[Joe Bausch]

Does the Red become a bit of a slog by the end of the round?  From the tips there are four Par 4's that play 474 yards or longer.  Add in the four Par 5's and that just seems like a lot of really long holes for one round.

I enjoyed SSRed from beginning to end. 

I think it is imperative to play the proper set of tees.  These days on a good tee shot I carry the ball about 240 in the air.  That made the black tees at 6584 just about right.  I'd think unless you consistently drive the ball 250+ in the air, you'll find some of the par 4's to really be play like 5's from the tips (at 7148).

[Joel_Stewart]

This hole is a ball buster, played into the wind.  The back nine on the Red was the most difficult nine on the property (at least for me).

[John_Cullum]

Kyle putted from the 5th tee?  I gotta see this!

Kyle would putt from the tee of every par 3 if he could get away with it

Did he tee it up?

[Joe Bausch]

Kyle putted from the 5th tee?  I gotta see this!

Kyle would putt from the tee of every par 3 if he could get away with it

Did he tee it up?

Yep.

[Mark Saltzman]

Do you think the guys at Streamsong would mind if they had one course that played as a par-73?  Mike V asked earlier if the back-nine is a slog.  I found the stretch of holes from 10-15 to be more long than interesting.  I know that everyone on this board says par doesn't matter, but I think the stretch is made more manageable (at least mentally) if you call either 12 or 15 a par-5.

[Mark McKeever]

Kyle putted from the 5th tee?  I gotta see this!

Kyle would putt from the tee of every par 3 if he could get away with it

Did he tee it up?

Yep.

Kyle's coolness factor just went way up in my book.   

Mark

[Bill_McBride]

Does the Red become a bit of a slog by the end of the round?  From the tips there are four Par 4's that play 474 yards or longer.  Add in the four Par 5's and that just seems like a lot of really long holes for one round.

I enjoyed SSRed from beginning to end. 

I think it is imperative to play the proper set of tees.  These days on a good tee shot I carry the ball about 240 in the air.  That made the black tees at 6584 just about right.  I'd think unless you consistently drive the ball 250+ in the air, you'll find some of the par 4's to really be play like 5's from the tips (at 7148).

I'm happy to carry 210 these days.  How long are the two up tees?

[Joe Bausch]

Does the Red become a bit of a slog by the end of the round?  From the tips there are four Par 4's that play 474 yards or longer.  Add in the four Par 5's and that just seems like a lot of really long holes for one round.

I enjoyed SSRed from beginning to end. 

I think it is imperative to play the proper set of tees.  These days on a good tee shot I carry the ball about 240 in the air.  That made the black tees at 6584 just about right.  I'd think unless you consistently drive the ball 250+ in the air, you'll find some of the par 4's to really be play like 5's from the tips (at 7148).

I'm happy to carry 210 these days.  How long are the two up tees?

About 5200 and 6100.

[Frank Sullivan]

Does the Red become a bit of a slog by the end of the round?  From the tips there are four Par 4's that play 474 yards or longer.  Add in the four Par 5's and that just seems like a lot of really long holes for one round.

The stretch from 10 to 15 is pretty brutal from a scoring standpoint.  12 is a Par 4.5 at best, and 15 is long long long as you ascend the hill.  16, 17, and 18, however, are not terribly difficult, and 18 is reachable with the right wind direction.

But simply to answer your question, the back 9 has slog qualities, but it is mostly offset for me due to it's beauty.  14 through 18 is stunningly beautiful IMO.

[Tom_Doak]

I presume the course uses bermuda grass of some variety.  How sticky is the grass around the greens and does it make use of the ground impractical? 

419 Bermuda everywhere except the greens (mini Verde).

Ground game is very accessible.  I love it.  How's this grab ya':  on the Blue course Kyle and I made consecutive birdies on the par 3 5th and par 4 6th (he the 5th, me the 6th) both with 2 putts each. 

Kyle is a lot of fun, and has done great work down there.

He also fits in with the rest of my crew.  Last night I went around following eight of them playing the first 6-7 holes on the Blue course before dark.  Three of the guys (Brian Slawnik, Jonathan Reisetter and Matt Hunter) just took putters and played all the holes from the forward tee with just their putters.  They went down to the lower tee on 7 just before dark, set the ball up on a little tuft of grass at the edge of the tee, and all three got over the water on 7.  And Matt Hunter made 3 from the back right bunker.

[Greg Tallman]

Does the Red become a bit of a slog by the end of the round?  From the tips there are four Par 4's that play 474 yards or longer.  Add in the four Par 5's and that just seems like a lot of really long holes for one round.

I enjoyed SSRed from beginning to end. 

I think it is imperative to play the proper set of tees.  These days on a good tee shot I carry the ball about 240 in the air.  That made the black tees at 6584 just about right.  I'd think unless you consistently drive the ball 250+ in the air, you'll find some of the par 4's to really be play like 5's from the tips (at 7148).

The tees go from 6548 to the next set at 7148?

[Joe Bausch]

Does the Red become a bit of a slog by the end of the round?  From the tips there are four Par 4's that play 474 yards or longer.  Add in the four Par 5's and that just seems like a lot of really long holes for one round.

I enjoyed SSRed from beginning to end. 

I think it is imperative to play the proper set of tees.  These days on a good tee shot I carry the ball about 240 in the air.  That made the black tees at 6584 just about right.  I'd think unless you consistently drive the ball 250+ in the air, you'll find some of the par 4's to really be play like 5's from the tips (at 7148).

The tees go from 6548 to the next set at 7148?

Yes, from 6584 to 7148.

They don't have a composite course just yet, so depending upon your game that day and the wind, why not just create your own?

[Carl Nichols]

Maybe I missed it, but no comments on how many distances are marked on the yardage book?  Does the guy who hit it 170 off the tee really need to know that he has 297 left?   

[Joe Bausch]

Maybe I missed it, but no comments on how many distances are marked on the yardage book?  Does the guy who hit it 170 off the tee really need to know that he has 297 left?   

Me thinks you are nit-pickin' Carl.   

[John_Cullum]

  And Matt Hunter made 3 from the back right bunker.

I think that might have been my putter

[Bill_McBride]

Maybe I missed it, but no comments on how many distances are marked on the yardage book?  Does the guy who hit it 170 off the tee really need to know that he has 297 left?   

Isn't it nice to know you can hit two 7-irons and not challenge a cross bunker?

[Bill_McBride]

Does the Red become a bit of a slog by the end of the round?  From the tips there are four Par 4's that play 474 yards or longer.  Add in the four Par 5's and that just seems like a lot of really long holes for one round.

I enjoyed SSRed from beginning to end. 

I think it is imperative to play the proper set of tees.  These days on a good tee shot I carry the ball about 240 in the air.  That made the black tees at 6584 just about right.  I'd think unless you consistently drive the ball 250+ in the air, you'll find some of the par 4's to really be play like 5's from the tips (at 7148).

I'm happy to carry 210 these days.  How long are the two up tees?

About 5200 and 6100.

Good, 6100 always in my wheelhouse!

[Jim Colton]

Kyle putted from the 5th tee?  I gotta see this!

Kyle would putt from the tee of every par 3 if he could get away with it

BTW-When I first saw 15, I started referring to it as "the Sand Hills Hole"  It was the hole on the property that most reminded me of SH.  That belief was confirmed by my wife when she said the same thing when she saw it.

Cory, taking this one step further, the 14-15 combo with the well-bunkered par 3 and the majestic uphill par 4 in the backdrop reminds me very much of those famous pictures of 17-18 at Sand Hills. I doubt it was an accident.

[Tom_Doak]

Cory, taking this one step further, the 14-15 combo with the well-bunkered par 3 and the majestic uphill par 4 in the backdrop reminds me very much of those famous pictures of 17-18 at Sand Hills. I doubt it was an accident.

Well, I can assure you that it wasn't an accident.

15 Red came first, that was on the earliest plan I saw of Bill's when he was just trying to route 18 holes on the site.  (So were Red 7 and Blue 3 and 4 and 5 and 6 and 8 and 15.)  Red 14, and the angle for it, came quite a bit later in the routing process, but it's no accident that Bill set it up so you could see 15 in the background.

[Joe Bausch]

After the 15th hole on SSRed, you get a nice view of the dueling par 3's, Red 16 on the left, Blue 7 on the right.



#16.  Par 3.





Tee view:



On the walking path to the green:



From the back edge of the green:



From over the green:



Once a month or so they might put the pin in the swale, like this on the first day:









As good as the Biarritz at Yale?  No, but a close second for me.

[Tom_Doak]

Joe:

Pretty sure they put the pin in the swale more than once a month.  They've already had two or three aces on that hole, and they probably weren't to the front or the back.

I played so well on the Red in my matches the other day, but I choked on this shot, just after telling our group that I had always been freaked out about Bill's choice to put a hole here, thinking only the very front part of it was going to be used for the green ... it just looked like an impossible shot to me.  And, of course, they had the pin in front for our match, so I fanned one into the water.  Luckily my partner Fred Muller had already hit one to 8-10 feet.

Also, when we began construction, the area down to the left of the green was a canal that was used to transfer water into the big lake from down along #17 fairway.

[Jud_T]

Am I nuts or does that green remind anyone of Whistling Straights #17?

[Joe Bausch]

Am I nuts or does that green remind anyone of Whistling Straights #17?

Hmm, maybe a little:

[Josh Tarble]

This is on the top of the list as far as individual holes I can't wait to see down there.

How often do they have a front pin?  That looks like it would be an impossible tee shot to the front.

[John Ezekowitz]

I am not sure why (maybe the scale of the pin compared to the green and the shaved bank), but the picture of the 16th green complex from short left is my favorite picture I've seen of SS so far.

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