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Anthony Gray

18th at NGLA
« on: October 18, 2010, 07:58:37 AM »


  Pat loves it.What do you think?Why is it so great?Not saying it is not,but



    Anthony

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Dan Herrmann

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2010, 07:59:43 AM »
Anthony - Could you describe the hole?
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Mark McKeever

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2010, 08:02:30 AM »
I was talking with Pat about 18 at NGLA recently over the phone.  One thing he loves about the approach is that you are typically scared to attack any pin thats towards the back of the green as it gets narrower and drops off on both sides.  We agreed that it is somewhat similar to the first at PV where you are more comfortable hitting a shot on the front/middle and taking a stab at it with your putter as opposed to getting over agressive approaching the green and paying for it.

Mark
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Mac Plumart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2010, 08:17:22 AM »
I love it because I birdied it!  That is the key criteria for a great hole to me...what I scored on the hole.

FYI...this criteria makes Ballyneal 12 a total garbage hole!!   ;)
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Sportsman/Adventure loving golfer.

C. Squier

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2010, 08:21:54 AM »
You pay so much attention to what you NEED to miss off the tee that you're ultimately pulled towards that bunker.  Miss the bunker and you should be able to put yourself into position for birdie, assuming you can make yourself get the ball to the hole.  As Mark stated, that falloff is pretty severe if you flog your approach.  It's a great home hole.
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Bill_McBride

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2010, 10:20:56 AM »
Every bunker is in the perfect position to make life difficult for players of every level.
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Jimmy Muratt

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2010, 01:18:14 PM »
The 18th at National is a great par 5 because it is playable and enjoyable by every level of golfer, yet difficult to conquer.  The hole will yield a good score to well played shots, but play aggressively and hit an errant shot and trouble awaits. 

What takes the hole to an even higher level is that it still gives you the opportunity to recover from a misplayed shot.

And, the setting isn't bad either!
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Patrick_Mucci

Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2010, 02:10:38 PM »
I agree with everything stated... except one statement by Jimmy.

Jimmy,

I have two rules on that hole as I stand on the tee.

Rule # 1

Do NOT hit your drive into the left side fairway bunker.

Rule # 2

Go back and reread rule # 1.

Hitting into that bunker almost certainly spells trouble and high scores on that hole.
The closer your are to the face, and the configuration of the bunker promotes getting close to the face, the less likely you are to advance the ball any meaningful distance, taking reaching the green in regulation out of play.

When you add the uphill nature of the hole, the hazard left, the wind and the skyline nature of the green, the hole is simply a great finishing hole for members and guests
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Anthony Gray

Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2010, 03:38:08 PM »


   I think the clubhouse makes you keep the ball too far to the right and pinches the 2nd shot too much since a hazard is on the right.


   
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Garland Bayley

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2010, 04:59:19 PM »
Quote from: Mac Plumart on October 18, 2010, 08:17:22 AM
I love it because I birdied it!  That is the key criteria for a great hole to me...what I scored on the hole.

FYI...this criteria makes Ballyneal 12 a total garbage hole!!   ;)

I've birdied every hole on my home course and eagled some. That must mean it is the greatest course in the world! Certainly the greatest course I have ever played.
 :-*
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"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Dan Herrmann

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2010, 06:36:24 PM »
OK - I need help...  Could somebody describe this hole?  :)
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Chris Cupit

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2010, 06:47:36 PM »
I will admit to not loving it at first but my last two rounds have given me a far greater appreciation for it.  It is a pretty steep uphill par five that I first described as a "long slog" and I know it gave Pat a heart attack to read it but I even went so far as to say I preferred #9 to #18. :)

I have developed a greater appreciation for the skyline green and having finally played in enough weather conditions I have seen the hole easily reachable with a mid iron when clearing the left bunker is easy, to being a full three shotter when you had to play well out to the right off the tee.  I'm still not sure the second shot has my full attention but I have a much greater appreciation for the drive and approach shot.  Also the contours in and around the green are nice.

I will say that the Sebonic clubhouse and the additional cottages do detract from the old view but that certainly isn't NGLA's fault.
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Patrick_Mucci

Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2010, 09:15:37 PM »
Chris,

The next time you're there, try playing from the flat section adjacent to the gate.

It's about 50 yards back from the current tee and brings the left side bunker into play for the longer hitter and makes the second shot far more than a mid iron.

From 550, it's one hell of a hole.
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Chris Cupit

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #13 on: October 19, 2010, 08:55:15 AM »
I must have missed that one.  I thought we were playing the back tees and it was very windy which made #18 play much shorter.  When we walked off #17 we went back and to the right toward the gate and the tee seemed elevated about two or three feet from the road but we did not go across the road so if there was a new tee we must have missed it or it was not open??

#1 was a full drive and my 9 iron came up short from 115 or so.  18 was very downwind and my drive carried the left bunker and ran into the right bunker on the other side of the fairway from where I had about 205-215 and I somehow scared a 5 iron onto the green.

Maybe the hole was 530ish from where we played--I don't have a scorecard and really don't remember?  It doesn't seem like it was 500 yards but I could be very wrong--I'm getter older and even though the drive I hit was greatly wind assisted I could be that far off.

Anyway, having played now in several different winds I was able to appreciate the hole much more!
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 09:27:02 AM by Chris Cupit »
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Chris Cupit

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2010, 09:32:14 AM »
Ugh.  I am getting old :(

We played the tee that based on google maps is actually a little left and just off 17 green next to the road.  I couldn't see another tee but I assume you would go across the street so the new tee is maybe a bit behind you and on your right as you come into the gates?

Oh well, I did make birdie from the up/500 tees ;)

From that tee I am not sure I could ever do anything but play out to the right.  I guess that tee is not for me!
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Sean Leary

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2010, 10:32:39 AM »
Quote from: Chris Cupit on October 19, 2010, 09:32:14 AM
Ugh.  I am getting old :(

We played the tee that based on google maps is actually a little left and just off 17 green next to the road.  I couldn't see another tee but I assume you would go across the street so the new tee is maybe a bit behind you and on your right as you come into the gates?

Oh well, I did make birdie from the up/500 tees ;)

From that tee I am not sure I could ever do anything but play out to the right.  I guess that tee is not for me!

That tee doesn't exist. It is where Pat would like to see one built....
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Gene Greco

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2010, 11:25:47 AM »
Quote from: Sean Leary on October 19, 2010, 10:32:39 AM
That tee doesn't exist. It is where Pat would like to see one built....


Hmmmmm.

Where have I seen this before? ;)

 

(However, I believe for the 2013 Walker Cup Patrick may get his wish. Other changes may be in store as well.)
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"...I don't believe it is impossible to build a modern course as good as Pine Valley.  To me, Sand Hills is just as good as Pine Valley..."    TOM DOAK  November 6th, 2010

Anthony Gray

Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2010, 05:41:20 PM »


   At 550 the clubhouse would be in play a great deal more.And who wants to be the guy who lands one on a plate of lobster?That 2nd shot is pinched between the high grass and the clubhouse so where to you play the miss?

   Anthony

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Jason Baran

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2010, 01:41:03 PM »
18th at NGLA might have the most beautiful flagpole of any golf course in the world.
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Jay Flemma

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Re: 18th at NGLA
« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2010, 11:27:12 PM »
I love it.  Coming up 18 with everyone watching from the dining room, and knowing your walking your last steps in centuries of history just inspires me mto no end.  I have a holy moment every time.  I love finising on that green and then basking in the warm glow the rest of the month:):)
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