Bill:
I don't doubt Scioto is "special" -- it's hosted major events. Jones won there and Nicklaus grew up playing golf under Grout there.
But where's the architecture that screams out "compelling?"
Bill, I can't speak to the type of courses you have played -- Scioto might be on your very short list and that's fine for you. I'm just saying that I only played the Scioto version that Dick Wilson played with. I never played the pure Ross version. In regards to what JN is doing I can only say that certain architects / designers should not be doing restoration work because they really don't have the skills to do it well.
Steve:
OK.
Just tell me how the Columbus area is going to support another big time event -- US Open or even PGA when Jack's event gobbles up all the local area support?
Scioto is a fine course -- but golf architecture, in a number of clear instancs, has passed it by. Take away the majors played there and the Nicklaus connection and how much, if anything, does Scioto have to offer? Don't know if you have read Doak's comments in CG about the course and the famed 2nd hole -- but I found them to be very fair and to the point.
Final item -- Merion's holding of the US Open is a dicey proposition. Limiting ticket sales to 18,500 is only a small part of the problem. The course has not been thoroughly tested since the '81 Open -- I don't give much credence to amateur played events. We shall see if such a return to the rota can be done given the needs of major sites in the 21st century.
Steve / Bill:
One last point -- if any club has the goods but will never go public in terms of a big time event it's another Columbus course -- The Golf Club. In my mind, one of the 2-3 best Pete Dye courses I have ever played. Gets extremely limited attention here for the obvious reasons of very low profile. Be curious to know if either of you have played it and how you would assess it.
thanks ...
My point, Matt, is that history and provenance aside, this is a great course. I have no idea what Doak said, nor do I care. I have played many rounds here, 2 is one of the best par 4s I have seen. 3, amazing short hole. 4 amazing par 3, totally Ross. 5, one of the best par 4s I have played, Ross, Wilson, whomever...a great hole. 6, a dogleg, but an interesting par 5, 7 a great short par 4, 8, tricky in Jack's eyes, but a beautiful hole, 9...a great par 3, even by GCA standards, again, totally Ross, but why does it matter? 10, amazing par 4, 11, short par 4, criticism could be it's 7 all over again, but a fun hole. 12 a great par 5. 13, great long par 4 with an amazing Ross green. 14 a great long par three with a tough green, 15 great shortish par 4, 16 - a spectacular par 4, again, Ross comes through, the re-designed 17th a great par 3 and 18, similar to # 1, perhaps not the greatest, but bookending 16 terrific holes. 16 out of 18 ain't bad, whether its Wilson, Ross, Nicklaus or Doak. I agree TGC is one of Dye's best, but we're talking about Scioto. TGC members don't want to share and that's their choice, in fact, many of them have dual memberships with SCC. Why? Because it's a classic, regardless of who got their fingerprints on it. Wilson's grubby hands touched Seminole, but we hold that course in high regard. Why should Scioto suffer where Seminole gets a hall pass...the locker room, the names on the wall? Let's be fair.