[Barry Samuels]

Once again the Dallas Morning News ranks this course fourth in the state, while others – such as Golf Digest – has it much further down in their state ranking.  I wonder why the discrepancy?  Any insight on this?  Has anyone here played there?  I know it is super exclusive, but there is not much out there on it – little discussion, no photographs, etc.

I’d like to know more about this course.  It seems like it was Byron Nelson’s baby and an important player in Dallas golf history. 

[Bart Bradley]

I've played Preston Trail.  I have heard that the course has undergone a substantial tree program since I viisted which would be a very positive thing.  It had a number of good holes but trees were choking them out.  PT is men-only and famous for its good club atmosphere.  Mickey Mantle was a member.  The day I visited, Lee Trevino was working hard on the range.  I haven't seen it since the recent work but I would have given it a 6 on the Doak scale.

Bart

[Dan King]

I played it a few times when I used to live in Dallas last century. I really enjoyed playing it. A big part of the appeal is how exclusive it is. You could also count on it always being immaculately maintained. But it had a few too many houses too close to play and too many trees to really be considered a great course. It did have some really good holes. A remember a couple of the par-5s that I really liked. I think if you could get rid of some of the tress and many of the houses, it would have been a very special place. Glad to hear about some tree removal -- but I doubt they will ever go for the houses removal.

Cheers,
Dan King

This is another thing I like about golf, the exclusiveness. Of course most country clubs exclude the wrong kinds of people, such as me. But I hold out the hope that somewhere there's a club which bans first wives, people in twelve-step programs, Sting, the editorial board of the Boston Globe, and Ross Perot.
 --P.J. O'Rourke

[Sam Morrow]

I'm sure Mike Beene will see this later, this is his expertise. Preston Trail is all men though, I hope that doesn't upset anyone.

[mike_beene]

Sam,I seldom see the word expert in the same sentence with my name simply because I am not! To Preston Trail, several guys I play with have joined recently and the waiting list is fairly long still. Very bluntly,the all male aspect would cost me my job and I am not comfortable joining a club I can't take my nieces to.I have no problem with those who do join though.The golf course years ago was out in the country. the housing has hurt the back nine ,especially holes 14 and 15 which are flat between houses with a lake in the middle kind of like Florida.The course was supposedly a loose copy of great holes from other courses.7 feels like 5 at Colonial,10 is downhill and at least a straight version of 10 at Augusta. 8 is a long downhill 3 that at one time I was told was inspired by something somewhere.16 a drive and pitch over creek.17 a layup short of creek. As you think through it it has a lot of weaker holes but I think it gets a pass because it is exclusive and the condition has been recovered.It is expensive enough that a nonprofit lawyer like me would be crazy to join,even of it were coed.Hope this is descriptive enough to help.Maybe the Plummer guys have some more to add.

[Sam Morrow]

Sam,I seldom see the word expert in the same sentence with my name simply because I am not! To Preston Trail, several guys I play with have joined recently and the waiting list is fairly long still. Very bluntly,the all male aspect would cost me my job and I am not comfortable joining a club I can't take my nieces to.I have no problem with those who do join though.The golf course years ago was out in the country. the housing has hurt the back nine ,especially holes 14 and 15 which are flat between houses with a lake in the middle kind of like Florida.The course was supposedly a loose copy of great holes from other courses.7 feels like 5 at Colonial,10 is downhill and at least a straight version of 10 at Augusta. 8 is a long downhill 3 that at one time I was told was inspired by something somewhere.16 a drive and pitch over creek.17 a layup short of creek. As you think through it it has a lot of weaker holes but I think it gets a pass because it is exclusive and the condition has been recovered.It is expensive enough that a nonprofit lawyer like me would be crazy to join,even of it were coed.Hope this is descriptive enough to help.Maybe the Plummer guys have some more to add.

I've seen pictures of 16 and someone once told me it was supposed to be based off of 12 at Southern Hills, I don't see it though.

[mike_beene]

16 would be closer to 16 at Oakland Hills but instead of a pond it  goes over White Rock Creek.Wonder if that is what they meant?

[Kris Shreiner]

Preston Trail is a solid layout and a club that really tries to nail it on the presentation side in all areas. Gracious members, superb conditions, friendly faces on the staff, that have been there a long time in the main, exceptional service...in short, all you'd expect from a great, private club.

I've not played it since the tree removals, but certainly didn't feel the course suffered from its surroundings when I've played it. Had an eagle there on a par four my first go 'round, so that will always make the locale memorable for me.

While the course isn't a stunner, there is just a large dose of very enjoyable, quality golf there from my view. I'd gladly tee it up again at Preston Trial in a second. As my beloved WVU hillbillies play UT in Austin this Fall, in October, I may get that opportunity!

Cheers,
Kris

P.S- While it is all male, which as a general rule is a liittle arcane, the experience there is so satisfying I have a hard time knocking them on that score.

[scott_wood]

I had the good  fortune to play PT a decade ago, and would echo the positive comments regarding the friendly, well run nature of the club..
Trees and homes ,yes, but also good rolling topography, well utilized....

I did notice one thing that may be unique in this wide world of golf we so enjoy......

As it is all male, the clubhouse did not have "traditional width" doors separating many of the rooms.....No need....
Instead,there were 6-8 foot width "archways"...
As you passed from the locker room to the grill, there was a small brass plaque on the "archway" inscribed
"Members are encouraged to wear at least a towel while dining"...

I was told it was referred to as the Mickey Mantle guideline.....

[Anthony Butler]

Once again the Dallas Morning News ranks this course fourth in the state, while others – such as Golf Digest – has it much further down in their state ranking.  I wonder why the discrepancy? 

When George Bush rejoined the club, he had Karl Rove and Ken Blackwell 'process' the rater scores before they went to the Morning News.

[Ronald Montesano]

Barry,

Politics. DMN is more beholding to the local bastion (whose members are certainly movers and shakers) whereas GD and other mags are not quite so indebted.

Also, let's guess that the golf "experts" of the DMN are not quite as astute nor traveled as those who work for golf-only pubs.

[mike_beene]

Ronald,quite the contrary in my opinion.The DMN publishes the names of their evaluators.Three of them are active participants on this board.I would say the majority have played everywhere imaginable.The club pros get to most of the national clubs as well.For some reason our pro gets to go play Augusta and Pine Valley and I just get to here how much fun it was!

[Sam Morrow]

Ronald,quite the contrary in my opinion.The DMN publishes the names of their evaluators.Three of them are active participants on this board.I would say the majority have played everywhere imaginable.The club pros get to most of the national clubs as well.For some reason our pro gets to go play Augusta and Pine Valley and I just get to here how much fun it was!

Is Gilbert bragging?

[mike_beene]

Boone Pickens took him to Augusta

[Sam Morrow]

Boone Pickens took him to Augusta

Is he a member at Lakewood?

[John Handley]

Politics. DMN is more beholding to the local bastion (whose members are certainly movers and shakers) whereas GD and other mags are not quite so indebted.

Also, let's guess that the golf "experts" of the DMN are not quite as astute nor traveled as those who work for golf-only pubs. - Ronald Montesano

I'm not sure what facts you are basing this statement on but that is truly an irresponsible comment to be made without having any knowledge of the process.  As mentioned by Mike Beene, TDMN has a published list of golf raters, professionals, writers, etc. from the State of Texas who rank the golf courses each year.  The list and those who particpate are some of the most knowledgable golfers in Texas. 

[Jeff_Brauer]

John,

Oh, so you think facts are essential to arguing points on this discussion group?  Not just uninformed opinions?  Well, that changes EVERYTHING!

For the record, I am one of those "uninformed" DMN raters that Ronald muses about.  I have played most decent courses in Texas, designed a few, and played 70 of the world top 100 or so (depends on the magazine, changes in the rankings, etc.)  I think I am qualified.  I stayed off it for years, thinking it was a conflict of interest, and now make sure I vote my own courses pretty low.  I only went on after the editors explained that almost everyone in the biz had at least one course they might favor, but they trust it doesn't generally happen, and can usually tell when it does.

As to PT, I also presume that its overall ambiance and exclusivity has something to do with the rating, but don't know.  Its a great place and a very good golf course.  It's certainly up there, and whether it should be 4th purely on the golf course, I am not sure, but its close.

[Sam Morrow]

John,

Oh, so you think facts are essential to arguing points on this discussion group?  Not just uninformed opinions?  Well, that changes EVERYTHING!

For the record, I am one of those "uninformed" DMN raters that Ronald muses about.  I have played most decent courses in Texas, designed a few, and played 70 of the world top 100 or so (depends on the magazine, changes in the rankings, etc.)  I think I am qualified.  I stayed off it for years, thinking it was a conflict of interest, and now make sure I vote my own courses pretty low.  I only went on after the editors explained that almost everyone in the biz had at least one course they might favor, but they trust it doesn't generally happen, and can usually tell when it does.

As to PT, I also presume that its overall ambiance and exclusivity has something to do with the rating, but don't know.  Its a great place and a very good golf course.  It's certainly up there, and whether it should be 4th purely on the golf course, I am not sure, but its close.

Which you taking PT or Brook Hollow?

[Michael Wharton-Palmer]

As another of those less than blessed raters for the DMN, I think that PT is a very good golf course.
Certainly top ten in the state.
Whether it deserves top 4 on the basis of its architecture is perhaps debatable, but once in the top ten and away from Whispering Pines, there is little to choose between many of the courses n the state.
Personally, the aforementioned Whispering Pines and Colonial stand out by themselves and after that it is  mad rush for places in the top ten to include the likes of Pine Dunes, PT, Brook Hollow to mention but a few.
Although one can discuss the vrtues or lack there of,  with the male only aspect of PT, it is a very friendly atmosphere, very gracious to visitors once on the grounds and a fun place to play golf.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Sam,

Actually I did vote for PT over BH and would prefer to play there.  Always thought BH was a bit over rated, even after the Crenshaw redo in the 1990's. 

I also vote Vaquero as the best Faz course in DFW, despite DN getting more accolades, so I don't always vote with the herd.

[Sam Morrow]

Sam,

Actually I did vote for PT over BH and would prefer to play there.  Always thought BH was a bit over rated, even after the Crenshaw redo in the 1990's. 

I also vote Vaquero as the best Faz course in DFW, despite DN getting more accolades, so I don't always vote with the herd.

I haven't play Vaquero either. I'd be curious to hear how you ranked your courses in the state.

[Pete Balzer]

I was very lucky in the early 90's to be able to play numerous rounds at Preston Trails and Bent Tree with one of the nicest person I've ever met, Hank Dickerson. I believe he was an early board member and was involved in the founding of Bent Tree. Couldn't beat the atmosphere in the Clubhouse or on the course. A treat. Vivid memory- Playing through Mickey Mantle's group twice in the same day.

[mike_beene]

Brook Hollow is the only Dallas course close to being sandy.I like it better than PT and definitely better than Colonial,which I confess I really don't get.I think you guys are right about Whispering Pines.What a nice place.

[Sam Morrow]

Brook Hollow is the only Dallas course close to being sandy.I like it better than PT and definitely better than Colonial,which I confess I really don't get.I think you guys are right about Whispering Pines.What a nice place.

How much of Brook Hollow was changed for was it the flood plain from the river? Whispering Pines is very cool, I have a starting time in 11 hours. My girlfriend knows something is up, I'm cleaning my clubs.

[mike_beene]

What a great place.Have fun.Watch out for gators and snakes. Brook Hollow used to have bunkers between fairways where there are now trees.They have talked about putting water in those valleys in front of  18,10,6 and 9. Supposedly was this way before they changed the river channel. Not sure about this.My source on this is a member who is not sure what he is talking about so dont quote me.Also,I like the big fairway dips and water just gets in the way.

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