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Tom Allen

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Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« on: October 18, 2014, 11:01:00 PM »
Coldstream is a 1951 Dick Wilson design, located in Cincinnati, Ohio.  From the blues, it plays to 6,644 yards, with a slope of 134 and a 72.8 rating.  It can stretch to 7,0821 yards from the back (gold) tees.  It is always a treat to play this private course.  You will be glad to know that it plays firm and fast.  I'm not sure my photos capture this, but I was quite pleased to see it play this way.

No. 1, par four, 321 yards from the blues.  A short, slightly uphill dogleg right.  Several bunkers guard against cutting the dogleg too sharply, and a series of trees block those who go long and do not work it left to right.  As with many holes on this course, trees are a factor if you leave the fairway on either side.  The main challenge here is the sloping (front to back, and slightly left to right) and heavily bunkered green.  The second shot is from inside the dogleg, showing the extensive bunkering on this hole, and overhanging trees if you venture too far right.






Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2014, 11:12:40 PM »
No. 2.  201 yards from Blue.  A beautiful and imposing downhill par three.  Pond front and left, and bunkers left, front left, back left, and right.  Green is relatively flat, with only a mild slope back to front.  I'm happy to just get it on the green.   


Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2014, 11:23:15 PM »
No. 3, 388 yards, par four.  A tight driving hole, with a valley (just a deep depression) running across the fairway.  Out of bounds right, trees left. 



View from the right side, near the landing area, showing the slightly elevated green and deep bunkers on the right.  Bunkers left as well. 


Close-up of left bunker, showing some of the detail typical of the bunkers here.  Beautiful sand, and fairly intricate designs.







Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2014, 11:30:58 PM »
No. 4.  Par 5, 512 from the blues.  A lovely hole, especially as you approach the green.  Slight bending double dogleg left, where a draw would be your friend.  Then do it again, and you have a nice look at the green.  Bunkers and trees protect both the inside and the outside of the dogleg here.  Requires a straight drive to avoid being blocked or in trouble here.  You can tell a little of the firm and fast from this vantage; a slight browning of the fairway.



From the landing zone.  A draw is again the preferred shape here, if you can pull it off.  Bunkers left and right start about 50 yards short of the ivery deep green, for those of you who want to go for it in two.  Mounds right also protect the green.


Close-up of green from right side.



Jason Thurman

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2014, 12:02:03 AM »
I love the aesthetics of Wilson's bunkering style. It's a shame that it looks like so many of them are smothered by trees. How claustrophobic does the course feel in person? Would it be improved if some longer views were opened up?
"There will always be haters. That’s just the way it is. Hating dudes marry hating women and have hating ass kids." - Evan Turner

Some of y'all have never been called out in bold green font and it really shows.

David Whitmer

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2014, 08:14:06 AM »
I love the aesthetics of Wilson's bunkering style. It's a shame that it looks like so many of them are smothered by trees. How claustrophobic does the course feel in person? Would it be improved if some longer views were opened up?

Jason,

I wouldn't say the course feels claustrophobic. The property has a ton of trees, but I don't think any of them are poorly placed. They're not overhanging the fairways or anything like that. If you're facing a shot where you have to negotiate a tree, you've hit a poor shot to be in that position.

That being said, the property is expansive, and I do wish they would get rid of a bunch of trees to open up some vistas. Especially on the back nine; you would be able to stand on the putting green and see the entire back nine if they wanted. Instead, you see trees, trees, and more trees.

Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2014, 09:36:10 PM »
No. 5.  176 par three.  Short is water, long is bunkers.  One of the most severe greens here.  Very heavily back to front.  If you are above the hole, forget it.  No real bail out area here.  Just hit and hope that you end up below the hole.  Front pins are simply brutal.



From the right side, short:



David Whitmer

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2014, 09:48:37 AM »
Tom's right about the fifth hole; one of the most severe back-to-front greens I've ever seen. There have been times where I was above the hole, and I hit it as gently as I could, and it still went 10 or so feet by. Missing short of the green (but over the pond) is preferable to being on the green and above or even flagstick-high. If your opponent is above the hole and more than a foot away from the cup, make him putt it!

JLahrman

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2014, 10:33:41 AM »
I haven't played Coldstream in almost 20 years, but the back to front slope of the 5th green is one feature that still really sticks out in my mind.

The course is heavily treed but I don't remember them being a huge obstacle to play (though again, it's been 20 years and trees do tend to grow). I agree with David though, removing some trees would really open up the views of the course.

Thanks for the pictures Tom, keep em coming!

What does anyone else think about the par 3s at Coldstream? They all seem to be rather similar - all over water (though the 14th is more on the side of the green than short). 2 and 11 are about the same length, and 5 and 14 are also about the same length. Plus I just realized they occur at the identical points on each side. They should seem repetitive but I don't really feel like they are.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2014, 10:41:41 AM by JLahrman »

Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2014, 10:37:26 AM »
Will work on some more tonight.  And I agree with both of you--what a vista you would see from the putting green if some of the trees were cleared out!

I can't wait to get to 16; that green would would blow a lot of people away.  (It has blown a few of my scores away, including the round when these photos were taken.  I aimed long to avoid the death traps, and ended up in the woods--ball hit the downslope behind the green and shot it into the woods.)

Jason Thurman

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #10 on: October 20, 2014, 01:21:38 PM »
Claustrophobic probably wasn't the right word, but it sure does look cluttered. Take this shot for instance:



You have utterly gorgeous bunkering that's completely covered up and hemmed in by trees. Instead of having a hole that would look unlike anything else in the area with those blinding flash-faced bunkers, you instead have a tree-lined hole that looks like it could be on any course in Cincinnati.

It's obvious from this photo that 5 sits in a nice setting, but wouldn't have a ton more panache if you got rid of all the trees surrounding it?



And I agree that this bunker looks wonderfully intricate, but it just feels out of place with those conifers so close behind it.



I don't usually throw fits about tree clearing, but this just seems like a course that has obviously been overplanted. It looks like it could be something really special and certainly unique to the area if we don't count NCR in Dayton, but the tree management is just completely incongruous with the overall shaping. Big, flash-faced bunkers demand wide corridors to stay in scale. They're sharp features and biomechanically, they draw the eye and make it move across the land. For that effect to really work, though, the landscape needs to accommodate and encourage that eye movement. Coldstream looks like way too many of its most eye-catching bunkers are covered up by trees. While I love big specimen trees on a course as much as anyone, I hate to see them neuter what should otherwise be really commanding, beautiful, and intimidating bunkers and zap a lot of the character out of the course in the process.
"There will always be haters. That’s just the way it is. Hating dudes marry hating women and have hating ass kids." - Evan Turner

Some of y'all have never been called out in bold green font and it really shows.

Matthew Sander

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2014, 01:31:21 PM »
Jason,

In your first picture, even removing just the 3-5 trees closest too the left hand side of tye fairway would make an enormous difference. That would bring all of the bunkers into view and make the view more aesthetically pleasing. I think it would also draw the player's eye more toward the straight line view of the green and might encourage an over aggressive shot, even if it is just a lay up. As it is now, the player is guided by the trees up the right hand side and some decision making is removed from the equation.

David Whitmer

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2014, 01:49:48 PM »
Cluttered is a better word, and I agree with its use here. The property as a whole is cluttered with trees. Again, a tree really won't be in your way if you've hit a decent shot, but that doesn't mean they should all be there. I don't mind the trees directly behind the fifth green, as they hide Asbury Road and what I consider to be a fairly ugly clubhouse.  But removing a great majority of the trees would open up considerably more views of, as Jason and Matthew mentioned, all the bunkers, indirect lines of play that may tempt golfers, and in general nice views of the golf course.

Richard Hetzel

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2014, 02:33:33 PM »
I have played Coldstream CC on several occasions. It DOES have a LOT of trees, but it is not overly "tight" as fair as tree lined tight goes. Wayward drives will be in the trees, and I too think they could thin the herd a bit. The greens are pretty slick and be really fast as well. One of my former students was a caddy there and he would take me every Monday in exchange for $7 worth of Wendys. What a deal.
Best Played So Far This Season:
Crystal Downs CC (MI), The Bridge (NY), Canterbury GC (OH), Lakota Links (CO), Montauk Downs (NY), Sedge Valley (WI)

JLahrman

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #14 on: October 20, 2014, 02:38:56 PM »
I don't usually throw fits about tree clearing, but this just seems like a course that has obviously been overplanted. It looks like it could be something really special and certainly unique to the area if we don't count NCR in Dayton, but the tree management is just completely incongruous with the overall shaping. Big, flash-faced bunkers demand wide corridors to stay in scale. They're sharp features and biomechanically, they draw the eye and make it move across the land. For that effect to really work, though, the landscape needs to accommodate and encourage that eye movement. Coldstream looks like way too many of its most eye-catching bunkers are covered up by trees. While I love big specimen trees on a course as much as anyone, I hate to see them neuter what should otherwise be really commanding, beautiful, and intimidating bunkers and zap a lot of the character out of the course in the process.

Those are fair points. Most of us would agree that courses look tighter in pictures than they do in person, but based on these pictures there are a lot of trees obscuring potentially valuable lines of sight.

Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2015, 09:11:22 PM »
Sorry for the delay in the getting the rest of these photos posted.  But here they are:

No. 6.  A medium length. slighly uphill par four.  Tight driving hole, very nice green.  Fairway bunker on the left can be a hazard, but it was not today.  Decent tee shot leaves about a 7 iron in.  Sorry but I do not have a shot from the tee.  Here is a shot from the left side of the fairway.  



« Last Edit: February 14, 2015, 10:06:22 PM by Tom Allen »

Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2015, 09:15:46 PM »
No. 7.  My favorite hole on the course.  A monstrous slightly downhill par four.  Plays about 475.  I parred it for the first time this round.  It take a healthy, straight blast and an accurate second shot for a chance at par.  A giant green tends to favor three putts, because you are often happy to just be on.



From the left side approach area:


Shot of the green, again from the left:

Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2015, 09:19:22 PM »
No. 8.  530 yard dogleg left par five. If you bite off too much, you lose your shot to the green because of the trees.  The right rough is no bargain either.

From the tee:


Typical landing area:


Uphill to the green:





Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2015, 09:24:28 PM »
No. 9.  A very interesting, short, straight, downhill par four.  397 yards.  No much more than hybrid is often needed off the tee, because of the roll you will get.  And you better be straight, becuase trees or overhanging limbs will often block the approach if you get offlline.


No shot from the tee, but here is a shot from short in the fairway:


As you get closer, the sand surrounding the green becomes apparent:


Until you finally see that anything but green is dead.  Long is a chip shot under branches to a green sloping fast away from you, and anything else is sand (6 bunkers!):


Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2015, 09:27:55 PM »
Mo. 10 is a 568 yard double dogleg.  First left, then right. Downhill to a generous landing area that I still seem to miss and end up in the trees right.

From the left side of the fairway, about 350 out.


From the middle of the fairway, about 180-200 out:


From about 100, you see the narrow sliver of a green, and again lots of sand to catch an approach long or short.



Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2015, 09:29:09 PM »
No 11 is a short par three, with a full carry over water.  From the back one tour on the internet calls it 234 yards, but we play it much shorter (7 iron maybe?; I'll have to pull the card and verify later).  Bunkers left and right, and water short.  Slightly short and right gives you a decent pitch at a front pin:


« Last Edit: February 14, 2015, 09:30:49 PM by Tom Allen »

Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2015, 09:34:15 PM »
No. 12 is a flattish but long par four (457 tips).  Bunkers protect the inside of the dogleg and the bailout right as well:


From the fairway:


From about 98 out, in the left rough:


Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2015, 09:37:54 PM »
No. 13 is a pretty par four, with a lake view but it doesn't really come into play. Tress left and right do, though. Downhill again, so you get a nice boost on the tee shot.  Careful of the bunkers around the green--they can be deep.

From the right rough:

Zoomed in on the green:




Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2015, 09:44:13 PM »
No 14.  A short-sedium par three, with a green titled about 45 degrees to the left. ;)  Well, it seems that way.  A large, receptive green awaits, and then runs your balls off the back or off the left side.  A great hole!
 

Tom Allen

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Re: Coldstream (Cincinnati, Ohio) photo tour
« Reply #24 on: February 14, 2015, 09:46:42 PM »
No. 15.  A shorter, scorable par four, with a nice rolling, hilly fairway.  Trees far left, with some trees on ther right that are in play.  Another 2 hybrid or three wood hole.  Fairly small green (at least in the front), with some very nice bunkering).

From the fairway:





From about 125 out, right of the fairway:



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