Shivas (aka the W-i-n-d-y city proponent
) I did very much say the same about ANGC -- especially speaking positively about the well done piece by Brad Klein. I agree with Brad's take that ANGC is overrated and should not be in the top ten.
When you talk about Bethpage Black let's also be clear the fundamental layout is still there. Minus a small change with the 18th green (taking it from a pure circular aspect to one that was pushed in slightly for a right greenside pin placement). All that was really done was improve the inadequate turf conditions.
Let's be clear -- Medinah has issues on what it wants to be --maybe a visit to the shrink would help?
I mean how many times has the 17th been altered? First, let's put the green near H20 with the beautiful corrigated wall in front of it -- I think I've seen pictures of some castles that had lesser defenses than that
. Then the club opts to put the green back and after a brief time decided to change it's mind once again. I guess the 3rd version will be near the water or am I missing something -- maybe they can get a fountain with a few fake ducks to lend it some defining purpose.
By the way -- doesn't the course have a replication enough times with par-3's that cross Lake Kadijah?
There is really nothing memorable about Medinah -- yes, it is long, it's tough and it has a ton of trees -- I say they should stretch it out next time to just under 8,000 yards and make the boys r-e-a-l-l-y earn it. However, the object word for the course is B-O-R-I-N-G ... just because you have logistics for holding tournaments does not make you ipso facto a great course worthy of being among the 20 best in America. I'll give you a two-course equivalent in other parts of the country -- Baltusrol / Lower (NJ) and Oakland Hills / South (MI).
Shivas:
You don't argue that Medinah is great by saying well look and see what they did with those other courses. Heck, I don't doubt that's true for some of them (look at some of examples above) but where does that mean that Medinah gets a free ride to be included as #13? Here you have a situation where a facility having served as a major host for a number of years (past and future) gives a course like Medinah a big push to the top. Look, I didn't say the course should not be rated at all -- don't want to start an earthquake with that -- but it's just not among the top 20 courses in America -- a borderline top 50 call at best. OK -- fire away when ready -- you may need to fire a bunker buster to get me ...