[Brian_Ewen]

Not sure how many are interested in the Braid designed Edzell GC in my area of Scotland.

But the club this year hired MacKenzie & Ebert for a course improvement plan.

The plan has been posted on Edzells website and I think some here would find it very interesting.

Even though its in the members section, it seems to be available for anyone to view, but it is a 139mb PDF.

http://www.edzellgolfclub.com/members/index.asp

http://www.edzellgolfclub.com/pdf/Edzell_Masterplan_Report_2012-10.pdf

[Neil White]

Thanks for this Brian.

Looks like it should make for an interesting read over a morning coffee :-)

Neil.

[Brian_Ewen]

I would love to hear thoughts from persons more qualified than myself.

Not often, I get to see something like this and about a course I know very well.

[Rich Goodale]

It is a very impressive and thoughtful plan, and particularly fascinating given the series of aerials (probably courtesy of the US Air Force, who had a very large and very hush, hush facility nearby)  Great to see M&E also go after the conifers.  Other than soaking up water, what actually do trees do to any well designed golf course?.  I think that the price for the work planned is amazingly low (pocket change for the similarly competent US architects).  Signs of the times....

[Adam Lawrence]

It is a very impressive and thoughtful plan, and particularly fascinating given the series of aerials (probably courtesy of the US Air Force, who had a very large and very hush, hush facility nearby)  Great to see M&E also go after the conifers.  Other than soaking up water, what actually do trees do to any well designed golf course?.  I think that the price for the work planned is amazingly low (pocket change for the similarly competent US architects).  Signs of the times....

Aerials almost certainly from the English Heritage 'Aerofilms' collection, which is the one that's slowly being digitised and put online at the Britain from the Air site. The USAF are less likely to share!

[Rich Goodale]

It is a very impressive and thoughtful plan, and particularly fascinating given the series of aerials (probably courtesy of the US Air Force, who had a very large and very hush, hush facility nearby)  Great to see M&E also go after the conifers.  Other than soaking up water, what actually do trees do to any well designed golf course?.  I think that the price for the work planned is amazingly low (pocket change for the similarly competent US architects).  Signs of the times....

Aerials almost certainly from the English Heritage 'Aerofilms' collection, which is the one that's slowly being digitised and put online at the Britain from the Air site. The USAF are less likely to share!

Thanks, Adam

I thought that the photos were of UKNGO standard rather than USAF.  Thanks for confirming that.  That being said, I do not doubt that the USAF has some amazing photos of Edzell given the top secret nature of their nearby base.  Maybe if they had hired an American archirect to do the work the club would have had access to them!

Rihc

Rich

[Niall C]

Brian

Thanks for providing the links. I got half way through the pdf, and that was just looking at the photos/illustrations without really reading it through thoroughly,before I had to move on to other stuff. But from what I saw it looks as though they are proposing a fairly light touch with nothing too radical ie no hairy lip bunkering. Not sure that some of their mock-ups had me convinced about the worth of what they propose to do. What's your own thoughts, good or bad ?

Supplementary question, Edzell, Forfar and Brechin, what order ?

Niall

[Brian_Ewen]

Supplementary question, Edzell, Forfar and Brechin, what order ?

Forfar (by quite a long way)

Edzell

(Kirriemuir)

Brechin

[Niall C]

Brian

Interesting. As you probably spotted from previous threads, Forfar was easily this numpty's best find of the year. I was really impressed with it and wondered how it compared to Edzell in particular which I'd heard good things about and seems to have a better rep. Brechin I hadn't heard much of but seems to get decent right up in some blurbs.

Niall

[Rich Goodale]

I'll third what Brian and Niall said.

I had only played Forfar in a mixed foursomes 15+ years ago, but had the chance to play 36 there this year and it was a revelation.  It would easily fit in with places like Swinley Forest, West Hill and Liphook if it were located near London.  And I mean this sincerely.

Rich

[Brian_Ewen]

Brian
Interesting. As you probably spotted from previous threads, Forfar was easily this numpty's best find of the year. I was really impressed with it and wondered how it compared to Edzell in particular which I'd heard good things about and seems to have a better rep. Brechin I hadn't heard much of but seems to get decent right up in some blurbs.
Niall

Nial
For years I would mention Forfar on here, and no one would listen.

Stonehaven had a reciprocal agreement with Forfar (and Arbroath, Montrose, Kirriemuir) so we played it regularly at half price green fees.

Still very underrated in my book.

Brechin, the course had to be altered for the by-pass a few years back, and the new holes are a bit iffy. But once you get across the road onto the old part of the course, there is some very nice holes.

I added Kirriemuir before Brechin, as any Braid fan should have a look at it. Some very ho hum holes but there is the odd enjoyable quirk here and there, and its got a great finish.

[Jim McCann]

Brian:

Thanks for posting the Mackenzie & Ebert masterplan for Edzell (Old), it made for some fascinating reading.

The course just misses out on a place in the Scottish Top 100 on our website but it might well edge it's way
in if the proposed modifications were to be implemented.

I agree that Fofar is a far better track, having been very impressed when I played there last year and I have
to say that it's just outside my personal top 50 in the country.

I haven't played (and am probably unlikely to ever play) Brechin but if you carry on another 12 miles south of
there, Donald Steel's Letham Grange (Old) is a cracking course that deserves wider recognition.

[Brian_Ewen]

Donald Steel's Letham Grange (Old) is a cracking course that deserves wider recognition.

Jim
Can we call Letham Grange a "Donald Steel" ?

[Gary Slatter]

Professional John Kerr has been a member at Edzell since he was a kid, loves the course.  email John if you want:
john.kerr@fairmont.com

[Niall C]

Donald Steel's Letham Grange (Old) is a cracking course that deserves wider recognition.

Jim
Can we call Letham Grange a "Donald Steel" ?

I've played it and quite enjoyed it from what I remember. Is it still going, I thought there was some doubts because the owners went bust.

Brian

Why not a Donald Steel ? Was this a Tom McKenzie when he was with Steel ?

Niall

[Jim McCann]

Brian and Niall

Martin Ebert definitely had nothing to do with the Old course at Letham Grange and he doesn't think Tom Mackenzie had any involvement either. Donald Steel certainly claims to be the man who designed the course and I'm not going to argue with him.

There's a protracted court case ongoing regards ownership of the estate on which the course is laid out but, according to the following link, golf continues unabated:

http://www.lethamgrangegolfclub.co.uk/

[Brian_Ewen]

I play Letham Grange at least once a year.

Donald Steel ? ...... well the story I was told, is it was designed by the original owner, but he was so unsure about how to build greens that he called in Donald Steel to do them.

So its an amateur routing with Steel greens  ?

(Did Jim Finnegan not cover this in his book ?)

IMO, it was a far better course when it first opened, but there was problems with a house sitting on the right hand side of the 18th and too many golfers "going for it", that it had to be re-routed.

Three of the original holes were lost and were replaced by three poor holes IMO.

I remember playing it on the year it opened, with persimmons etc., and it seemed to be the longest, hardest slog of a course I had ever played, and came off the course with loads of blisters on my feet.

The 2nd time we played it, be used "buggies" which was another first for me !

Course has always struggled to remain open, with location being blamed a lot of the time.

[Jim McCann]

Brian:

Just checked your Finegan reference and in his "Blasted Heaths and Blessed Greens" book he says the Old course at Letham Grange was
originally laid out by the owner, Ken Green, an accountant who apparently made his fortune in the commodities market, trading potatoes!

Green is said to have called in Donald Steel to construct the greens only.
 

[Brian_Ewen]

Letham Grange was  originally laid out by the owner, Ken Green, an accountant who apparently made his fortune in the commodities market, trading potatoes!

I think he lost his fortune trying to get Letham Grange open.

[Niall C]

Niall

ah yes the buggies ! Probably my first experience of buggies as well. I recall playing it with a pall who insisted in driving the buggy like a rally car, skidding to a halt at every stop. What he didn't realise was that the cloud of dust that he through up had to go somehwere and when we walked/drove off the course or backs and bags were covered in stour. If I recall I couldn't get my pal to play the second course so we played the Old course twice. Did I miss anything ?

Niall

[Brian_Ewen]

I actually found the New Course at Letham Grange quite decent.

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