixby was clearly held in high esteem 100 years ago.


It is a big moorland course in a similar vein to Colt's Manchester GC (Hopwood) on the other side of the hills. A bit like Cavendish on steroids...

... but somehow lacking the charm.


The greens are excellent and very tricky. Unfortunately the best hole is the first - a majestic and very long curving downhill par 4 to a beautifully sited green.

The club's very brief history on their website mentions Fowler and MacKenzie, but not Simpson.


 http://www.huddersfield-golf.co.uk/club_history


Jon Wiggett or Adam Laurence will be able to tell you more. Both are local boys...
« Last Edit: January 04, 2017, 01:44:50 AM by Duncan Cheslett »

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
I thought Knole Park was one of Abercrombie's very few courses?


Simpson and Abercromby were partners [with Herbert Fowler too], and the list I was using was from Simpson's brochure in his later years, which listed Knole Park as part of his firm's work.  As far as I can see, the book makes no connection between Simpson and Knole Park, though it does say he had a role in Cowdray Park, which is sometimes credited to Abercromby and/or Fowler.


Likewise, I got Huddersfield's name from Simpson's brochure, not from the text of the book.  I don't really care which of those guys did what, I just wondered if they were as cool to play as they look from Google Earth!

Sam Krume

  • Karma: +0/-0
I love Knole park. I think it may have overtaken my love of the Add. You can definitely see shades of The Add in its design. The Knole website makes no reference to Simpson but does mention Braid was involved in some capacity.
Tom, next time you're over and want to see Knole, pm me and I'll arrange if need be


Ben Stephens

  • Karma: +0/-0
I thought Knole Park was one of Abercrombie's very few courses?


Simpson and Abercromby were partners [with Herbert Fowler too], and the list I was using was from Simpson's brochure in his later years, which listed Knole Park as part of his firm's work.  As far as I can see, the book makes no connection between Simpson and Knole Park, though it does say he had a role in Cowdray Park, which is sometimes credited to Abercromby and/or Fowler.


Likewise, I got Huddersfield's name from Simpson's brochure, not from the text of the book.  I don't really care which of those guys did what, I just wondered if they were as cool to play as they look from Google Earth!


Tom


The Lawrence Batley Seniors Event on the European Seniors Tour was played at Huddersfield for a decade


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Batley_Seniors


The cross bunkering looks fun!




Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Andrew Mitchell, once of this parish, was a former captain at Fixby, wasn't he?
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
I've played Fixby in the past. I think Duncan's assessment of it is spot on.

Richard Fisher

  • Karma: +0/-0
I played once at Fixby, on a breezy March day in 2006, and enjoyed it quite a lot - although evidently not so much as to make me go back in the intervening decade. The club itself has always been 'one of Yorkshire's premier golf clubs', to use a rather old-fashioned phrase, with a house to match, and there was certainly plenty of challenge, with a couple of special 'winter holes' to mitigate some drainage issues on the lower-lying parts. Certainly worth a detour just as much as many of the less-heralded inland courses regularly mentioned on GCA, with to my eye passing elements of Lindrick and Alwoodley, if emphatically not as good as the latter and probably a couple of notches down from the former.

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
A bit like Cavendish on steroids...

... but somehow lacking the charm.



Steroids do tend to take the edge of one's charm ... but I like the idea of "excellent and very tricky" greens.


Does the first hole hit over the ninth?  Or is that the 10th and 18th?  That was the part of the routing that took me a while to puzzle together, the position of the tee was not immediately obvious, being on the wrong side of another fairway and all.

Tom Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
I once made it as far as the very nice clubhouse at Huddersfield to play in a county match as a junior, unfortunately torrential rain which made it difficult to see past about 100 yards meant I didn't make it onto any turf and I've never had the chance to go back. I would have thought the views from up there would be nice even if the golf wasn't.


Sounds like with Cowdray Park in the mix you've got one from each of Abercromby, Fowler and Simpson. I've been keen to see Cowdray for a while after hearing about it's Simpson heritage and driving past the course and the Cowdray estate a fair few times. If anyone fancies a game there at some point, let me know!!

Jon Wiggett

  • Karma: +0/-0
As mentioned I grew up in the area and played Huddersfield a lot as a Junior and young professional but have not played it since 1996. The club is a very traditional on with an impressive clubhouse and welcoming atmosphere. Dean Stokes who was a junior member at Dewsbury District GC at the same time as me was a member at Huddersfield for a few years so may know more detail than I do.


To answer some of the questions as best I can. As I understand it the course on the whole is a Fowler design though there is a lot of MacKenzie there as well. The first and the ninth do cross over on the respective tee shots.


A summary of the course would be a very strong front nine which plays across a gently sloping, open parkland. Very good use is made of the slope with holes changing direction on all but the 5th and 6th. Plenty of clever cross bunkering which any GCA buff should go and look at. The 4th and 7th greens are not original but still very good.


The back nine is played across more severe ground with the 10th and 11th two very good holes. 12th and 13th are probably the biggest negative being very out of character with the rest of the course the 12th being a hideous par 5 with no redeeming features and the 13th though a spectacular do or die par 3 not much better. These two holes replaced two hole that came after the current 16th and were sold off for housing. I am reliably informed that the lost holes were very good. The rest of the holes are of goo quality the pick of the bunch being the 16th which is a gem of a par 4 that fits its location perfectly.


I would recommend playing there to anybody and were the two duffer holes replaced by good quality then the course would be up there with Moortown, Lindrick or Notts in my book.


Tom,


if you get the chance to visit I would recommend it if only to look at the cross bunkering as it is as good as I have ever seen.




Jon

Robin_Hiseman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Tom

Nice of you to draw attention to one of Yorkshire's less celebrated but high quality courses.

First off. yes, the 1st does play over the 9th fairway. From the 9th green you then have to hare it across the 18th fairway to get to the 10th tee.

Fixby is the local 'posh' club. Such distinctions are quite important when you grow up in such a working class area! I used to play the course in the 80's as a youngster in Junior Opens and the occasional away day from my (very definitely not posh) home club of Ryburn, a 9-holer clamped to the side of a steep hill above Sowerby Bridge.

The entrance is quite grand if I remember it correctly, with a long snaking drive through Rhododendron woods and then across a couple of fairways. It is very reminiscent of the drive into Hollinwell. Fixby is something of an oasis of calm and tranquillity in a busy and frenetic part of the world.

I remember the course as being a clear step up in quality from the other local courses I tended to frequent. It was always a treat to go there, especially for a scruffy young urchin like me. This is a course with a properly thought out strategy and the bold cross bunkering was an entirely new experience for one used to the rudimentary bunkering of neighbouring clubs.

The front nine is the better half, traversing more gentle terrain where the designer has been able to implement more thoughtful bunker arrangements. The back nine is on much more undulating terrain, with strong cross slopes limiting design creativity. The aforementioned 12th is an anomaly, but not as dire as Jon recounts, in my view. It is a very pretty diversion across some tough terrain. To be feared when the ground is dry, as the fairway cambers so dramatically. It's 'Stonehaven-esque' in its cross fall.

I always remember the rollercoaster 18th as being a lot of fun. You play from a low tee up to a high crest and then the fairway tumbles away to the far distant green on this short par 5. A bit like the 18th on the KIng's at Gleneagles in many ways. I was never long enough to get over the hill with my tee shot, but i'm told those who are can get quite close to the green if it is dry.

There's so much good golf to be played near Leeds that it's easy to just fly past Fixby on the M62 without ever thinking about it, but it you combined Fixby with a game at Halifax (Ogden), Crosland Heath, Bingley St. Ives and maybe even Outlane, (the one next to the M62), you're going to have a lot of fun, a study of some significant architecture and an armful of quirk, if that's your thing.

Maybe an area to think about for a future BUDA Cup?
« Last Edit: January 05, 2017, 07:13:35 AM by Robin_Hiseman »
2024: Royal St. David's(x2); Mill Ride(x7); Milford; Notts; JCB(x2), Jameson Links, Druids Glen, Royal Dublin, Portmarnock, Old Head, Addington, Parkstone, Denham, Thurlestone, Dartmouth, Rustic Canyon, LACC (North), MPCC (Shore), Cal Club, San Francisco, Epsom, Casa Serena (CZ), Hayling

Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
The truth is that, although it's in my home town, I really don't know Fixby all that well. It is, as Robin says, the posh club in town, and we weren't really posh enough to hang out there when I was a kid. Huddersfield is an odd town in many ways; you'd never know it now, but there used to be a vast amount of wealth from the textile business in the town (I was told by elderly relatives when I was young that there had been a time when more Rolls-Royces carried Huddersfield registrations than any other area). And I didn't play club matches either, so only got to go there very occasionally.


About ten or fifteen years ago when a greenkeeping catastrophe saw my Dad's club totally lose their greens (I think someone sprayed weedkiller instead of fertiliser on them), Fixby were very good and gave the members a generous level of courtesy, so Dad played there a lot that year and came to know the course well. He was very clear it was the best in the district by some way.


It is quite a grand place. Fixby Hall, the clubhouse, as has been said, is very fancy indeed, and the property is expansive, with long views.


As it happen, I am visiting the club in ten days, on my way to BTME in Harrogate. Howard and William Swan (mostly Will, I understand) have been working there for a year or two, and I'm going to take a look at the works. I'll try to take some pictures and report back.


Adam
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Robin_Hiseman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Huddersfield's railway station exemplifies the town's opulent past. It is a disproportionately classically grand building for its purpose. John Betjemen described it as the most splendid in England.
2024: Royal St. David's(x2); Mill Ride(x7); Milford; Notts; JCB(x2), Jameson Links, Druids Glen, Royal Dublin, Portmarnock, Old Head, Addington, Parkstone, Denham, Thurlestone, Dartmouth, Rustic Canyon, LACC (North), MPCC (Shore), Cal Club, San Francisco, Epsom, Casa Serena (CZ), Hayling

Dean Stokes

  • Karma: +0/-0
Evening gents. I was in fact a member at Fixby for some 15 years before I left town.....if I knew how to post photos I have dozens!!!  My good friend Ben Turner is the Head Greens Keeper and has just overseen a bunker renovation process which was quite substantial.
Gary Player once said he wished he could take those fairways around the world with him the soil and turf was so good!!!
I had a lot of fun there and often too much😀 The club hosts the Yorkshire amateurs and did hold a senior tour event.
I was there last year playing and the change in playability is striking twenty years on from when I left. By that I mean due to the ball and driver!!!! I remember constantly hitting driver and anywhere from 3 wood-5 iron at the first and this time around it was 3 wood, pitching wedge. The equipment sure changed the courses. Shame.
Adam I'm sure Ben would talk to you next week if you're there.
Living The Dream in The Palm Beaches....golfing, yoga-ing, horsing around and working damn it!!!!!!!

Dean Stokes

  • Karma: +0/-0
Duncan's feeling that #1 is the best hole is probably not far off but I think 2,6,9 and 16 get a shout.
The par 3's are also very solid.
I personally think Fixby would be rated much higher but for some of the "hill climbs" that put some off!!!!!!
Living The Dream in The Palm Beaches....golfing, yoga-ing, horsing around and working damn it!!!!!!!

Duncan Cheslett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Duncan's feeling that #1 is the best hole is probably not far off but I think 2,6,9 and 16 get a shout.
The par 3's are also very solid.
I personally think Fixby would be rated much higher but for some of the "hill climbs" that put some off!!!!!!


The first hole made a terrific impression on me on my initial visit to Fixby. After the majestic entrance drive revealing the opulent clubhouse you tee it up on a lovely open heathland like hole with all laid out before you against a backdrop of majestic hardwoods. The first time visitor inevitably gets the feeling that he is at a venue of the highest quality.


Unfortunately - for me at least - the rest of the course never quite lived up to those first impressions. On my second visit a few weeks ago I felt exactly the same.


Having said that, Fixby is a quality course on great land and with some fabulous bunkering. I just don't think that it is as good as the club thinks it is, or indeed it could be.


I don't mind the 12th. It is a "lay of the land" hole curving in a long sweep around the side of a valley with a steeply canted fairway. It is difficult to see what else could have been done with the available terrain. The hole I really don't like is the 10th - an unsatisfactory uphill slog.


The 18th is a fun novelty hole. Once played, never forgotten. A driveable par 5?  http://www.huddersfield-golf.co.uk/hole_18


Fixby is well worth a visit, particularly if combined with its blood-brother less than 30 minutes away - Manchester GC (Hopwood).




http://www.huddersfield-golf.co.uk/


http://www.mangc.co.uk/
« Last Edit: January 06, 2017, 01:41:11 AM by Duncan Cheslett »

Duncan Cheslett

  • Karma: +0/-0
I've played Fixby in the past. I think Duncan's assessment of it is spot on.




I learned from the master...




 ;D ;D ;D


Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
Evening gents. I was in fact a member at Fixby for some 15 years before I left town.....if I knew how to post photos I have dozens!!!  My good friend Ben Turner is the Head Greens Keeper and has just overseen a bunker renovation process which was quite substantial.
Gary Player once said he wished he could take those fairways around the world with him the soil and turf was so good!!!
I had a lot of fun there and often too much😀 The club hosts the Yorkshire amateurs and did hold a senior tour event.
I was there last year playing and the change in playability is striking twenty years on from when I left. By that I mean due to the ball and driver!!!! I remember constantly hitting driver and anywhere from 3 wood-5 iron at the first and this time around it was 3 wood, pitching wedge. The equipment sure changed the courses. Shame.
Adam I'm sure Ben would talk to you next week if you're there.


Ben's a buddy and of course I'm seeing him
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

Dean Stokes

  • Karma: +0/-0
Please someone tell me the easiest way of posting photos!!!!! :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[  I have hundreds if not thousands of golf courses and many of Fixby in all weather conditions which would be great to post.



Living The Dream in The Palm Beaches....golfing, yoga-ing, horsing around and working damn it!!!!!!!

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
So I've never heard of Huddersfield...
and suddenly I see it's directly on the route(if you use your imagination) from Swansea(where I'll be in July) to Kington, to York (where I hope to catch the last day of a soccer(sorry football) recruiting event my son is paricipating in this summer).
Conveniently near Alwoody....


So many courses, so little time
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Jeff,


If you're planning to play in Yorkshire in July and fancy someone to play with get in touch.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Dean Stokes

  • Karma: +0/-0
Jeff,


If you're planning to play in Yorkshire in July and fancy someone to play with get in touch.
I may be there in July....let's get together and tee it. Mark where are you? Yorkshire's a large county!
Living The Dream in The Palm Beaches....golfing, yoga-ing, horsing around and working damn it!!!!!!!

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Dean,


I live in Newcastle but, as from Monday, will be working in Leeds and will have a flat in the city centre.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

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