[Mike_Young]

Several years ago a club underwent a renovation and ever since the elder members have complained of the bunkers.  I think it is fair to say that in the last 20 years creating deeper bunkers has been a given in both renovation and new construction.  There is an art to creating a good, functional, strategic shallow bunker yet we don't see them nearly enough because they don't photograph as well and IMHO there is mental block that tells many of us the design cannot be that tough if the bunkers are not deep.  I think it has also hindered play and maintenance in many cases.  Now I'm not saying no deep bunkers on a course but am saying there need to be more shallow bunkers with good ingress and egress for older players. 
Any examples of good shallow bunkers? 

[John Kirk]

Nice recent example observed, 3rd hole at Streamsong Blue.  Cool bunker, right in the safety zone for drives.  170-180 yards from the green, slightly uphill cant with going left the trouble zone, I thought that was really nice.

[Tom_Doak]

Nice recent example observed, 3rd hole at Streamsong Blue.  Cool bunker, right in the safety zone for drives.  170-180 yards from the green, slightly uphill cant with going left the trouble zone, I thought that was really nice.

John:

We actually had to go back and make that bunker a bit shallower by adding sand, because with the high water table last summer it was wet in the bottom.  But thanks for assuming I'd done the right thing! 

(There are quite a few bunkers at Streamsong that are fairly shallow.  The bunker in the middle of the 8th fairway is another; I was really pleased to hit the green from it with a 5-iron in a practice round last fall.  But there are some deep ones, too.)

[Jim Sherma]

The shallow greenside bunker is interesting in that it represents choices and potential uncertainty. A deep bunker usually only has one play and you either execute or not. The shallow bunker can allow for various shots depending on the situation and that can be very interesting.

Does this represent somewhat of a a rethink along the lines of deep greenside rough versus short grass and runoff areas?

[Connor Dougherty]

I had a thread earlier this year that debated the values of shallow and deep bunkers in the fairway. The general consensus seemed to be that it depended on the situation.

At the 9th hole at Pasatiempo, there is a fantastic shallow fairway bunker. Many times I have tried to hit 3 wood out of it, and sometimes it works, sometimes it fails miserably. It certainly does not lose strategic value for me, and I can imagine that for the older members/guests/high handicappers it is a much more pleasurable experience

[Colin Sheehan]

I always liked the long, lean "bottle" bunker splitting the third fairway at the Country Club of Fairfield. When I was a junior, it was in play for many years, but at some point it become something I could carry by thirty yards or more. Yet I remember playing from it and always enjoying the challenge to get on the green from there.

I agree that variety is key. There's a really good bunker about 40 yards short of the third green at Castle Stuart. During construction, Mark Parsinen was very careful the height of the riveting was just right: so it was not too deep that the only play was to blast it out 10 paces. Instead, by lowering the height, it gives people the chance to play for the green with an excellent shot. Of course, it also comes with far more danger...like going long into the Moray Firth.

[Ed Oden]

Mike, there are some top notch shallow fairway bunkers at Charlotte Country Club.  They are well placed and drive strategy from the tee.  But the reason why they work so well, in my opinion, is that the greens at Charlotte are so severe.  Approach shots must be very precise to find the correct portion of the putting surface.  So it only takes the slightest mishit from the sand to be toast.  And, since most of the shallow bunkers at Charlotte are inside 140 yards, you are usually hitting a short enough iron where success is driven more by getting a quality strike than getting the ball up quickly.  Personally, I've always thought it was tougher to hit a full wedge out of a fairway bunker than a full 5 iron.

[Sean_A]

Mike

There may be an art to building shallow bunkers, but I would counter with there is an art to building mounds and hollows.  Why be pre-occupied with sand when there are other ways to create variety without building insipid bunkers?  I could possibly see an argument for their use on sandy sites and definitely where waste areas are concerned (though I am not a big fan of waste areas), but in general, not a big fan of the concept.  Most courses can be very well bunkered with 30-40 bunkers if placed properly and that should leave little room for fluffy, shallow sand boxes that don't look good anyway.  Of course, there are always exceptions to be made, but....

Ciao

[David_Elvins]

Mike,

When it comes to Art, this is my favorite.  Unfortunately i only have the view looking back to the tee on this computer.  I think the way it is cut to sort of replicate a natural coastal cliff formation is pretty cool.  as is the tie-in with the native grasses. 

It is the 8th at Peninsula South. 



The bunkers on the 12th at Peninsula North are also good. 

[Frank Pont]

In general my experience is that most bunkers at classic courses nowadays are much shallower than they used to be. We often find the old bunkersand one foot down when excavating bunkers in the process of restoring them. Reason is that many bunkers are topped up every year with san by the greenkeeping staff, causing the bottom to come up and become flatter.

In general I like shallow fairway bunkers, with once in a while deeper more penal bunkers to make the players think of the tee.

Around he green I like the deeper bunkers, although there are one or two situations where a shallow bunker next to a green is very effective. A good example is a shallow bunker on the high side of a green, I find it mentally harder to play a high soft shot from a shallow bunker than from a deep bunker. Another permutations of this is a shallow bunker on one side of a green where the other side of the green is a ravine. Tandrdige has this in one or two places. Scary!

[Mike_Young]

Nice recent example observed, 3rd hole at Streamsong Blue.  Cool bunker, right in the safety zone for drives.  170-180 yards from the green, slightly uphill cant with going left the trouble zone, I thought that was really nice.

John:

We actually had to go back and make that bunker a bit shallower by adding sand, because with the high water table last summer it was wet in the bottom.  But thanks for assuming I'd done the right thing! 

(There are quite a few bunkers at Streamsong that are fairly shallow.  The bunker in the middle of the 8th fairway is another; I was really pleased to hit the green from it with a 5-iron in a practice round last fall.  But there are some deep ones, too.)

Streamsong is actually what made me think about the topic.  There were many good shallow bunkers there.  And , just for clarification I may be decribing "shallow" in a different way than some.  I'm not describing the front lip height as much as depth of bunker related to natural grade.

[Jeff_Mingay]

Mike,

We built these bunkers short-left of the green at the par 5 7th hole at The Oakville Golf Club last year. I purposely kept them shallow to entice more golfers into thinking it's an 'easy' shot to the green from here. Psychologically, I think this makes these bunkers more difficult. And, it's more frustrating to some golfers who don't successfully recover from them, figuring they should have because they're so shallow.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Mike,

Ironic isn't it?  This is one of the deepest topics broached here in YEARS!

[Tim Gavrich]

Growing up in Connecticut, I played a number of courses designed by Geoffrey Cornish. I don't ever recall encountering a very deep bunker on one of his courses unless it was benched into a hill set well below the green. The shallowness always gave the impression that his bunkers were pretty big (and oftentimes they were).

[Carl Nichols]

Growing up in Connecticut, I played a number of courses designed by Geoffrey Cornish. I don't ever recall encountering a very deep bunker on one of his courses unless it was benched into a hill set well below the green. The shallowness always gave the impression that his bunkers were pretty big (and oftentimes they were).

Tim:
Definitely true, if I recall correctly, at both Hopmeadow and Simsbury Farms (probably even more so at the latter). 

[Jim_Kennedy]

Growing up in Connecticut, I played a number of courses designed by Geoffrey Cornish. I don't ever recall encountering a very deep bunker on one of his courses unless it was benched into a hill set well below the green. The shallowness always gave the impression that his bunkers were pretty big (and oftentimes they were).

Me either. Apart from  higher construction and maintenance costs, I feel that Mr. Cornish understood that a shallow bunker intimidates the average player as much as one that's deep.

Melyvn had no use for them  : Use them as Pets Corner for cats, dogs etc as IHMO they are a waste of money on a Golf course - a hazard that is no hazard, a true test of a skilled golfer

[Thomas Dai]

To me a sand bunker is a hazard. Shallow sand bunkers are not hazards for the better player, unless that is they are unkempt or largely unmaintained semi-waste areas containing, for example, tufts of grass, heather, bushes, footprints etc.

Now a shallow grass bunker, that's a very different thing, and with a artful humps and hollows, especially with some artful humps and hollows nearby.

All the best.

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