Philmont's North course: a photo tour (all holes up)

[Joe Bausch]

I don't believe it is mentioned in any of these threads, but the South course was redesigned and expanded from 9 to 18 in 1908-09 and apparently HH Barker was responsible. In September 1909 it was reported in American Golfer that Barker was engaged at Philmont, among other places.

TMac uses the following blurb from the 1909 American Golfer as evidence that apparently HH Barker was responsible for the additional nine holes on the original course at Philmont:

[Joe Bausch]

Now back to the regularly scheduled programming.   

#10.  Par 4 (322 yards).

A blind tee shot on this mostly downhill hole (did Flynn utilize blind tee shots much?).



A precise 2nd shot is needed as the bunkers are deep and over is dead:



From short and right of the green:



A view right and over the green with what I think being shaved down is a relatively new feature:



#11.  Par 3 (245 yards).  Slightly downhill 1-shotter.

Tee view:



From left of the pushed-up green:



From long and left of the green:



#12.  Par 5 (491 yards).

Big hitters can probably pop it over the slope.

Tee view:



As I walked up to my drive (ball in the lower right), my caddy (a very good one) told me how in a tourney Michael McDermott popped a drive to result in a 5 iron in.  To which he immediately set down my bag at my tee shot, and said, "hit this 3 wood in".  Funny moment.



From 100 yards out:



From over the green:



Three more later.

[Tom MacWood]

Here is a link to Carters adv from 12/1923 that mentions Philmont is under construction. The ad is on the last page.

http://www.la84foundation.org/SportsLibrary/GolfIllustrated/1923/gi184b.pdf

[Joe Bausch]

Here is a link to Carters adv from 12/1923 that mentions Philmont is under construction. The ad is on the last page.

http://www.la84foundation.org/SportsLibrary/GolfIllustrated/1923/gi184b.pdf

Thanks TMac.  Note:  that ad I believe is in the January, 1923 issue, not December.  Please confirm.

[Tom MacWood]

You're right, January 1923.

[Kyle Harris]

Wasn't Willie Park an architect often associated with Carters Tested Seed?

In fact, the two courses listed prior to Philmont at Park courses.

[John Shimony]

Thanks for the tour, Joe.  I live within 20 mins Philmont and have always wondered what the course was like. Hole # seven looks like one of the nicest in the Philly area.  One could hit a "great" drive over the ridge and end up with a downhill lie hitting up to an elevated green.  But the hole looks wide and playable.  Are the greens generally small?

[Joe Bausch]

Thanks for the tour, Joe.  I live within 20 mins Philmont and have always wondered what the course was like. Hole # seven looks like one of the nicest in the Philly area.  One could hit a "great" drive over the ridge and end up with a downhill lie hitting up to an elevated green.  But the hole looks wide and playable.  Are the greens generally small?

No, I would not call the greens small.  Like the 7th, for instance, is not small at all.

But I'm curious to hear the opinions of others.

[Tom MacWood]

Wasn't Willie Park an architect often associated with Carters Tested Seed?

In fact, the two courses listed prior to Philmont at Park courses.

Yes, he was closely associated with Carters. I'm under the impression they built most of his courses, or at least a high percentage of them.

[Joe Bausch]

Three more this morning, all 2-shotters.

#13.  Par 4 (351 yards).  This is not a very long hole, and is hard to judge the length as there is a little rise in front of the tee maybe 100 yards.

Tee view:



From that ridge you now see the entire fw:



Approach shot view:



From right of this very cool, deep green where the club looks to be reclaiming lots of green space back right (and some back left):





#14.  Par 4 (488 yards).  This dogleg right par 4 is the No. 2 stroke hole.

Tee view, where big hitters will hug the right part of the fairway.



Approach shot view (plays a bit uphill, too):



From short and right of the green (I like the shaved mounding here):



From left of the green where again more space being recaptured back right:



From just over the green:



#15.  Par 4 (397 yards).  Dogleg-left par 4 where the last 100 yards or so sits much lower than the rest of the hole.

Tee view:



You must hit a tee shot long enough or have a semi-blind shot in:



From short and right of the green:



From long and left of the green, which this pic doesn't show a very nice back shelf for Sunday pins:



Perhaps we'll finish the tour later this afternoon before the long Memorial Day weekend!

[Joe Bausch]

#16.  Par 4 (451 yards). 

Another fairly long par 4, this one running gently downhill.

Tee view:



Approach shot view:



From short and left of the green:



From long and right of the green:



From just over the green:



#17.  Par 3 (202 yards).

Tee view:



I didn't get too close to this fellow in the creek alongside the hole (a moccasin perhaps?):



From just short of this two-tiered green:



From over the green:



#18.  Par 4 (343 yards).

Tee view:



Approach shot view:



Rough short of the green:



From just over the green:



That's all folks!  P. Pig.

P.S.  If you wish to see how Philmont North looked in June of this year (2019), go here:

http://www80.homepage.villanova.edu/joseph.bausch/images/albums/PhilmontNorth_2019/index.html

[Kyle Harris]

That 16th green just bellows Willie Park, Jr. From the knuckle short left, the somewhat abrupt push up nature and quadrant nature of the strategy.

[Steve_ Shaffer]

18 at North is NOT among the highly rated finishing holes in the area. What a weak hole to end an otherwise enjoyable round. The severely sloped left to right fairway destroys any option off the tee.

[Matthew Petersen]

18 at North is NOT among the highly rated finishing holes in the area. What a weak hole to end an otherwise enjoyable round. The severely sloped left to right fairway destroys any option off the tee.

Just from photos, the green being encircled by rough also struck me as odd. Seems like most of the holes had fairway running into the green. Not sure why that's not the case on this hole. just because it's a short iron approach?

[Steve_ Shaffer]

18 leaves an uphill,usually blind, shorter iron approach from the right side of the fairway or the rough depending on where the ball stops coming down the slope and it's not a level lie. There is no level lie in the fairway. Perhaps the rough in front of the green is to discourage long knockers.

[Doug Braunsdorf]

That 16th green just bellows Willie Park, Jr. From the knuckle short left, the somewhat abrupt push up nature and quadrant nature of the strategy.

Kyle, where was Philmont within Park's timeline? 

I see more Greate Bay, Woodway, some White Course here, rather than Glen Ridge and/or New Haven CC. 

Having said that, the steep fall-offs behind greens as found on White Course, Glen Ridge, Ashbourne, and behind one or two Park holes at Greate Bay are not as evident here.  Although, at Greate Bay, maybe we do not have as many Park push-up greens due to the naturally sandy soil.

[BCowan]

Joe,

   That land looks fantastic.  Now that is an Arb if I ever saw one.  One could build a subdivision with all the lumber on that course.  Some very good looking holes on this photo tour.  thanks