[Joe Bausch]

I've recently uncovered this drawing from a 1915 Philadelphia Inquirer article:



The text with the article states that the course was laid out and constructed by J. Franklin Meehan.  I'm pretty ignorant about the layout, but the LuLu web page indicates both 9's were done by Ross:

http://www.lulucc.com/golf/proto/lulucc/history/history.htm

And the Donald Ross Society has a web page that also indicates all 18 holes are Ross, with none being a remodel:

http://www.donaldrosssociety.org/MEMBERS/COURSESstate.htm

What gives?!

[mark chalfant]

Joe

Lulu is a very intersting course worthy of study. I believe that well over half of current holes are by Donald Ross. However, as Ross often did when  good holes preceded him   he included them  in his remodeling scheme. For instance at Lulu Ross kept the 4th , a charming 105 yard hole, that I believe  was designed by Meehan. An outstanding example of Ross bringing original holes "along for the ride" are the splendid Tom Bendelow holes that Ross decided to keep at  Hyde Park in Cinncinati. Many Bendelow originals there cling to or traverse deep gullies.

[Kyle Harris]

Mark,

Joe and I were speaking offline about this.

Based on this routing, all but the 1st and 9th holes were retained by Ross in some form, though it appears he moved a few greens.

The routing today would play 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 2, 3 or a close approximation.

[Phil_the_Author]

The American Golfer Magazine - January, 1919

"The LuLu Temple Country Club announces that the club will build a new course, using the ground on which their nine holes are situated and some additional land on the other side of the road. The plans were prepared by Donald Ross. A large clubhouse will be erected also."

So 9 of the holes were a redesign and 9 new ones were added...
 
 

[Joe Bausch]

I guess the fair conclusion is that the LuLu web page has been, uhhh, enhanced you might say?

Edit:  after posting the above, I came upon the following paragraph, this being the reference, written by Perry Lewis:

Headline: New and Improved Golf Courses Here Many Local Clubs Are Preparing to Open Better Links; Article Type: News/Opinion
Paper: Philadelphia Inquirer, published as The Philadelphia Inquirer; Date: 12-03-1919; Volume: 181; Issue: 156; Page: 14; Location: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania

The Lu Lu Temple Country Club has had a nine hole course for a number of years.  Finishing touches will be put on nine new holes during the Winter, and the organization will throw open its full eighteen hole course about May 1.  Francis L. James laid out the new links, and when finished it will rank with the best.

Something isn't adding up here fellas!

[Kyle Harris]

Frank James was a construction superintendent who did work for Donald Ross. He was a hired gun by many architects.

[Joe Bausch]

Frank James was a construction superintendent who did work for Donald Ross. He was a hired gun by many architects.

Ah, ok.

But then it is possible that Ross did the original 9 holes too and Meehan just constructed it, eh?

[Kyle Harris]

Frank James was a construction superintendent who did work for Donald Ross. He was a hired gun by many architects.

Ah, ok.

But then it is possible that Ross did the original 9 holes too and Meehan just constructed it, eh?

Ross wasn't working too much outside of New England and North Carolina during that time.

[Mike_Cirba]

Ah, ok.

But then it is possible that Ross did the original 9 holes too and Meehan just constructed it, eh?

Nope...

Interesting that we know that Meehan and Frank James worked together on the first nine holes at Schuylkill CC as well, Kyle.

Meehan lived very near LuLu and did nearby North Hills, Sandy Run, Ashbourne, and quite a few others.  

It's no surprise really that he designed the first nine holes at LuLu....what's surprising is how many of them are still there today.

[TEPaul]

The one we need on here to talk informatively about the architectural history and evoluton of LuLu and all the details of it is Steve Sayers. He's a member, he did some really in depth research (spent a ton of time in the Temple (or Villanova) library going through all the old Philly newspapers) and I think he's still registered on here. I'll call him and tell him there's a LuLu thread.

Of course Ron Forse and Jim Nagel should weigh in as they had the benefit of all his research.

[TEPaul]

That's an interesting layout and sequence. I wasn't aware it was that way before Ross. It looks like Ross ditched a few holes in the sequence, reused a few of the greens for other holes in the sequence and resequenced the most of the nine. It also looks like the club picked up the land behind the 6th on that sequence which is today's 3rd hole and lengthened it. Ross definitely moved things around in the geographic middle of that nine. What would be interesting to know is what greens are Ross's on that front nine. Most are probably Meehan's. Today's 6th, a par 3 (the original 2nd) is one helluva good green. Ross dropped two holes on that nine on that side of the road and put #8 and #9 on the other side of the road.

[Joe Bausch]

I'm anxious to hear what Steve Sayers has to say.

I would like to add to that Perry Lewis article I quoted earlier.  It isn't as if he wasn't aware of other stuff Ross was doing in the area at the time.  Here is the paragraph directly before the one about LuLu:

Donald Ross laid out the new nine holes at Overbrook, and as usual, he made a finished job of the thing.  In fact, Ross not only created the new holes, but he also polished off the original course of nine to conform with the additional holes...

[TEPaul]

Joe:

Steve Sayers really does need to get on here and offer what he knows.

What you just supplied there from Perry Lewis may shoot down LuLu's long term claim that it was Ross' first golf course in Pennsylvania.

[TEPaul]

Joe:

Again, this research you've been doing so much of with the recently digitized Philly newspapers is really remarkable stuff for the likes of dedicated researchers. Your research seems like it's going to rewrite some stories that've been around a long, long time!

[JNagle]

The other earliest Ross is on the other extreme of the state - The Kahkwa Club.  LuLu was completed in two phases.  I believe 1915 and 1919 (those dates may be slightly off).  The plan above is interesting to see.   First time we have seen it.  From the sketch it appears holes 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 were retained.  The early Ross 18 still had the clubhouse where this plan shows it.  They built the current Clubhouse in the early 20's.  The current #12 played through the parking lot adjacent to #8 tees.  Who knows which greens Ross kept, but it appears quite a few.  We have been working with Congress Lake Club in Ohio which is a Park Jr./Ross course.  Interestingly the Ross' plans show which Park greens are to remain, which are to be modified and which are to be changed completely.  Considering the unknowns (which greens were not modified), the addition of bunkers, new tees ..... it is safe to say LuLu is Ross.  To me it's splitting hairs to say something is not adding up.  Look how many clubs had a mediocre course laid out in the early teens only to be undone, changed, redesigned...... by someone else.  

[Joe Bausch]

Hey, it is Mr. Hairsplitter again.  

Here is the text that goes w/ the drawing in the original post that started this thread.

[TEPaul]

JimN:

I really am getting to be a mindless of fart---I mean how well do I know you over the years? Some of the times I've called you Jim Wagner and today I even spelled your name wrong. I must be helpless--I'm embarrassed.

Happy New Year. Let's get together more this year. Bedford Springs seems to be a good spot to meet. I can be there in near two hours if I let the MINI "S" breath on the PA Turnpike. If any big trucks try to block my way at about 110mph I'm pretty sure I can just throw it into 6th gear, gun it and go right underneath them!

[TEPaul]

Joe:

It's interesting to me that there must've been a creek winding through the middle of that original nine hole Meehan course. I've played that course a ton and I don't remember anything in the middle of that front nine that resembles a creek although I can see the basic topography might've allowed for one once.

[Joe Bausch]

Tom, I agree with your observation about the creek, or lack thereof.  On the LuLu web page there is a pretty decent aerial of the course that doesn't show any obvious creek.  



I don't know the date of the aerial, but it appears to be quite old.

I've also looked at the 1942 Penn Pilot web page aerial and again that creek is not obvious if it was in fact there at that time.

[TEPaul]

That's probably a Dallin aerial from the 1920s.

The Ross mimic of Tillinghast's reef hole is still there as #12.

[Mike_Cirba]

A January 28, 1917 article by Billy Bunker which lists who was responsible for golf course architecture in the Philly area for the previous coupla' years mentions;

"Most of the work that was done at LuLu Temple was done by Warren Webb and J. Franklyn Meehan."

[Joe Bausch]

Here's a 1942 Penn Pilot aerial:

[TEPaul]

Joe:

I'd say that first aerial is probably a Dallin from around the mid 1930s judging from the growth of some of the small trees on the second one that're visible on the first one. By the way, Dallin flew and photographed the area from around 1924 to around 1939.

[JNagle]

TEPaul -

Watch those men with the wide brimmed hats and the funny chin strap when you open up on the T-pike.  

Would love to get together more this year.  Already working on two trips to Bedford.  It's much easier to get there plus my wife has fallen in love with their spa treatments.  Thankfully the golf is free!!

As for the photo, yes 1930's.  If you follow the progression of changes to the 15th green you can usually tell the era of the photo.  Tillie came in during his PGA days and modified the approach to 15.  Took away some of the green and added a bunker.  That bunker existed until a couple of years ago when the green was restored.

As for the creek, it is now piped under #2 and #6.  There is a large "baranka" like feature that cuts diagonally in front of #2 that is shown in the early plan.  Not sure how much water flow went through there.  That area is always quite dry.  Great feature.

[TEPaul]

"TEPaul -
Watch those men with the wide brimmed hats and the funny chin strap when you open up on the T-pike."

Jim:

Do you mean the cops, the fuzz, the Pa Highway Patrol??

Ah, those guys don't concern me. I grew up with speed. I grew up in Daytona Beach Florida and when I was about ten I learned how to smell those guys and just feel when they're around long before one sees them. They couldn't catch me if a week's pay depended on it. I'm harder to catch than Osama.

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