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Ran Morrissett

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Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« on: January 27, 2010, 09:05:03 AM »
Everyone loves finding a hidden gem. I will never forget when Gary Planos told me in Hawaii in 1999 that Beverly Country Club was one such one. I had never even heard the name before but I filed it away and of course, Gary was right and what a treat to make its acquaintance a few years later.
 
Roll the clock forward to last Tuesday night in Chicago and here is what I heard from various people about another little known south-side gem:
 
*Flossmoor has the best set of greens in the greater Chicago area.
*Flossmoor has the best collection of par fours in Chicago.
*Flossmoor has done the best tree work of any club in Chicago.
*Flossmoor's back nine is the best in Chicago.
*Finally, ~ half the people at the GolfClubAtlas gathering seemed to prefer it to Medinah as a place for a regular game.
 
Really?  :o WOW! Can't wait to head back there this summer to see this place where they started playing golf in 1900 and where Tweedie, W. Watson, .and Collis worked.
 
Similar to the resurgence going on in Cleveland, Chicago too is enjoying a new wave of appreciation for many of its Golden Age courses. As chronicled in Greg Ohlendorf's outstanding In My Opinion piece, Flossmoor has come a long way in an unbelievable short amount of time, thanks in part to the removal of 2,000 plus trees, width being returned and hazards turned perpendicular to play.This work comes at the perfect time: With times tight and people suffering, clubs/courses need to put their best foot forward in order to hold and then attract new members. Flossmoor's work done by Ray Hearn was performed economically but the result is none the less startling as both an aesthetic and strategic smash hit. See for yourself!

Cheers,
« Last Edit: January 31, 2010, 02:16:50 PM by Ran Morrissett »

PCCraig

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2010, 09:31:04 AM »
What a fantastic opinion piece! Thank you to Greg and Dan for all the hard work in putting together a document of this size. I loved the before and after pictures of the course, as well as the great interview with the GCA which added to the transformation history greatly.

Can't wait to hear more about the project later in Feb. at the GCA dinner in Chicago.
H.P.S.

Kevin Cahoon

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2010, 09:54:43 AM »
As a member of Flossmoor, I can't thank Greg enough for the work he has done to help bang the drum for the club. I am extremely pleased that this is my club. I am happy to show it off to fellow members when my schedule permits.

Jud_T

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2010, 10:51:57 AM »
Greg,

Great work! Very thoroughly researched and the before and after photos are great!  I already forwarded the link to our surprise guests!
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Tim_Cronin

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2010, 12:35:33 AM »
It's great to see this online. I was just paging through the media guide (really a limited-edition hardcover book) last night. The work by Greg and Dan is as good as the restoration, and that's saying something. Flossmoor really is a hidden gem. Must be something about clubs on Western Avenue. :)
The website: www.illinoisgolfer.net
On Twitter: @illinoisgolfer

Tom MacWood

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2010, 06:33:40 AM »
That is a great report...I found it very enlightening. Back in the 20s Flossmoor was considered one of the elite courses in the country and its interesting to learn how the course evolved over the years.

Did Collis have distinct bunkering style?

Dan Moore

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2010, 12:20:39 PM »
Collis bunkers were deep ovals as seen in the 1920's photo of the 6th green. Similar bunkers can be seen at nearby Collis' courses Longwood and Glenwoodie.
"Is there any other game which produces in the human mind such enviable insanity."  Bernard Darwin

PThomas

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2010, 12:36:48 PM »
nice work Greg; i really enjoyed the outing there last year!
199 played, only Augusta National left to play!

Scott_Burroughs

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2010, 12:55:10 PM »
When they renamed the course from Homewood to Flossmoor, was the owner a dentist?

Dan Moore

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2010, 07:10:39 PM »
Here is a tour I posted of Collis' Longwood with views of wjhat is left of the original bunkering. 

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,39006.0/

And here is a tour of Collis' Glenwoodie. 

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,38911.0/

Some of these bunker forms were still in place at Flossmoor pre-restoration, however much of the original bunkering had been worn out or grassed in.  Flossmoor's distinctive fanged bunker on 16 seems to have had the fangs added after Collis' tenure with the club.   

"Is there any other game which produces in the human mind such enviable insanity."  Bernard Darwin

Tom MacWood

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2010, 06:10:05 AM »
Dan
I can see what you mean, Collis had a very unusual style. Those little talked about Chicago architects like Collis, Darray and O'Neil have always interested me.

Mike Nuzzo

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2010, 09:25:37 AM »
Flossmor's work done by Ray Hearn was performed economically but the result is none the less startling as both an aesthetic and strategic smash hit. See for yourself!

Nice work & history Greg

Ran
Do you like the new bunkering?
Thinking of Bob, Rihc, Bill, George, Neil, Dr. Childs, & Tiger.

Greg Ohlendorf

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2010, 01:05:52 PM »
Thanks to all for the kind comments and especially to Dan for his assistance.

Tom,

Collis had a big influence after Tweedie's original routing was completed. The majority of Tweedie's routing remains and he took advantage of many of the natural tee and green positions on the property. Collis made many improvements during his tenure as greens keeper and pro. How about handling both of those duties today!?!?

Greg

Jeff Goldman

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmor course profile
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2010, 02:01:15 AM »
Was any consideration given to restoring Collis's bunker style?  Seems very cool.
That was one hellacious beaver.

J_ Crisham

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2010, 02:06:12 PM »
Greg,    Very impressive and inclusive review-wow.  You weren't kidding about the depth of the research you performed. Will talk soon,   Good Work,  Jack

Greg Ohlendorf

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2010, 06:27:49 PM »
Jeff,

I can't speak for Ray Hearn on whether or not he considered the oval Collis bunkers. I think he wanted to make a dramatic improvement to the bunkers he found when he first got to the club as they had been redesigned by committee too many times. He ended up with a golden age distinctive style that he felt would take the course back to the classic days of golf architecture. It reminds me of the dynamic bunkering change that was made at you own OFCC North which was a big positive improvement before the open.

Greg

Phil McDade

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2010, 07:11:17 PM »
A thread on Flossmoor's bunkering, with some observations by Hearn and some comparative pics:

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,41574.0/

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #17 on: February 12, 2010, 11:26:04 AM »
The one thing that stands out on the aerial photo is the way in which the fairways are connected on holes 16-17-18.  There doesn't appear to be any "golf" reason for doing so ... am I missing something?

Phil McDade

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2010, 12:08:24 PM »
The one thing that stands out on the aerial photo is the way in which the fairways are connected on holes 16-17-18.  There doesn't appear to be any "golf" reason for doing so ... am I missing something?

Tom:

I'm not entirely sure of the reason for it; it does, at ground level, look really cool.

Here is an excerpt and picture about this fairway from a thread I posted last summer about Flossmoor:

From the left side of the 16th fairway is this wonderful interior view of the course – under Hearn’s revamping, large numbers of trees were cleared between the 16th, 17th, and 18th fairways, and the grass mowed at fairway height. Golf in its very beginning was a much simpler game – a ball and club taken to a field. The notion of individual hole corridors came later in the game’s development. The open area featured on Flossmoor’s closing trio of holes harkens back to the game’s early roots.

Greg Ohlendorf

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #19 on: February 12, 2010, 08:34:17 PM »
Tom,

The last three holes at FCC had become very tight due to 20+ willow trees that had been planted a number of decades ago. One of the major goals of the renovation was to remove these trees and rework the look of these three holes. The idea to connect these fairways came as a result of several factors. There is a "grand lawn" behind the clubhouse. This area of shortly mown grass runs from behind the 16 green, past the 17th tee and behind the 18th green. It has been used for many club functions and we are told that at time during the club's long history, cups had been cut in this area as a type of fun putting area behind the clubhouse. Ray Hearn thought he would like to replicate the look of this "grand lawn" out on the course and connect our closing holes. As Phil mentions, we wanted to go back to a simpler time where the holes were not all run in tight and distinct corridors.

This area definitely comes into play from the 16th tee. Before our renovation work, anything hit even a bit left on 16 was in the willows and the players second shot was completely shot off from the green. With the new left bunker, a long hitter can now take on that bunker and play into that part of the fairway that is connected with 17 and have a play into the 16th green. The sight lines on this part of the course have also been greatly enhanced as well. Both 16 and 17 have long been considered outstanding par 4s in the Chicago area and the new views offered by the renovation are really special.

Greg

Phil McDade

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2010, 08:46:59 AM »
One other thought on the mown Flossmoor fairways on 16, 17 and 18. I've never been there, but a number of GCA posters have extolled the virtues of the Sheep Ranch in Bandon -- not just because of its great golf terrain, but the sense of inventiveness that can come by playing it. With no real playing corridors, the player is free to wander around and create holes guided solely by his imagination. Coming upon that fairway area at the 16th at Flossmoor, I immmediately had a similar feeling -- I wanted to take a detour, just to see where it would take me (as an invited guest, of course, I did not ;).) That's obviously not its intent, but it's a feeling I've rarely if ever encountered on what is really a traditional American parkland course, where the playing corridors are almost always strictly defined. This had a sense of (potential) adventure to it -- a really neat design element.

Tom MacWood

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #21 on: February 18, 2010, 06:28:23 AM »
Were you able to put a date on this drawing, or figure out who drew this? The layout looks very similar to the layout at the time Watson redesigned the golf course.

Dan Moore

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #22 on: February 18, 2010, 01:31:37 PM »
Tom,

The map dates from sometime after the 1909 Western ( the original 17th and 18th holes were still in play in 1909) and the relocation of the clubhouse in 1915.  It was clearly after the changes to the 17th and 18th holes (2nd and 3rd holes today) attributed to Watson.  Do you have dates when Watson was at Flossmoor? 

The map was published in the Club's centennial book.  No one at the Club seems to know where it came from.  I have yet to identify the exact source of the map either, but my hunch is that it was produced at the time of the 1913 Western Amateur.  One of the better maps from that era, assuming it is from that era. 
"Is there any other game which produces in the human mind such enviable insanity."  Bernard Darwin

Tom MacWood

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #23 on: February 18, 2010, 08:23:28 PM »
Dan
I thought I detected some similarities in the drawing of the bunkers in that map and this ad from Watson and this drawing of Homewood from around 1911.


Greg Ohlendorf

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Re: Greg Ohlendorf's In My Opinion Flossmoor course profile
« Reply #24 on: February 20, 2010, 01:50:52 PM »
Tom and Dan,

I  have been looking for the original of the routing map in question since the beginning of this project. I believe that it is on loan to a golf museum in northern Illinois. I hope to track it down soon. Nevertheless, when it was published in the club's centennial book in 1999, the caption indicated that it was from 1906. Based on the individuals who did that research, I would believe that the 1906 date would be very reliable. Hope that helps.

Greg

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