Extremes...

[Chip Gaskins]

What are the courses that have very high extremes in hole greatness?   One hole is the "top of the class" and one hole is "are you serious?"

My initial thought is Maidstone....#2 might be the worst Top 100 hole and #9 could easily be the best links hole in America...

Are there any others that come to mind?

- Pebble #3 versus #8
- Pinehurst 2 #11 versus # 5
- Merion #3 versus #14
- NGLA #2 versus #8
- St. Andrews #10 versus #17
- Bethpage #3 versus #4
- Royal Portrush #17 versus #5

[Bob Jenkins]

Capilano #1 (worst) vs. Capilano #18 (best). Both par 5s but if ever there was a par 5 that is really a par 4 it is #1 at Cap.

#18 is amazing. Uphill most of the way with the green perched into the hillside below the clubhouse.   A true 3 shotter but big boys can go for it in 2 but any miss hit at all will leave them on the hillside with a very awkward wedge into the green.

If Cap had more than one real par 5, it would be amazing. In addition to #1, # 3, # 5 and # 10 are par 5s but all of those are easily reachable in 2 for a reasonably big hitter. The par 4s, are, however, quite difficult.

[Matt_Cohn]

Royal Melbourne West #2-6 vs. #15. But I think Mackenzie did that on purpose, if I understand correctly.

[Chris Kane]

St. Andrews #10 versus #17

Why the hate for 10?  I quite like it, particularly the green complex.
If you're thinking of 9, I cannot disagree with you.

[Jordan Wall]

Chip,

I try and avoid commenting on holes I have never personally seen or played, but I would like understand for your reasoning behind #2 at NGLA.

I understand it is very short, but from pictures I have seen, it is hghly original and looks like a really interesting hole.  Can you please elaboratie!?

Thank you.

Cheers,
Jordan

[Anthony Fowler]

Hi Chip, I'm sorry this has become a thread for us to gang up on you and ask about your hole preferences.  I don't understand your disdain for the 3rd holes at Merion or Bethpage (I'm scared to bring up the M word on this site).  I don't view either one as being the worst hole on their respective course.  In fairness, both courses are so good that it would be hard to name a "worst" hole.

To try to answer your initial question, Yale is the course that comes to mind as having the highest variance in hole greatness.  I think that 2, 4, 8, and 17 are very good holes; 9 and 10 are very fun (I don't view them as great but I understand that others do); 16 is kind of dull; and 3 and 18 are just awful.  I know that 3 & 16 are the fault of greens being moved and no thought being put into their redesign.  For me, Yale really has its ups and downs. 

[Chip Gaskins]

St. Andrews #10 versus #17

Why the hate for 10?  I quite like it, particularly the green complex.
If you're thinking of 9, I cannot disagree with you.

i certainly don't hate #10, hate is a strong word.  i was only saying #10 is vastly less compelling that #17

[Chip Gaskins]

Chip,

I try and avoid commenting on holes I have never personally seen or played, but I would like understand for your reasoning behind #2 at NGLA.

I understand it is very short, but from pictures I have seen, it is hghly original and looks like a really interesting hole.  Can you please elaboratie!?

Thank you.

Cheers,
Jordan

Jordan-

#2 is either a 6 iron over to the real fairway to the right and then a wedge or driver/3 wood onto the green.  i love short par 4s but #2 just didn't do it for me....again, in context of the other holes at NGLA and specifically the fantastic 8th hole.

Chip

[Pete Lavallee]

What are the courses that have very high extremes in hole greatness?   One hole is the "top of the class" and one hole is "are you serious?"

Chip,

Do you feel every hole on the course needs to be great, or can there be breather holes? Although taken by itself the 10th at TOC is not a great hole, it is a scoring opportunity that comes in a stretch of holes where you need to cushion your score for the upcoming ball busters. A more difficult hole at this juncture would, to my mind, would ruin the delicate balance that makes TOC so intriguing. In fact I would go as far as saying that a lot of my distain for Fazio courses comes from the "18 signature hole mentallity" he displays and proclaims.

[hhuffines]

Why is Pinehurst #11 on this list?  I watched Payne Stewart struggle to make par there and I believe Tiger bogeyed in the US Open...

[Bart Bradley]

Chip:

I can see where you are going with this...

There has been debate on this board before but I don't think #9 at Caledonia lives up to the other holes there.  There were a couple of outstanding par 3s but I don't remember the hole number.

Bart