[Thomas Dai]

I read somewhere recently that Herbert Fowler sometimes rode a horse when routing/laying-out a course.


Any others do this?


What would be the modern equivalent? Helicopter? Drone?


Atb

[Tom_Doak]

I read somewhere recently that Herbert Fowler sometimes rode a horse when routing/laying-out a course.

I believe Mike Strantz used to look at property on horseback ... he was an avid rider.


I had to do this a couple of years ago when we were trying to have a look at a site in the Dominican Republic.  The native vegetation was growing high enough that horseback was the only way to see over it.  We spent about three hours saddled up and I spent the next day and a half being very sore from it!


I would not have gotten much out of the experience had I not already been familiar with the topo maps of the property and had a rough routing already done.  The horse enabled me to get to particular spots and get a feel for what they would look like after clearing. 

[Tim_Weiman]

I seem to recall stories about RTJ falling asleep on horseback during the design of the Cashen course.

[Tom_Doak]

I seem to recall stories about RTJ falling asleep on horseback during the design of the Cashen course.

Seriously?  He was almost eighty at the time.  I really can't picture him on a horse at that point in his life.

[Tim_Weiman]

I seem to recall stories about RTJ falling asleep on horseback during the design of the Cashen course.

Seriously?  He was almost eighty at the time.  I really can't picture him on a horse at that point in his life.

Tom,


Not sure but I think it was Kevin Frost who told me about it and he was probably with RTJ as much as anyone.


My recollection of the conversation is that RTJ was on horseback several times with someone holding and leading the horse for him.


It no longer exists, but back in the 1980s there was a functioning horse stable down by the Cashen River. That is probably where they got the horse.


In the early years of the Cashen - before all the softening - it used to be pretty cool to see people horseback riding on the beach below.


Whatever its architectural merits, the Cashen had and still has an epic feel to it that I will always treasure.

[JC Urbina]

Thomas,


Apache Stronghold used horses to do some of  the clearing lines.


When I first  set out to mark the clearing corridors for Apache Stronghold I could not see through the vegetation and the on site staff did not want me to spend too much  time out there by myself so they asked if I wanted to use a horse to mark the trees with ribbon from the saddle of a horse.  I told them I wasn't dumb enough to climb on one of the horses they brought out since the horse looked like a Clydesdale when they took it out of the trailer.


So they offered two guys to ride horses as I walked what I believed to be the center line of the golf hole, we would shout back and forth and I would use a range finder to shoot distance between the two horses.  We set a simple corridor and then after that land was cleared I went back and touched up the edges now that I could see what the spacing looked like.  The horses were a fantastic idea and allowed me to walk through  some pretty dense vegetation on some of the holes and figure out where I was at Very unique for me, never did that before.

On another note I have a photo of us getting ready to grass the 5th hole at Apache Stronghold and we spotted some stray cattle on that part of the property, So Neal, the Project manager  and I discussed how to rid the golf course of the stray cattle.  I called down to the main office and they sent out a team of ropers to clear the land.


Picture this in your mind,  We are floating out the green getting ready to seed it and the construction crew is doing the final prep for hydro  seeding on the fairway , irrigation heads are running for dust control and off in the distance by the start of the fairway are  some cowboys with horses and cattle being rustled off the fairway prior to us seeding.   

Horses and golf course architecture, Surreal to say the least.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Years ago, Killian and Nugent actually had a routing plan contract for what turned out to be Herb Kohler's first courses there.  He was a rider and we rode the property to survey and see it. As TD says, if you don't ride, you get a pretty sore backside, so it wasn't my favorite day.


Not to mention, Ken made a critical error in leaving to take a phone call from another client.  Herb was pissed, and I could tell our chances of ever getting the final job were over at that moment.  It was quite awkward riding with him after that, as the young assistant.  At least that call led to a different big project.

[MCirba]

My aging memory may be faulty, but didn't George Crump spend some time riding around the land that was to become Pine Valley?

[Thomas Dai]

Some nice tales, I especially like JCU's one from Apache Stronghold. I certainly wouldn't have wanted to wonder around in thorns with rattlesnakes about. Thanks for sharing.
Atb

[Jeff_Brauer]

Thomas,


Saw a few rattlers in East TX last week, far too up close, although they are slowing down now.  Looking back, I have only had one real close snake encounter over 39 years in the biz, stepping on some slow water mocs and getting away with it.


My closest rattler encounter was opening week at Sand Hills. Dana Fry sent me up the bunker bank on 18 to snap a photo of his shot, and darn near sat on one, just a foot to the left.  He rattled, looked at me, but didn't ever strike.


Should be a separate thread, but I wonder what injuries architects have suffered in the field.  Snakes are out there, a la the Tillie photo (among others) of him holding a 5 ft dead rattler......There was Frank Duane and encephalitis, but in all the years I have only heard a few stories.  Paul Cowley did get a snake bite a few years back.

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