Matt,
How is the renovated 10th hole? When we played they were finishing up on it-it looks like a beast.
Hey Jack--how are things up in Chicago?
Here's my take on #10:
The original tenth green was fantastic and it was a shame they changed it back in '92 or '93. It had a very pronounced front shelf that ran at an angle splitting the green on a diagonal from the middle of the green to the back left. To the right the green dropped dramatically down to a lower right bowl. The transition was as fierce as I have ever seen (thinking back I am not sure how it was mowed without scalping) and the left or front locations were brutal. At 435 the hole was considered fairly long and you often had a 4-6 iron approach and keeping the ball from trickling down to the bowl was damn near impossible.
I know the lore of how the fairway came about was due to a suggestion by Alice Dye that the rock and chert removed from the original area of what was to be the fairway should continue and basically the fairway ended up a very moundy looking "tunnel! It was a low area that never grew any grass and because of the zoysia the ball often hung up on the sides of the hills leaving some very awkward almost silly lies--not sure that was intentional. The fairway paralleled the driving range and the old fairway seemed to me a poor attempt to hide the range? I think Alice "bogeyed" this one.
Anyway a few years later the green was changed and softened dramatically. The bowl became much easier and the left side, though still higher, was easy to hold--internal "backstops" help keep your ball "up".
Over time though 435 became a drive and short iron. A decent drive on this slightly downhill tee shot rarely left more than an 8-iron and often a wedge. Combined with the softer green, it had lost a bunch of its bite.
A huge new fairway bunker replaces the old sunken fairway and the new fairway is shifted right (perfect for me as I always managed to block my tee shot way right of the old fairway anyway
). I really like the new tee shot and I am sure David likes the fact that he can grow great grass there now.
BUT, I think the new green, moved 35-40 yards back left and up the hill is a really boring, plain, simple afterthought. It seems completely devoid of any interest to me. There is a small fold on the very front back toward the player to make this very long hole (475) play even longer by "rejecting" weakly played or run up shots. The rest of the green just is kind of there.
I think it may have been neat to re-route the fairway as they did but bring back the old, more severe original green. Here a a couple of reasons why:
1. The course hosts a lot of tournaments and qualifiers and in those events we use two tees (1 and 10). #1 is a gentle opener--401 from the tips to a generous fairway and then a 8 iron to a wedge to a green set down below you. #10 is now 475 with a very long second slightly uphill to a forced carry green. For two "starting" holes, there is way too much difference in how they play. Ideally, everyone starts on #1 but that just can't happen all the time. For a course committed to hosting events, I think having #1 and #10 a little more similar in their demands would be good.
2. The old severe green with the new fairway would play a little longer than the old 435 since it is not as downhill as the old tee shot. It would play as a drive and 6-9 iron but to a more demanding target.
3. Given all the length added in the last few years, a middle length hole would be good for the par 4s on the course. We have long par 4s---all over 460 from the tips and up to 495--#4, #5, #7, #10, #15, #18
We have a couple of short holes (Drive and wedge)----#1 (401) , #9 (375) , #12 (355)
Only #13 is kind of a "middler". It's 395 but as a dogleg often it's a 3-wood off the tee.
We could have used a 435 par 4
Thanks for the nice comments--I love the place and have been lucky to have been there since '91. Mr. Lupton is a great man and has made a huge impact on so many things it is impossible to come close o giving him the credit he deserves for all his causes--I sure am glad he loves golf! Maybe we can convince TD one day that the members up there really are some good guys