[Tom Birkert]

Wow! Looks like it could cause some problems. It's right at the back and as close to the middle as they can go.

Jason Gore has had a 10 already.

[John Moore II]

I almost posted something about that. That is just a crazy green in general. Go 3 feet long and you're 25 feet off the green, 3 feet short and you're back 25 yards in the fairway. Very interesting.

[Matt_Cohn]

So what's the safest play?

[Tom Birkert]

So what's the safest play?

The safe play is over the bunker, short of the pin and slightly left of it.

Long looks like total death.

Personally, I don't know what the fuss about this hole is. Played it twice, and I'm -1 on it!!

[Mac Plumart]

I have a suspicion that good ol' hole #14 will have a big impact on determining the championship today.

Will someone birdie it?  Who (of the leaders) will blow up?

I say Phil makes double. (he ended up making bogey)

Ernie birdie.                 (he ended up making bogey)

McDowell par.              (he ended up making bogey)

Woods double.             (he ended up making birdie)

Havert triple.                (he ended up making par)

Johnson quad.             (tv didn't show him play...I guess he's out of contention)


So, Woods and Havert gained on the field...but no real blow ups.

See the hole is a piece of cake!!

[John Moore II]

14 will make the championship for sure. That green is just stupid. Way too much movement for a green with that kind of speed.

[Tom Birkert]

McDowell now has a hell of a shot. He should not aim this anywhere near the hole, needs to keep it on that tier and the safest way to do that is to go right of the pin.

Edit: He got SO lucky. Went at the pin, hit it too far, no idea how it didn't end up rolling back off the front of the green.

[John Moore II]

McDowell now has a hell of a shot. He should not aim this anywhere near the hole, needs to keep it on that tier and the safest way to do that is to go right of the pin.

He was lucky to keep that on the green. I've said it a dozen times, that green, as firm as it is and fast as it is, it just crazy. I mean, 5 feet short and you're way off the front. 5 feet long and you're over the back, now risking going way off the front again. Just ignorant.

[Mike McGuire]

The shaved banks around the green on 14 make it a silly hole. Plant it with rough so its not a joke hole.

[Terry Lavin]

Green needs to be blown up.

[John Moore II]

Green needs to be blown up.

That green would be magnificent if the green speeds were 10 instead of 13.

[Chris Buie]

It would be clearly unfair if it was a par-4 green.  The smart play is to lay up your second shot to your preferred approach distance and then hit it over the bunker like Tom said.  A player of this caliber should be able to do that.  I think it is on the edge of playability not quite over it like the 17th.  Again, it's a par-5 - so lay up smart and you should be able to put a wedge in the right area. 

[Chris Buie]

Laying up the proper approach distance is exactly what McDowell just did on 18.  It worked out pretty well.  Did you hear him talking to his caddy about hitting a two iron into 18 for his second shot?   The caddy served him well there talking him out of that.  He ended up hitting an 8-iron.  That left him with 100 yards.  That is going to work better (especially under that kind of nervy situation) rather than having to hit a feel shot from a short distance.
I wonder how many people know what lay up distance they will fare best with - and how many times they actually do it. 

[Sean Leary]

I wonder whether the area just over the bunker has been built up over time by players blasting out of that bunker? It looks like that part of the green is higher than the back, and I am wondering whether it was designed that way, or evolved over time?

[Adam Clayman]

Green needs to be blown up.

So, do most of the laws written in recent memory that you are forced to uphold..
 
 
Terry, You stick to the law and let those who respect other artists work, do the renovation.

That green is, as well as the whole hole has proven it's greatness this week.

[Terry Lavin]

Green needs to be blown up.

So, do most of the laws written in recent memory that you are forced to uphold..
 
 
Terry, You stick to the law and let those who respect other artists work, do the renovation.

That green is, as well as the whole hole has proven it's greatness this week.

And what is it that you stick to?  You're right and nobody's allowed to disagree with you?  Gimme a break.

It's a decent golf hole with a ridiculous, over-the-top, unfair green.

If Tom Doak or some other pro architect wants to correct me, I'll take it, but I'll reverse your sanctimony any day of the week.

[Chris Flamion]

Honestly I liked the green.  I felt that the run out areas were a little bit severe behind the green, but totally acceptable.  Over the course of the 12+ hours I watched over the week I only saw 2 people over and back or have one end up back at their feet.  Now I know more people had that problem, but each of the angles left a doable chip/pitch.  If you accept that it is harder than a par 5 then it is a great green.

The green is severe and that speed was too much for it, but it was not unfair. 

[Andrew Brown]

FWIW, (and I know that this has been discussed and mentioned ad nauseum) it seems that 14 has an extremely small pinnable area, and this creates a problem for the championship. All 4 days, the pin is in a fairly limited area, meaning the danger to the player is the same all 4 days.

If the green was altered, to give more variety to pin locations, thebn I don't mind the extreme trickiness of Sunday's pin. But all pitch shots played to the right spinning back 20 or more yards is a little maddening, leaving all players to have to play the same recovery from that stroke. There seemed no "bail out" away from the pin for any player to take.

Finally, how did McDowell's ball stay on the green?

Regards
Andrew

[TEPaul]

Andrew Brown:

The unique thing about #14 is not just its very small pinnable space (and in the same small area) but also that the rest of the green has absolutely no architectural ability to help approach shots and recovery shots get into that very small pinnable area-----very much the opposite in fact!

I have some experience with the unique difficulty of that green from what was known as the Gordon Gin World Pro-Am back in the late 1980s. In that tournament (even with the greens around 10) on the last day the asst super put the pin somewhat up the slope on the right and no ball would hold there around the pin. It created about a seven hour round and the hole became virtually unplayable with all balls rolling off the front to where some of those players were in thie Open. The pro who won the tournament actually intentionally played his ball in motion which is of course not permitted and for which he should've been DQed (apparently PB was embarrassed enough about that pin not to DQ him).

[Mark McKeever]

In the course's earlier years, could you actually put a pin on the right side of the green?  Or has the green always functioned this way?

Mark

[Carl Nichols]

#14 was only the 10th hardest hole yesterday, and the field averaged 5.2410 strokes playing it. 

[Mike Hendren]

For the most part the 14th hole was misplayed.  There were two legitimate options:

1.  Play the second for the front bunker.
2.  Lay up just short and right of the green.  Many player laying up to 100 +/- yards had their shots roll back off the green to an identical spot (I believe Mickelson even had to mark his ball in the fairway).  To a man, from there they played brilliant pitch shots, frequently saving par or like Tiger on Sunday kicking in a birdie.  The players were so focused on dialing in a yardage for their sand or gap wedges that it never dawned on them to take more club on the second to leave that apparently simple 40 yards pitch.  I thought that's what practice rounds are for.

Mike

[Sean Leary]

In the course's earlier years, could you actually put a pin on the right side of the green?  Or has the green always functioned this way?

Mark

I played it with a front right pin once a few years ago, in the winter when the greens were much slower...

[Adam Clayman]

Green needs to be blown up.

So, do most of the laws written in recent memory that you are forced to uphold..
 
 
Terry, You stick to the law and let those who respect other artists work, do the renovation.

That green is, as well as the whole hole has proven it's greatness this week.

And what is it that you stick to?  You're right and nobody's allowed to disagree with you?  Gimme a break.

It's a decent golf hole with a ridiculous, over-the-top, unfair green.

If Tom Doak or some other pro architect wants to correct me, I'll take it, but I'll reverse your sanctimony any day of the week.

There was no sanctimony. Just an opinion based on many many plays.

Give me a break. You made the point and I countered.  You want a bunch of ass kissing? Your honor? Fine!

[Terry Lavin]

Green needs to be blown up.

So, do most of the laws written in recent memory that you are forced to uphold..
 
 
Terry, You stick to the law and let those who respect other artists work, do the renovation.

That green is, as well as the whole hole has proven it's greatness this week.

And what is it that you stick to?  You're right and nobody's allowed to disagree with you?  Gimme a break.

It's a decent golf hole with a ridiculous, over-the-top, unfair green.

If Tom Doak or some other pro architect wants to correct me, I'll take it, but I'll reverse your sanctimony any day of the week.

There was no sanctimony. Just an opinion based on many many plays.

Give me a break. You made the point and I countered.  You want a bunch of ass kissing? Your honor? Fine!

You don't have to kiss mine, but you're welcome to scratch your own.

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