[Bill Brightly]

Had the chance to play Stone Eagle last month. What a fun and beautiful golf course. Here are some pictures. (Sorry, my best camera went into hiding while I was packing...)












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As you play Hole 10, it appears as if you will be going off into the mountains!


Me smoking a drive on 18!


But I still had 250 to the green and this view


After a career 3-wood to the back finge (Green below) I made the birdie to end a GREAT day

[Kyle Henderson]

I just love the panoramic views of this course (as see behind you in the first photo. I've never been to the Palm Desert, and this course is really the only one that compels me to go there.

Thanks for sharing!

[Sean Leary]

Its amazing how pics make desert courses look so narrow. The fairways there are huge....

[Steve Pieracci]

The fairways are indeed huge, except for me the 18th is a bowling alley. 

[George Pazin]

Love this photo - nicely done.

[Jim Colton]

I just got the Stone Eagle marketing materials in the mail. The course looks phenomenal and I hope to get out there this season. The marketing materials call TD the greatest architect alive. With praise like that and all the love he gets here, how does Tom stay so humble?

[Bill Brightly]

Yeah, I don't want to sound like I am kissing TD's xxx, but I have to say that this was the most fun driving course I can ever remember playiing. The views are stunning, but there is a cool combination of challenge with plenty of room to play safe.

This is not a great course in the "US Open" sense but for its intended market, probably a slightly older than average membership, it is ideal, IMO. For example, while I (5 hdcp) was suitably challenged from the back tees, my wife is not a serious player but she just loved it and did not feel frustrated by the difficulty.

[Tom Huckaby]

Yeah, I don't want to sound like I am kissing TD's xxx, but I have to say that this was the most fun driving course I can ever remember playiing. The views are stunning, but there is a cool combination of challenge with plenty of room to play safe.

This is not a great course in the "US Open" sense but for its intene market, probably a slightly older than average membership, it is ideal, IMO. For example, while I (5 hdcp) was suitably challenged from the back tees, my wife is not a serious player but she just loved it and did not feel frustrated by the difficulty.

Bill - now that to me is very interesting.

See, a few years ago a large group of nutheads from this site played Stone Eagle, and of course after that there was much discussion of it in here.

I made the comment that the green surrounds in particular (very deep bunkers, desert rocks quite near each one) in particular would make for a very fustrating day for the higher handicapper.  I postulated that my Dad (36+ handicap, can't hit it more than 150 yards, can't get out of bunkers to save his life) would hate the course.  I was rather roasted and toasted in here for this opinion, and still am from time to time!

Yet your wife enjoyed the course.

SO... before I admit partial defeat... did she play out each hole?  Was it perhaps more the views and the cool surroundings that made for her enjoyment more than the playing?

TH

[Peter Pratt]

Bill,

How long is the downhill par 3 in your photos?

[Daryl David]

Bill,

How long is the downhill par 3 in your photos?

Probably about 150-160 from where the person taking the photo is standing.

[Bill Brightly]

Tom H.

She played out every hole except one, but she ALWAYS picks up when she reaches some magic number...she will say its beacuse I trained her to play fast. But she never gave up because of the difficulty on the hole. We had played Torrey Pines 3 days earlier and she hated it and picked up far more often  due to the difficulty of the rough. And since you bring her up, she has this great unsolicited comment about TP for an non-GCAer: "it's really kind of a bland course without the views of the Pacific Ocean" (I was so proud of her!)

On the downhill par 3, I played from the back tees which I recall were 190 into a slight wind. I guessed 4 iron and hit it over the back, then tried a 5 iron and hit it 12 inches from the hole! (Yes, I played my first ball and made a 4...)

But the shot was SOOOO cool! Your target is the (color) green, right? As soon as you hit the ball, your backdrop switches from the color green to the brown of the mountains/desert. Then the ball climbs OVER the mountains and the backdrop switches to clear blue sky, and you wonder if it is going over the mountains! I swear it gave me a sense of vertigo. On the second shot, my 5-iron went even higher/faster, and it was just as cool.

Now, I wonder if that was planned by TD or just an accident?

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom H.

She played out every hole except one, but she ALWAYS picks up when she reaches some magic number...she will say its beacuse I trained her to play fast. But she never gave up because of the difficulty on the hole.

On the par 3, I played from the back tees which I recall were 190. I guessed 4 iron and hit it over the back, then tried a 5 iron and hit it 12 inches from the hole! (Yes, I played my first ball and made a 4...)

But the shot was SOOOO cool! Your target is the green, right? As soon as you hit the ball, your backdrop switches from the color green to the brown of the mountains/desert. Then the ball climbs OVER the mountains and the backdrop switches to clear blue sky, and you wonder if it is going over the mountains! I swear it gave me a sense of vertigo. On the second shot, my 5-iron went even higher/faster, and it was just as cool.

Now, I wonder if that was planned by TD or just an accident?

Bill - thanks.  I am on the ropes, but I am counter-punching still...

Did she get into many bunkers or desert?  Is that when she picked up?

I do sincerely believe my Dad would not enjoy that course.  He too might pick up at a certain number, but that would make him angry and would be part of the reason he wouldn't like the course.  Your wife has a far better attitude.   


TH

[George Pazin]

SO... before I admit partial defeat... did she play out each hole?  Was it perhaps more the views and the cool surroundings that made for her enjoyment more than the playing?

TH

Tom H.

She played out every hole except one, but she ALWAYS picks up when she reaches some magic number...she will say its beacuse I trained her to play fast. But she never gave up because of the difficulty on the hole.

Somewhere out there Tom D is smiling.

[Bill Brightly]

OK, I called and asked her..

She said she NEVER picked up once at Stone Eagle!

She said was in a bunch of traps but never took more than two to get out.

She loved the mountain views.

She loved the texture of the grass. (It was an exceptionally easy turf to hit off.)

She had no idea about how well the course  played from a strategic standpoint. But I will tell you this: she played far better than at our home course, not sure why, but she usually thinks 18 holes is too much, but not at Stone Eagle. (Maybe it was the tacos we had after the tenth hole?)

[Tom Huckaby]

George:

Tom D. might be smiling, but not at any "victory" here. 

Bill, your last post says it all to me.  Your wife is just exceedingly good-natured.  If never taking more than two to get out of the bunkers gives her no frowns, then that rather says it all.

Most would be pretty upset at repeatedly not getting out in one.

George, I stand to fight another day. 

 

[Kalen Braley]

Tom,

I'm curious if you could do a quick compare/contrast with the bunkering at Pacific Dunes vs. Stoneeagle in terms of being able to extract yourself from them.

There were more than a few at PD I was glad not to have gotten into and at least one of these I did and took 4 to get out.

Kalen

[Tom Huckaby]

Kalen:

There are most definitely some SEVERE bunkers at Pacific Dunes.  2, 3, 6, right of 13, etc.  But I wouldn't say the overall effect there is the same I got from Stone Eagle; at Pacific Dunes, it all just seemed like part of the natural landscape, so if they were severe, well hell you're playing through sand dunes so what do you expect?  On top of that, there are many holes where the bunkers are not nearly as severe.  At Stone Eagle, the impression I got was that the bunkers were huge and deep and steep and relentless, and on a site on the side of a mountain, well... it's hard to call them natural so they get no free pass.  In any case, I don't believe any of this is a problem for the better player, and in fact adds to the challenge and fun for him as they make him think rather than bash away.  No, the only issue I had then - and maintain now - is that these (combined with as the seemingly omnipresent desert rocks next to each green) would make for a long day for the lesser player (amended now to say except for those like Bill's wife with exceedingly good attitudes).  I think this happens at Stone Eagle; I don't think it would, at least not so much, at Pacific Dunes.

Note that many disagreed with me, some vehemently.  Such is life.

TH

[Kalen Braley]

Tom,

Thats an interesting way to look at things.  Basically because one is playing in around "real" dunes at Pacific, the expectation of being caught in one is more palatable than a location like Stone Eagle where as best as I can tell they aren't naturally occuring?  My only round at PD I didn't break 90 and didn't mind one bit because I was having such a blast taking it all in.

And after getting caught in the front left bunker at Pasa I know full well the hazards of getting caught in a severly sloped bunker.

At PD, there seemed to be a bailout area for the most part to avoid the big beastly bunkers, 13 being the only exception I can think of ATM.  Is this also the case at Stone Eagle?  Because if not, I could see how that could complicate things for the high handicapper...hit it on the green or else.

[Tom Huckaby]

Kalen:

I have been advised off line about the foolishness of opening old wounds.  So I guess I shall leave this alone.  I will close though with this:  I doubt anyone likes being brutally beaten down all day.  I've never thought of PD that way; I did think of SE most definitely this way.

TH

[Tom_Doak]

Sorry, Huck, but you are the first and only person to describe Stone Eagle as "brutally beating (the golfer) down all day".  It ain't so and I won't stand for it.    Perhaps it is not a coincidence that your nickname rhymes with "suck".

P.S.  When was the last time you played Pacific Dunes?  The bunkers now are much more fearsome than they were 3-4 years ago; I personally think they are harder to recover from than Stone Eagle's now, for whatever that is worth.

[jkinney]

Get over it, Mr. Huckaby. I'm a Founder at SE and have had numerous high handicappers out there who adored playing the course. After the first year the sand in the bunkers settled nicely, and they are of normal difficulty if one has a 60 degree wedge for the deep faces when encountered.

That SE is not ranked in the top 100 by Golf Magazine is a total mystery to me.
I find it by far and away the finest golf course ever built anywhere in the desert.

[John Kirk]

Ouch!

It just goes to show you how spending 10 straight hours in 110 degree sun can affect one's opinion of the golf course he or she is playing.

I like Stone Eagle a lot.  I think it is very playable for the higher handicapper, and terrific for the mid- to low handicapper, although the top 0.5 - 1 percent of players seem to score extremely well there.   It's perfect for me, and as previously mentioned, a great course for driving the ball.

My wife has a 20 index.  She enjoys Stone Eagle very much, though she doesn't score very well yet.  For her, it seems to be a matter of comfort and intimidation.  For instance, the 8th hole, a short par 5, should be easy for her.  A drive and 7-wood put her 70-90 yards away, but the wash spooks her, and she can't hit the green from there.  I expect she will learn how to play the course better with time.

In general, Stone Eagle seems proportionally more difficult for higher handicaps than most courses, but possesses few obstacles unmanageable by all levels of players.  I think Stone Eagle's slope in the high 130s is justified.  On the other hand, my friend's wife often scores below her handicap there.

The greenside bunkers, like all of Stone Eagle, are in extraordinary condition, but tend to be rather deep and set back from the greens.  I rate sand saves at Stone Eagle as being difficult but very fun.

The greens are very hard to read in places.  On a daily basis, the ambience is outstanding.

[Bill Brightly]

TD,

Can you respond to my comment about the drop down par 3? Did you envision the backdrop changing from mountain to sky as the shot reaches its apex? Or did it just happen to work out that way? Either way, that was one of the coolest shots I can remember playing. (And I am not a real fan of drop down par threes bacuse it screws up my club selection... )


Huck,

I really think the "severity" of the course is largely an optical illusion. It looks FAR harder than it plays.  When you set up to hit a shot there are just SO many places where you dont want to hit it (like the desert, the rocks and the bunkers...) but there is really PLENTY of room to keep the ball on grass. (Don't underestimate your Dad, he would love it!)

[Tom Huckaby]

Well, I guess the truest part about this was the advice I received off-line that I ought not to open old wounds.  As you all can see, my opinions about Stone Eagle get rather strong reactions AGAIN.  And AGAIN, those who react miss my point, and prefer to attack things that I really don't believe.  So, to try to correct this AGAIN....

Tom Doak:  my name rhymes with a lot of other things also, but thanks.  Just please do understand that I did not, have not, and have never said that Stone Eagle brutally beats down the golfer all day - that post must be taken in context with all of the others on this thread.  All I meant to say - and the last post just amplified it - is that the higher handicapper would have a very hard time in those bunkers, and with the constancy of the desert around each green.  He would get beaten down all day in that context, as I see it.  That's it.  I guess if you read ONLY that last post, I could see your ire.  But please, we discussed this ad nauseam before and I have to believe you knew my point.  But of course, I could be wrong.  But it is what I believe, for better or worse.  And I played Pacific Dunes in February 2007.  If it's changed significantly since then, so be it.

John Kirk:  as I believe I told you at least a dozen times before also, yes I did play it in the heat, but I also played it in very comfortable weather the next morning.  So no, my opinion is not adversely effected by the conditions in which I played.

JKinney:  as a founder of SE, you have obviously played the course far more than I have, so I certainly respect your opinion.  But I also know what I saw and what I believe, and that is that the course has a a very specific, pretty minor severity that I describe.  I really do think this is a VERY minor critique, because what you haven't read - but what these others have and for some reason now choose to ignore - is that I also said the course on the whole is pretty darn great.  I too think it could well make some rankings, although perhaps GM Top 100 is a tall order, given the tiny percentage of golf courses that make that.  But I certainly did enjoy playing there and my critique here was really meant as a side comment, not any overall indictment as it seems to get taken.

Bill: apologies for dragging you into this quagmire.  I doubt the severity AROUND THE GREENS, FOR THE HIGHER HANDICAPPER - which is the only severity I ever commented on - is any optical illusion, but maybe so.

TH

[Tom_Doak]

Tom H:  Apology accepted.  I had read the rest of the thread, and did not object to anything you'd said until that quote, which you didn't relate back to just the bunkers:

"So I guess I shall leave this alone.  I will close though with this:  I doubt anyone likes being brutally beaten down all day.  I've never thought of PD that way; I did think of SE most definitely this way."

So I hope you can understand why I objected.  Plus, you persisted in turning Mr. Brightly's positive thread about the course into one full of your own negative opinion of the course.

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