[Tim Nugent]

Having enjoyed the PB experience thread, I noticed that 2 of the strongest holes didn't seem to get much love , #9 and #10.

Why is that? And which do you like better (and why?).

[Anthony Gray]

  I would guess that 9 is not a favorite because of the difficulty. It is just too hard for the average player. The favorite hole are the ones that are easier to score on. 10 is a nice hole. You can miss short and have a chance. On 9 that bunker is tuff but the cucooya is almost unplayable.

  Anthony

[Jon Spaulding]

They don't get much love here because most beard pullers can't hit the ball.

#9 is a stellar half par hole, better as the old version in GS's book....but still one of the best. The loss of angle due to the roughed in fairway is a shame.

Would have been interesting to have seen the course when #10 was a par 5 with a risk/reward tee shot.

Both holes are inspired. My slight preference of #10 is due to the chance to see how the waves are and if anyone is getting barreled.

[Michael Wharton-Palmer]

I cannot imagine anybody on this site not appreciating thsoe two holes as two of the finest par fours in the world.
Both great great par fours, very challenging, especially number nine with that tiny green and a second shot of a hanging lie...awesome hole.
I think they get somewhat neglected because of their respective difficulty, but I believe everybody loves them for thier view if nothing else.

[Kalen Braley]

Couldn't agree more, these holes are total dog meat!!   

[Anthony Gray]

 The slant of the fairway does bother some. Played with a friend one time and he kept coomplaining about never having a flat lie. I said "Who cares...look arounnd"

  Anthony

[Tim Nugent]

I often wondered if it was because the tees are not against the shoreline and thus they present a little "unsettling" tee shot.  I believe Egan lengthened these holes and had nowhere else to go with them?  Would you rather see the tees directly behind #8 and #9 greens, even though the holes would be markedly shorter (for the resort player?)  Or do you think they would feel "cheated" not getting the same line as the Pros?

Or could it be that the setup of these sequential holes is too similar?

And Yes, that front left bunker on #9 is scarey.

[Adam Clayman]

The most common comment about the two holes, from the uninitiated, is how similar they are. Nothing could be further from the truth. They are completely different holes with major differences in the shot requirements, even though they go in the same direction on the compass.

The ninth requires hitting the ideal spots in the fairway, just to be able to think about carrying that huge fronting bunker. While the 190th requires missing the left fairway bunkers to get the kick down the hill.

BTW, There's no Kikuyu on Pebble.

[Bill_McBride]

The most common comment about the two holes, from the uninitiated, is how similar they are. Nothing could be further from the truth. They are completely different holes with major differences in the shot requirements, even though they go in the same direction on the compass.

The ninth requires hitting the ideal spots in the fairway, just to be able to think about carrying that huge fronting bunker. While the 190th requires missing the left fairway bunkers to get the kick down the hill.

BTW, There's no Kikuyu on Pebble.

Could Anthony have been thinking of ice plant?   

[Anthony Gray]

The most common comment about the two holes, from the uninitiated, is how similar they are. Nothing could be further from the truth. They are completely different holes with major differences in the shot requirements, even though they go in the same direction on the compass.

The ninth requires hitting the ideal spots in the fairway, just to be able to think about carrying that huge fronting bunker. While the 190th requires missing the left fairway bunkers to get the kick down the hill.

BTW, There's no Kikuyu on Pebble.

Could Anthony have been thinking of ice plant?   

   The pro shop says its there.....then again who are they?

  Anthony

[Adam Clayman]

Bill, There's none of that either.
 
He's likely talking about the long grass in the ravine front left of the green.

Ten years ago there wasn't a stolon.  How else has the management of this place dropped the ball?

[Eric Smith]

http://www.thegolfchannel.com/tour-insider/major-changes-at-pebble-28227/

So writes Golf Channel's Brian Hewitt (10 years ago)

...On the sixth hole of the second round of the 2000 U.S. Open at Pebble Beach Tiger Woods famously and impossibly hoisted a 7-iron from a nasty lie in the deep right kikuyu rough to an uphill green from 202 yards. The ball stopped less than 15 feet away...

[Adam Clayman]

Journalists are always great sources for historical accuracy. 

[Anthony Gray]

Journalists are always great sources for historical accuracy. 

  Neither are people that work there

  A

[Gary Slatter]

The most common comment about the two holes, from the uninitiated, is how similar they are. Nothing could be further from the truth. They are completely different holes with major differences in the shot requirements, even though they go in the same direction on the compass.

The ninth requires hitting the ideal spots in the fairway, just to be able to think about carrying that huge fronting bunker. While the 190th requires missing the left fairway bunkers to get the kick down the hill.

BTW, There's no Kikuyu on Pebble.

Could Anthony have been thinking of ice plant?   

   The pro shop says its there.....then again who are they?

  Anthony

It was there when I last played PB.   
Both 9 and 10 are difficult driving holes for me, hard to set up and I've played a slider most of my life!

[jonathan_becker]

I've only walked a few holes at pebble on my only visit, so I can't talk about playing the hole.

But I heard Ran on his radio broadcast say that #9 was one of his favorite par 4s on the planet.  I think I was 1 of maybe 5 people that listened that day!! 

[Adam Clayman]

Guys in the pro shop might not know what KK looks like.

Eric, Nobody could hit that shot out of KK. Tiger definitely did not.

[Eric Smith]

I honestly don't doubt you Adam re: whether or not it's there.  You worked there and I believe you would know.  It's just that there are pages and pages of articles found on google that says it is or was there. 

This one for example says that Nicklaus' team eradicated it:
http://www.worldgolf.com/wglibrary/ross/ross1.html

It's kinda weird that everyone's got it wrong in their reporting.

[Tom Yost]

The most common comment about the two holes, from the uninitiated, is how similar they are. Nothing could be further from the truth. They are completely different holes with major differences in the shot requirements, even though they go in the same direction on the compass.

The ninth requires hitting the ideal spots in the fairway, just to be able to think about carrying that huge fronting bunker. While the 190th requires missing the left fairway bunkers to get the kick down the hill.

BTW, There's no Kikuyu on Pebble.

Could Anthony have been thinking of ice plant?   

"cucooya"

[Adam Clayman]

Eric, It's not hard to believe reporters got it wrong, is it? Did you swallow the blue or the red pill?  


Anyone in touch with Mark Michaud? He'd be the definitive word as to the conditions ten years ago. Although I'm very confident there was a concerted effort to eradicate it, plus, I played on KK at Pacific Grove everyday. Pebble's turf (rough) was never similar. One of the first things I noticed on my first play there in 95' was the type of grass the rough was. Blue or rye. No KK.

[Anthony Gray]

Eric, It's not hard to believe reporters got it wrong, is it? Did you swallow the blue or the red pill?  


Anyone in touch with Mark Michaud? He'd be the definitive word as to the conditions ten years ago. Although I'm very confident there was a concerted effort to eradicate it, plus, I played on KK at Pacific Grove everyday. Pebble's turf (rough) was never similar. One of the first things I noticed on my first play there in 95' was the type of grass the rough was. Blue or rye. No KK.

  Why would you make a "concerted effort to eradicate it" if IT did not exsist?

  Anthony


 

[Adam Clayman]

Anthony, KK is a very aggressive strain. It is in the area and requires a constant eradication effort to stay on top of it's spread.

A small patch will spring up form time to time and that's why you need to eradicate. Unless the Ferris group has cut expenses and allowed it grow for ten years.

I surely hope your tone is an inquisitive one.

[Anthony Gray]

Anthony, KK is a very aggressive strain. It is in the area and requires a constant eradication effort to stay on top of it's spread.

A small patch will spring up form time to time and that's why you need to eradicate. Unless the Ferris group has cut expenses and allowed it grow for ten years.

I surely hope your tone is an inquisitive one.

  Tone?? Fish Bar??   Mark is useing the snow plow now. Tons of snow at Shinny these days. Carson Palmer played PB during his honeymoon. I'll call him.

  Anthony

[Tom_Doak]

I believe a lot of the nasty rough at Pebble is tall fescue, not kikuyu [though there may well be some of the latter].

Tall fescue is a totally different grass than fine fescue, which is what we usually talk about as "fescue".  Tall fescue is actually a warm-season grass, fairly coarse-bladed ... you could mistake it for bermuda or kikuyu if you don't look too hard.  I know that when I played Pebble ten years ago [in the media day a month before the Open], we had to really dig to find a couple of balls in tall fescue rough on the bunker faces.

Oh, as to the original question ... I think #9 at Pebble is a MUCH more interesting hole than #10, because of the hollow in front of the green on the left.

[Anthony Gray]

I believe a lot of the nasty rough at Pebble is tall fescue, not kikuyu [though there may well be some of the latter].

Tall fescue is a totally different grass than fine fescue, which is what we usually talk about as "fescue".  Tall fescue is actually a warm-season grass, fairly coarse-bladed ... you could mistake it for bermuda or kikuyu if you don't look too hard.  I know that when I played Pebble ten years ago [in the media day a month before the Open], we had to really dig to find a couple of balls in tall fescue rough on the bunker faces.

Oh, as to the original question ... I think #9 at Pebble is a MUCH more interesting hole than #10, because of the hollow in front of the green on the left.

  Today I asked the pro shop if KK was there. He said in some of the outer areas. I asked about the area behind 9 green and aroiund the barranca at two. He stated that it is a form of fescue. He also said the US Open people do not want the KK. But it can be found in certain areas. But then again What would he know?

  Anthony

 

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