[Drew Groeger]

I just ran across this on their website (http://www.gullanegolfclub.com/sites/default/files/Gullane2016-08-23-8thand9th.pdf opens a pdf, fyi) so it may be old news to locals. Was hoping to play it next week when I'm over there but they are disk seeding both No. 1 and No. 2 courses Monday and Tuesday so I'm on the fence.

At any rate, some interesting, subtle changes are proposed, but I'm confused about no. 8 as a whole: their website shows it as a dogleg right, calls it "newly improved" and points out the "Old Green" on the left (http://www.gullanegolfclub.com/courses/course-no-1 then click on the 8th hole) and Google Maps still shows the hole this way. Was this changed for the Scottish Open last year? Or for some other reason? Just curious mostly.

[David McIntosh]

Drew,

Thanks for posting this - I wasn't aware that plans were under way/consideration to make changes on the 8th and 9th. Funnily enough, I was speaking to a Gullane member last week about the 8th green and how difficult it was to hold so the proposed changes would appear to be a positive step as I otherwise like the hole.

The sandy area in front of the 9th green would be a bit out of place as there isn't anything else remotely like that on any of the other three courses at Gullane. My biggest issue with that hole however is when they put the pin at the front of the green - it's a downhill tee shot to a front to back sloping green with quite a steep elevation change. This all adds to it being impossible to get anywhere near a front flag as even running a tee shot in will invariably lead to the ball trickling down to the bottom (back) of the green. I should add that I think the green works fine for back or even middle flags.

I'm not actually sure when the new green was introduced on the 8th. I only played Gullane #1 for the first time this year and didn't notice any remnants of the old green and surrounding bunkers - will keep my eyes peeled for them next time I play there. I'd hazard a guess that the reason for moving to the new green on the 8th was to improve both the shape of the hole and the transition from the 8th green to 9th tee as the tee box behind the 8th green towards the cliff edge tends to be used for the daily and medal tees.

[Matthew Essig]

When my father and I played, I believe, July 2014, we played and enjoyed the "new" 8th. I am pretty sure I remember seeing the old green, but I could be remembering wrong.

[Marty Bonnar]

I'm not 100% sure, but that looks to me like a proposal to remodel the NEW eighth green?
Simon!?!?!?
I like the idea of opening up the 9th 'prairie', but that look is going to be very out of place at Gullane.
Cheers
F.

[MCirba]

Love Gullane #1.  Not a fan of the proposed changes as I understand them from the link above.

[Jon Wiggett]

I can understand most of the changes to the 8th except altering the drop off at the back as it is one of the few skyline greens on the course and the danger is the proposed mounding will just look twee. As to the 9th, I think the sand waste bunker will look out of character and will grow over in the end so why not do the obvious thing and just mow the grass down and if necessary, raise the tee the needed two to three feet need to give the desired view.


Jon

[Ian Galbraith]

I had the pleasure of marshalling at that hole during the Scottish Open in 2015. When conditions are dry and running holding the green is hard and one is forced to land short and judge the run on. As the hole runs uphill  for most players it is a difficult shot with a longish iron and getting it just right is difficult. Hence running through to the swale behind the green is pretty common. Watching the pro's play it seems to me that a good, well judged shots were rewarded and if they got greedy and chased the pin chances were they'd pay the price.


I can understand why the members get frustrated with it (as we do with the green at 16 down the road in North Berwick) but I'll be sorry to see them change it as it is tough but fair. Adding a berm at the back to prevent the roll through will take the  mouth-drying threat out of the second shot.


Cleaning up the view of the  9th though I'm all for, they can enhance the visuals of the hole without detracting from the play of the hole at all. Simply cutting down the grass and/or building up the tee would work well.

[MCirba]

I agree with you completely Ian.

[Niall C]

I can understand most of the changes to the 8th except altering the drop off at the back as it is one of the few skyline greens on the course and the danger is the proposed mounding will just look twee. As to the 9th, I think the sand waste bunker will look out of character and will grow over in the end so why not do the obvious thing and just mow the grass down and if necessary, raise the tee the needed two to three feet need to give the desired view.


Jon

Jon

I tend to agree with you. It's also goes a bit against the grain for MacKenzie & Ebert considering there change to Hawklaw at Cruden Bay and their proposals for the 7th at Dornoch.

Ian

I'm all in favour of a hole that makes players want to land short and bounce/run on. Fairness has nothing to do with it 

Niall

[Michael Graham]

From Mackenzie & Ebert's Twitter page. The new look par 3 9th on Gullane 1.





It's hard to tell from one small photo but the changes to the 9th do look rather incongruous. Surely they could have just trimmed back the grasses between tee and green rather than such a drastic change. I'm hoping to play the course next week, will take a few photos of the changes if I do.

[Jon Wiggett]

Large expanses of waste sand and frilly edged bunkers, oh dear   Still it is all the fashion these days it seems.

[MCirba]

Why mess with paradise?

[Ian Galbraith]

yuk, what a mess that looks - surely that can't be the final finished state!

[David_Tepper]

Open areas of sand seem to be now in vogue. They stripping out areas of turf to expose areas of sand on the New at St. Andrews.

http://blog.standrews.com/2016/10/24/open-sand-areas-restored-on-the-new-course/

[Clyde Johnson]

Open areas of sand seem to be now in vogue. They stripping out areas of turf to expose areas of sand on the New at St. Andrews.

http://blog.standrews.com/2016/10/24/open-sand-areas-restored-on-the-new-course/

They've done it on the Old too, on the carry to six fairway.

[Niall C]

I can understand why some think it incongruous but having had sandy waste areas replace swathes of gorse in the last couple of years at my home course, I'm for it. It takes a bit of getting used to but even those members that didn't like it at first are coming round to the playability aspects which are so much better.


Niall

[James Boon]

I think part of this is a fashionable aestehtic, but another part is the ecological benefit. From the St Andrews blog in David's post:

"The idea of open sand areas was first suggested back in 2005 in a report written by our ecological advisor Bob Taylor from the Sports Turf Research Institute. An extensive document was produced on how to best manage our increasing population of gorse. Taylor suggested tackling the gorse in several different ways, one of which was to remove the plant in its entirety and any organic material to leave the area open as bare sand. This habitat would be beneficial to invertebrates and the food chain they support."

Encouraged by the Bob Taylor mentioned above who visited us recently at Notts GC as part of our GEO Certification, we are experimenting with similar things in a few areas, though its more a case of leaving bare sand when we've removed gorse, rather than crafting the frilly edges as on some examples. Will let you know how things go.

Cheers,

James

[Jon Wiggett]

James,


I can understand this when removing gorse though be aware it will regrow and clubs need to have a regular yearly plan when dealing with gorse rather than waiting till it gets to be a problem. Gullane however is nothing to do with gorse management and is purely aesthetically driven and much like the colourful fashion of the 70's some may think it looks good in the right context but it is rarely the way to go.


Jon

[Tim Gallant]

James,


I can understand this when removing gorse though be aware it will regrow and clubs need to have a regular yearly plan when dealing with gorse rather than waiting till it gets to be a problem. Gullane however is nothing to do with gorse management and is purely aesthetically driven and much like the colourful fashion of the 70's some may think it looks good in the right context but it is rarely the way to go.


Jon

Jon,


Well said. I don't think the look is all that bad, and if you told me this was at Castle Stuart, I would see how it fits in. However, at Gullane, at least at the moment, it seems highly incongruent with the rest of the aesthetics of the course.


As for the changes at the green, I am excited to see how they have updated the complex.

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