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Ran Morrissett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« on: December 06, 2010, 02:23:30 PM »
Einige Leute wie zum Beispiel Tom Paul bezeichnen den Vergleich von Golfplaetzen als verlorene Zeit. Ich persoehnlich denke anders. Beim genaueren unter-die-Lupe-nehmen tauchen oftmals Dinge auf , die man vorher nicht bedacht hat. Unser naechstes Projekt ist die neue Anlage in Sunningdale. Der neue Kurs schreit geradezu danach seinem beruehmten Zwilling gegenuebergestellt zu werden.

Wie der Zufall es will hatte ich bereits an dem Falkenstein Profil mit Hollywood. Zwei absolute Meister sind da an der Arbeit und man erkennt unschwer wie Travis viele Sandgruben und-bunker (z.B. selbst gemachte Problemzonen), sowie wilde Gruenkonturen auf den mehr moderaten Gelaende eingesetzt hat, im Gegensatz zu Colt und Morrison liegt der Hamburger GC ueber satten Huegeln, was zu einen interessanten Kontrast verhilft.

Ein guter Freund dieser Website, Christoth Meister versorgte uns mit allen historischen Fotos und Dokumentation fuer diese Beurteilung. Niemand weiss mehr ueber Golfplatz Architektur in Deutschland als dieser Mann, und Christoph erklaert deutlich die Rolle,die der deutsche Architekten Star Bernhard von Limburger in der Evolution von Falkenstein gespielt hat.

Die Huegel und das dichte Gruen erinnert stark an Morfontaine. Ich persoehnlich denke die Huegel sind "huegeliger" und das Gruen "gruener" in Falkenstein.

Die Entscheidung ist jedem selbst ueberlassen. Ich denke aber wir sind einer Meinung wenn ich sage, dass Kyle Philips ein intelligenter und kluger Kopf ist wenn er Falkenstein in seine Liste der fuenf Golfanlagen die er bald beurteilen moechte, aufnimmt.

Freundliche Gruesse

Jeff Dawson

Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2010, 02:28:19 PM »
This is the first thing Ran has said that makes sense to me and I don't speak German....... :)

JC Jones

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2010, 02:38:07 PM »
Is it better or worse than Hamburger The Motion Picture?
I get it, you are mad at the world because you are an adult caddie and few people take you seriously.

Excellent spellers usually lack any vision or common sense.

I know plenty of courses that are in the red, and they are killing it.

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2010, 02:45:15 PM »
JC wird meine Hundin
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Emil Weber

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2010, 02:47:46 PM »
Ran,

I've only got time for a short reply now but il'll post more tomorrow...

This is the review Ive been waiting for the most, you once again did a great job. Stunning historical information, thank you Christoph ;), great photos and as spot on descriptions!

Glad you enjoyed the course, the best there is on offer in this country!

And your german is very good ;)

cheers!

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2010, 03:03:13 PM »
Courtesy google translations, which I didn't even know existed until I googled "translations." Figures.....



skipping to avoid spoiling.........




still skipping............



a bit more skipping...............



Here we go:

Some people such as Tom Paul describe the comparison of golf courses as a waste of time. I personally think otherwise. A closer under-take the plunge-Lupe often on things that you have not considered before. Our next project is the new plant in Sunningdale. The new course cries after his famous twin has been juxtaposed to be.

As luck would have it I was already at the Falkenstein profile with Hollywood. Two absolute masterpieces are there to work and be recognized easily as Travis many sand pits and bunkers was used (eg self-made problem areas), and wild green contours on the more moderate terrain, as opposed to Colt and Morrison is the Hamburg GC over lush hills this lends an interesting contrast.

A good friend of this site, Christoth master supplied us with all the historic photos and documentation for that assessment. No one knows more about golf course architecture in Germany as this man, and Chris explains clearly the role played by the German architect Star Bernhard von Limburger in the evolution of Falkenstein.

The hills and the dense green reminiscent Morfontaine. I personally think the hills are "hills" and the Green "green" in Falkenstein.

The decision is left up to each own. But I think we agree when I say that Kyle Philips is a clever and intelligent man when he Falkenstein in his list of five golf courses that he soon would like to assess, record.


JC Jones

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2010, 04:29:28 PM »
JC wird meine Hundin

Can I sing "You Raise me Up" the entire way around the grudge match?
I get it, you are mad at the world because you are an adult caddie and few people take you seriously.

Excellent spellers usually lack any vision or common sense.

I know plenty of courses that are in the red, and they are killing it.

Anthony Gray

Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2010, 06:18:58 PM »
Einige Leute wie zum Beispiel Tom Paul bezeichnen den Vergleich von Golfplaetzen als verlorene Zeit. Ich persoehnlich denke anders. Beim genaueren unter-die-Lupe-nehmen tauchen oftmals Dinge auf , die man vorher nicht bedacht hat. Unser naechstes Projekt ist die neue Anlage in Sunningdale. Der neue Kurs schreit geradezu danach seinem beruehmten Zwilling gegenuebergestellt zu werden.

Wie der Zufall es will hatte ich bereits an dem Falkenstein Profil mit Hollywood. Zwei absolute Meister sind da an der Arbeit und man erkennt unschwer wie Travis viele Sandgruben und-bunker (z.B. selbst gemachte Problemzonen), sowie wilde Gruenkonturen auf den mehr moderaten Gelaende eingesetzt hat, im Gegensatz zu Colt und Morrison liegt der Hamburger GC ueber satten Huegeln, was zu einen interessanten Kontrast verhilft.

Ein guter Freund dieser Website, Christoth Meister versorgte uns mit allen historischen Fotos und Dokumentation fuer diese Beurteilung. Niemand weiss mehr ueber Golfplatz Architektur in Deutschland als dieser Mann, und Christoph erklaert deutlich die Rolle,die der deutsche Architekten Star Bernhard von Limburger in der Evolution von Falkenstein gespielt hat.

Die Huegel und das dichte Gruen erinnert stark an Morfontaine. Ich persoehnlich denke die Huegel sind "huegeliger" und das Gruen "gruener" in Falkenstein.

Die Entscheidung ist jedem selbst ueberlassen. Ich denke aber wir sind einer Meinung wenn ich sage, dass Kyle Philips ein intelligenter und kluger Kopf ist wenn er Falkenstein in seine Liste der fuenf Golfanlagen die er bald beurteilen moechte, aufnimmt.

Freundliche Gruesse


  I think you mispelled something.

  Anthn y

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2010, 08:29:01 AM »
Ran, I'm much relieved to read this. Falkenstein is not a course you read about often. I was bowled over with the same holes that you were, although my enthusiasm for the 18th was perhaps less than yours. I was surprised at the green-front bunkers, but Christoph soon put me right! Nor did I warm greatly to the 13th, but I've only been there the once and might think differently on a second visit. I was there in early winter - on my own as the darkness set in. But it was all so self explanatory. I loved those blind and semi-blind drives over crests. The manager and his assistant were warmly welcoming - I'd go back like a flash. Maybe Christoph would say where else one should play if visiting Hamburg. I simply went in and out on a day trip from England.

Adam Lawrence

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2010, 09:21:47 AM »
One should get on a train to Sylt and go play Budersand. Special place.

I liked Falkenstein very much but felt it was a step below the top Dutch courses, Morfontaine and so on. A little too mucked around with over the years, and a wee bit lush. I do love the atmosphere at these great European clubs though.
Adam Lawrence

Editor, Golf Course Architecture
www.golfcoursearchitecture.net

Principal, Oxford Golf Consulting
www.oxfordgolfconsulting.com

Author, 'More Enduring Than Brass: a biography of Harry Colt' (forthcoming).

Short words are best, and the old words, when short, are the best of all.

JLahrman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #10 on: December 07, 2010, 03:13:41 PM »
Phil, pretty good translation from Google.  My mediocre German skills tell me that Ran finds the hills are "hillier" and the green "greener" in Falkenstein.

But apart from that, not bad.  Some of those translators come up with unintentionally hilarious results.

Entweder Ran hat ernste Deutsche Fähigkeiten, oder er hat eine kleine Vogel, der ihm hilft.  Das ist fliessend Deutsch.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2010, 03:40:42 PM by JLahrman »

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2010, 05:29:57 PM »
Phil, pretty good translation from Google.  My mediocre German skills tell me that Ran finds the hills are "hillier" and the green "greener" in Falkenstein.

But apart from that, not bad.  Some of those translators come up with unintentionally hilarious results.

Entweder Ran hat ernste Deutsche Fähigkeiten, oder er hat eine kleine Vogel, der ihm hilft.  Das ist fliessend Deutsch.

I just found a terrific Google gadget, www.google.com/ig,  that translates in the blink of an eye.  Here's their translation of the above; how'd they do?

"Ran either has serious German skills, or he has a little bird that helps him. That is fluent in German."

JLahrman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #12 on: December 07, 2010, 08:24:39 PM »
Entweder Ran hat ernste Deutsche Fähigkeiten, oder er hat eine kleine Vogel, der ihm hilft.  Das ist fliessend Deutsch.

I just found a terrific Google gadget, www.google.com/ig,  that translates in the blink of an eye.  Here's their translation of the above; how'd they do?

"Ran either has serious German skills, or he has a little bird that helps him. That is fluent in German."

Right on, except I was trying to say "That is fluent German" in regards to Ran's initial post.  But that might be the fault of my German, not the fault of the translator.  I'm not exactly fliessend myself.

John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2010, 10:21:00 PM »
An excellent profile.  In general, these are a real highlight of GCA, and I really appreciate the effort to highlight courses from around the world. 

Vielen Dank!

Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2010, 10:30:48 PM »
John, is this where you played on your recent trip?

John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #15 on: December 09, 2010, 06:10:11 AM »
John, is this where you played on your recent trip?

Nope. Emil Weber was kind enough to have me visit another Colt - Frankfurter. Which reminds me I need to post some thoughts on the experience.

I've been to Germany a lot, but no further north than Cologne.

Scott Warren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #16 on: December 09, 2010, 07:05:18 AM »
Thanks. I remembered where you'd played was named after food, just got the two mixed up!

Paul_Turner

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #17 on: December 09, 2010, 07:08:35 AM »
For those who know the course....were the von-Limburger changes a good idea?



The current 15th doesn't look great and the 16th looks much more interesting from the original tee and with its original bunkering scheme.
can't get to heaven with a three chord song

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #18 on: December 09, 2010, 01:28:42 PM »
Paul,

I've already had my say over 13, 15 and 16. I think the current 3 is a terrific hole (that's not to say that Colt's was less good, just different) and I like the latter stages of the 2nd, particularly. You could say that the drive on 2 is a weakness in that its main challenges are keeping out of the trees as the fairway narrows and making good distance up a rising fairway, not usual Colt challenges, but the sight of long hitters reaching that green in two must be thrilling.

Mark.

Brent Carlson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #19 on: December 10, 2010, 08:33:31 PM »
Schoen ein deutscher Platz auf dieser Webseite zu sehen.  Fstein sieht ganz gut aus, aehlich wie die Heathlandplaetze im Londonergebiet. 

Ich muss aber auch sagen dass Hamburg eine der schoensten Staedte ist.  Es gibt nix besseres als Hafenfest in der Sommerzeit.

l.G.

BC

Ulrich Mayring

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2010, 06:40:49 PM »
Nice work on the German.

I think I've mentioned it before, but since we now have a Falkenstein thread it's worth pointing out again: there is probably no cheaper way to ever play a world class course than by taking part in Falkenstein's annual Hulopo tournament. It is open to guests and there is a handicap limit in the low teens. You get to play five rounds and another ten holes for about 10-15 Euros per round. Here's the catch: it's all in one day :)

They stage it in June to maximise daylight and you start around 4 AM and play at a leisurely pace (sub 3 hours as two-balls), only stopping to change shoes and eat. There's usually a reception in the evening on the 18th green by appreciative club members, honoring those who got in all 100 holes. Perhaps we could get a small contingent together one day and fly the GCA flag at Falkenstein?

Ulrich
Golf Course Exposé (300+ courses reviewed), Golf CV (how I keep track of 'em)

John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hamburger Golf Club profile is posted
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2010, 07:47:58 PM »
Perhaps we could get a small contingent together one day and fly the GCA flag at Falkenstein?

Maybe 2012?

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