[Brett Waters]

Hello GCA'ers! I am new to posting here (but have loved the website for a long time). I have a question for you guys: Of the places you have been (in the country), and taking in all considerations, where would you love to be able to stay for 3 months and work at? I am a Professional Golf Management major and I'm currently looking for a place to work for 3 months this summer. For those of you who don't know, Professional Golf Management majors must complete 16 months of internships to graduate.

[Trey Kemp]

Brett, what PGM program are you in?  I was in the program at Methodist College in NC for a short period of time and I remember they had a good network with clubs and courses in the Pinehurst area.  In my opinion I would  try to intern at as many different types of facilities as possible (Private, Resort, Public, etc...).  That will help you decide where you fit in the best.

[Garland Bayley]

Bandon

[Phil_the_Author]

Brett,

Bethpage. With the U.S. Open there in June, the amount of work that will be done both before and after it is played on all 5 courses will provide a unique educational opportunity. In addition, as a municipal golf course, it opens up other avenues of the business that you might not have considered. Finally, between all of the "dignitaries" and people from throughout the world of golf on every level who will be on site, it will also provide a tremendous network building opportunity.

[Jim Thompson]

Brett,

I would suggest getting involved with a large resort with hotel backing along the lines of Ritz Carelton.  In the long term, you will have better return on your time and, if you treat it like a three month on the job interview, you will be very a couple years ahead of your classmates after graduation!

Cheers!

JT

[Pat Burke]

Brett, what PGM program are you in?  I was in the program at Methodist College in NC for a short period of time and I remember they had a good network with clubs and courses in the Pinehurst area.  In my opinion I would  try to intern at as many different types of facilities as possible (Private, Resort, Public, etc...).  That will help you decide where you fit in the best.

I would second this advice.  Our program had a Methodist Grad work with us for a year after completing his internship.  He pretty much followed the pattern you suggest, and came to us a a very capable, and sharp (and young) Head Pro.  Methodist does a very good job

[Casey Wade]

Brett,

What college are you attending?

I am a Ferris State graduate and former alumni association president for our PGMAA.  I graduated in 1996.  I agree that Dr. Hogge does a very good job promoting Methodist.  Matt Pinter, our coordinator is one of the best men I have ever been associated with.

My suggestion is to stay involved in your program and help out students after you have graduated.  I remember the alumni who did this with me!

As for where to go, you need to figure out for yourself which type of facility you would like to work at.  Public, Private, or Resort.  The Ritz-Carlton group along with the Marriott group are very sound.  I have quite a few friends from college that work for them in various jobs.(upper management down to outside service)

I found my love in doing everything at my facility.  I am at a higher end public facility North of Houston, Texas. 

I have worked at "goat tracks" to high end private (Whispering Pines) to find out what I really enjoy.  It doesn't have to be a "named" course for you to enjoy what and where you are.  I have known a couple of guys who were assistants at Augusta.  For 3 months before the Masters, all they did was check in merchandise.  That doesn't sound like that much fun to me!

I know I have gotten off track, but find what type of facility you would like to work at and for and go from there!

Good luck and if I can be of any assistance, please do not hesitate to pm me.

Casey

[John Moore II]

For three months I could deal with anywhere. So, try and get the best place you can get just for resume purposes. You ever heard of AMF Golf Management? Go take a look at that website and those courses. Get on any of those and you have a pretty good gig just because they are all pretty high end places with very good connections.

However, I can echo what some others have said, if you plan on staying in the business (certainly you do at a PGM university) make sure you find where you fit. I can't stand the club business and ass kissing all the numbnut, dickhead members. I'll never go back to a club, at least not one with members. Just work to find your best fit, otherwise you'll really come to dislike the golf business. Thats the key to the golf business, finding your fit.

[Bart Bradley]

For three months I could deal with anywhere. So, try and get the best place you can get just for resume purposes. You ever heard of AMF Golf Management? Go take a look at that website and those courses. Get on any of those and you have a pretty good gig just because they are all pretty high end places with very good connections.

However, I can echo what some others have said, if you plan on staying in the business (certainly you do at a PGM university) make sure you find where you fit. I can't stand the club business and ass kissing all the numbnut, dickhead members. I'll never go back to a club, at least not one with members. Just work to find your best fit, otherwise you'll really come to dislike the golf business. Thats the key to the golf business, finding your fit.

Wow John...that was a bit offensive...

Anyway, Brett...one of my club takes several PGM interns every year (Grandfather golf and CC)..it is a wonderful place to spend the summer ...BUT, I don't know what it is like as an intern...my advice would be to ask the upper classmen at your school about the places they have been assigned and find out which places offer the best experiences...Good luck and IM me if you want to know more about Grandfather.

Bart

[Kyle Harris]

Brett,

If this is your first internship, my advice is to keep off the big dogs and go somewhere close to home and somewhere with which you are familiar. Be active in the local section and play a few events. Internships get more difficult and time consuming as you go on!

[John Moore II]

For three months I could deal with anywhere. So, try and get the best place you can get just for resume purposes. You ever heard of AMF Golf Management? Go take a look at that website and those courses. Get on any of those and you have a pretty good gig just because they are all pretty high end places with very good connections.

However, I can echo what some others have said, if you plan on staying in the business (certainly you do at a PGM university) make sure you find where you fit. I can't stand the club business and ass kissing all the numbnut, dickhead members. I'll never go back to a club, at least not one with members. Just work to find your best fit, otherwise you'll really come to dislike the golf business. Thats the key to the golf business, finding your fit.

Wow John...that was a bit offensive...

Anyway, Brett...one of my club takes several PGM interns every year (Grandfather golf and CC)..it is a wonderful place to spend the summer ...BUT, I don't know what it is like as an intern...my advice would be to ask the upper classmen at your school about the places they have been assigned and find out which places offer the best experiences...Good luck and IM me if you want to know more about Grandfather.

Bart

Well, it wasn't my intent to be offensive, I just think the young man aught to know exactly what he is getting into going in the golf business. I didn't, and I will admit it. It took me a good bit of fumbling around to find a job I liked. I had 3 long standing, older PGA professionals ask me flat out why I was getting into the golf business and I really didn't have an answer. Actually, one of them bluntly told me that I probably should stay out of the business, especially if I wanted to play any amount. I should have listened to him. I just think the man aught to have some good straight edge suggestions and just make sure he knows exactly what he's getting into. The golf business isn't the rosy business that many people want to think it is.

[Brett Waters]

I go to NC State. I'll check AMF out. My biggest problem for this internship is finding people to take me for just 3 months. Almost everyone I've contacted (about 16-18 clubs), is only looking for 6-7 month interns.

Fortunately, I have been able to travel most of the SE and some of the Mid-Adlantic. I would like to be able to use these internships as oppurtunities to travel places I have never been and may never get a chance to see again.

[jeffwarne]

However, I can echo what some others have said, if you plan on staying in the business (certainly you do at a PGM university) make sure you find where you fit. I can't stand the club business and ass kissing all the numbnut, dickhead members. I'll never go back to a club, at least not one with members.

John,
After posting that on the internet , I'd say you won't have to worry about going back.

Did it ever occur to you why THREE people asked you the same question?

The golf busines CAN be quite rosy, just like any other business-It can also be tough-just like any other business. It's all in what you make of it.
My staff and I play quite a bit of golf-I hire only hire guys who enjoy it and make time for it, and I structure my job and theirs around it.

My advice to Brett would be to try to get a job at a course (private, resort, or daily fee) with a well known and/or mentoring Head pro, or teaching pro, and or facility-Regardless of where he wants to end up. 
With experience and contacts such as that, where he ends up will be his choice.

Which 3 months Brett? (that makes a big difference)
I had an intern who went down and registered for classes,spoke to his teachers, and came back to finish the busiest last 2 weeks of my season.
This was prearranged as a condition of my hiring him.
He now is a graduate and has two great jobs as showing initiative and creativity is crucial, and most important you must show what YOU can do for the organization.

[Brett Waters]

Classes end in early May, so the internship would begin mid-late May and last through mid-late August.

[PCCraig]

brett-

I would check out KemperSports...they operate a ton of courses all over the country (including bandon dunes) and are based out of Chicago. They hire a lot of PGM guys to work just the summer months in both the shop and outside (where you can actually make some tip money).

Just a thought.

[jeffwarne]

Bret,
I would suggest investigating finding a way to stay nearer to Labor Day
and you'll see a lot of doors open up.
tough to have a guy leave mid August

[Brett Waters]

Bret,
I would suggest investigating finding a way to stay nearer to Labor Day
and you'll see a lot of doors open up.
tough to have a guy leave mid August

Not much I can do about it. I have to be back in time for school. I don't have anything to do with the dates - it's solely up to the school.

[Bryan Bergner]

Brett

Are you required to complete all of your intership inside the golf shop?  Do they require you to put time in on the grounds crew as well?

BB

[Brett Waters]

Brett

Are you required to complete all of your intership inside the golf shop?  Do they require you to put time in on the grounds crew as well?

BB

I actually believe I could perform duties with the grounds crew, but I'm not 100% sure. The only stipulation, I believe, is that I work under a PGA of America professional. So I don't see a difference in working grounds, outside services (which is 95% of all 1st year, 3 month internships), inside operations, a teaching academy, etc.

[Kyle Harris]

Brett

Are you required to complete all of your intership inside the golf shop?  Do they require you to put time in on the grounds crew as well?

BB

I actually believe I could perform duties with the grounds crew, but I'm not 100% sure. The only stipulation, I believe, is that I work under a PGA of America professional. So I don't see a difference in working grounds, outside services (which is 95% of all 1st year, 3 month internships), inside operations, a teaching academy, etc.

The difference between working on the grounds crew and all those others...

...on the grounds crew you'll actually work. 

You won't be able to do an internship as a member of a grounds crew since you would probably rarely, if ever, see the golf pro in such capacity.

[jeffwarne]

Brett,
I would suggest investigating finding a way to stay nearer to Labor Day
and you'll see a lot of doors open up.
tough to have a guy leave mid August

Not much I can do about it. I have to be back in time for school. I don't have anything to do with the dates - it's solely up to the school.

Brett,
Wrong answer.

[Bryan Bergner]

Brett

Here's my 2 cents

A long, long time ago (around 8-9 years ago  ) I was a PGA apprentice with hopes of one day becoming a PGA Professional.  I worked for a PGA Pro at a high class practice facility.  I taught countless children and adult beginners the fundamentals of not only building a swing but the essentials of integrity and honesty.  However, I had a very unique working arrangement.  I was also responsible for maintaining the teeing areas, practice greens and 4 hole practice course in the morning before I would teach.  Essentially, I was a Superintendent in the morning then changed into a golf Professional in the evening.  Because I had invested so much hard work on the course, I gained a valuable understanding of what drives Superintendents and what it takes to maintain a course.  Then I was able to teach kids and other beginners much more then the golf swing but how to handle themselves on and around the course.  I eventually passed  my Player Ability Test for the PGA and soon realized that turf was for me. 

During our golf course renovation this passed year we had the assistant pro join our grounds crew because the pro shop was closed.  He was amazed at what we did and had no clue as to the amount that went into such a thing.  Like myself, he gained a valuable understanding that I believe many Golf Professionals should but do not have. 

So I would suggest that you find a place where you can sit in with the grounds crew and work with them from time to time.  If you're in this business because you have a passion for golf then you owe it to yourself to experience it.

Bryan Bergner
Assistant Superintendent
Westmoor Country Club 

[Pat Burke]

Bret,
I would suggest investigating finding a way to stay nearer to Labor Day
and you'll see a lot of doors open up.
tough to have a guy leave mid August

Not much I can do about it. I have to be back in time for school. I don't have anything to do with the dates - it's solely up to the school.

Brett, send me a private message, may have a part time available , but don't know that it would work

[Michael Blake]

Brett,

Bethpage. With the U.S. Open there in June, the amount of work that will be done both before and after it is played on all 5 courses will provide a unique educational opportunity. In addition, as a municipal golf course, it opens up other avenues of the business that you might not have considered. Finally, between all of the "dignitaries" and people from throughout the world of golf on every level who will be on site, it will also provide a tremendous network building opportunity.

I agree with Phillip.  Seems like a great/unique opportunty.

[John Moore II]

However, I can echo what some others have said, if you plan on staying in the business (certainly you do at a PGM university) make sure you find where you fit. I can't stand the club business and ass kissing all the numbnut, dickhead members. I'll never go back to a club, at least not one with members.

John,
After posting that on the internet , I'd say you won't have to worry about going back.

Did it ever occur to you why THREE people asked you the same question?

Yeah, I know why they asked me that. One because he was a good friend of mine and while he didn't say 'why do you want to get in the business' said that financially and otherwise, I'd likely be better off steering away from the golf business. The other 2 were PGA members wh ohad been in the business for 25 years or more, had both been kind of shafted by members at other clubs where they used to work and wanted to make sure I knew exactly what I was getting into. One of them said he had told his own son the same thing, that if he really liked playing, he should try and go on the tour and not even think about getting a club job. If he couldn't make it playing, just get a 'regular' job and play for fun. Funny thing is, I heard another older pro echo this exact same thing about a year later to me. The golf business just isn't for everyone, people aught to really take a look before hand to make sure its for them.

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