[Brian Cenci]

Do you need to stay at one of the Wynn resorts in Vegas to get on or can any Joe Shmo walk up and play?

[Tom_Doak]

Bryan:

Steve Wynn doesn't own Shadow Creek anymore.  He had to fold it into Mirage Resorts when the IRS threatened to make him pay personal property taxes for it after it opened ... then when Mirage was taken over on Wall Street, Shadow Creek went with it.  So you have to stay at any of the MGM resorts, which include the Mirage.

[TEPaul]

I'm just wondering if there is any good reason under the sun why I should ever go to Las Vegas. I can think of a number of really bad reasons I should go to Las Vegas but I just can't come up with a single good one. Can anyone help me with a good one?

[John Kavanaugh]

The sportsbook at the Bellagio comps drinks if you bet or not.  It is a great place to watch a game and drink for free.

[Kalen Braley]

I'm with you on this on TEPaul.

Vegas just rubs me wrong as well.  With the "themed" casinos and the whole fakeness to the place.  And that doesn't even include the way over-priced golf and that you're living in the middle of the desert.

I don't get it either...

[Adam Clayman]

Tom, The only good reason for you to go to Vegas would be to put your Big World theory through a most rigorous test.

And while you're at it, perhaps a new formula for evaluating the importance of an ideal meld in beer cart girls.

[Joel_Stewart]

Tom:
Seriously its an interesting place but it depends what you like and don't like.  Many of the hotels, pools, restuarants, and shows are world class.  They have sporting events, boxing and car racing to name a few and shopping like you have never seen.  The grand canyon is not far away as well Hoover Dam.  I have young kids and they love it and my wife thinks its better than Hawaii or Florida in that you can stay at a nice hotel, sit by the pool during the day and then eat great food and watch a show at night.  Its easier to get to than Hawaii and if you get the right deal cheaper as well.

The golf is OK.

[cary lichtenstein]

Tom:

If you've never been there, it should be on your list of places to go. It's not Venice, but...

The hotels are pretty amazing, as are the shopping plazas, great shows and food, and 2 courses worth playing, maybe 3.

[rjsimper]

The only objectively "good" reason to go to Las Vegas is that without having been (only seeing photos and hearing thoughts of others, maybe seeing it on TV once a year) you really can't judge it one way or the other.

Go there, soak it in, see it with your own eyes, and then judge one way or the other as to it's worth.

[Tommy Williamsen]

I'm just wondering if there is any good reason under the sun why I should ever go to Las Vegas. I can think of a number of really bad reasons I should go to Las Vegas but I just can't come up with a single good one. Can anyone help me with a good one?

I dislike most everything about Vegas.  Yet it is relatively close to some spectacular scenery and lake Las Vegas is a pretty place.  There is also some golf that you might want to take in.
Shadow Creek is one of the golfing wonders of the world.  Like everything else in LV it is as our of place as the Empire State Building down town.  
I like some of the golf, yet it is not what I would call world class.  Paiute is ok.  Southern Highlands has a great clubhouse and ok golf.  Reflection Bay is a great place to stay and the golf is good.  I like South Shore GC in Henderson and Rio Secco, also in Henderson.  Primm with its two courses is only and hour away.  It is worth the drive.

I thought Summerlin was decent but liked the TPC Canyons better.

[Kirk Gill]

The Liberace Museum.

[Tommy Williamsen]

The Liberace Museum.

Darn, I knew I missed something.

[TEPaul]

"And while you're at it, perhaps a new formula for evaluating the importance of an ideal meld in beer cart girls."

Adam:

That's about as simple as American apple pie in a general sense. What I believe to be the ideal meld in cart girls some may inexactly just call cleavage but I'd call it "something of an inverse angle of repose of along about the middle of their east and west assets if they are good enough to display it with some appropriate decolletage."

Now, you may even ask what exactly is that ideal inverse angle in degrees but that's something that cannot be precisely defined and pretty much falls into the context of that old adage "you know it when you see it."

[Lloyd_Cole]

Tom
The pool at thr Tropicana has a 'Swim Up' blackjack table. That did it for me.

[Sean Leary]

Shadow Creek at $500 seems like a bargain compared to what I often lose at a Blackjack table in 5 hours....

[rjsimper]

Shadow Creek at $500 seems like a bargain compared to what I often lose at a Blackjack table in 5 hours....

Yes the worst thing about Vegas is the "I could have just taken a nap and then gone to play Shadow Creek" thought after a tough session at the tables.

[John Foley]

Tommy,

Vegas is one of those places that you really gotta see it for yourself.

- Best collection of great resteraunts outside NYC
- Unreal shows that you can not get elsewhere Cirque de Soliel "O" is the Sand Hills/Cypress Point/Pine Valley of live entertainment!
- Great outdoor scenery around town. Red Rock Canyon, Lake Las Vegas, Hoover Dam

As for the golf, ther are a hundreds places to go first, but in your Whole Big World theory, it's a place you need to get to.

I've been to Vegas half a dozen times and have gambled once.

[Jim Franklin]

I have been to Vegas at least once a year since'89 and even got married there in '98. I love the place. The food, shows, hotels, everything is awesome. In all of my visits I have only come away losing at the tables once. It is all about money management (for the most part). Plus I always golf so that takes away from me being at the tables for too long. I can't wait to go back in August (ugh) for my conference.

[Jimmy Chandler]

I agree that Vegas is a worthy visit, even if just once in your life.  The quality of the hotels, food, and entertainment is truly world class, and it is not far from some natural wonders that will take your breath away.  One not mentioned before is Death Valley (though sane people only visit there in the winter), which is one of the most spectacular places I've ever seen and only a 3 hour drive from the strip.

I would also recommend seeing at least one of the Cirque Du Soleil shows; there are so many shows in Vegas you should easily be able to find something to your liking.

My one problem with the fine dining restaurants in Vegas are the prices -- not much value to be found the way you can find great value dining in New York/LA/SF/DC/London/Paris/...you get the idea.  And so I'm not sure if I agree with John Foley that Vegas has the "Best collection of great resteraunts outside NYC" -- because I find "great" restaurants should include great food that doesn't break the bank.

Most importantly, if you go in with the right attitude, Vegas is a place to just have fun, whatever your interests.

[TEPaul]

"Tom:
If you've never been there, it should be on your list of places to go."

gary:

Actually, I have been to Vegas and if one wants to get totally turned off on gambling then they should do what I did there.

I was driving back across the country in 1970, I think it was, after spending a year or so in California and I'd been driving through the night out of California and I decided to pull into Vegas and go into a few casinos about 6am just to see what they were like.

Jeeeeesus what a mess that was---eg people drunk, busted, crying, you name it.

I just got back in my car and peeled off into the eastern sun telling myself not to even look in the rearview mirror at that Sodom and Gommorah lest I be turned into stone or something.  

But don't get me wrong, I actually love the idea of Vegas simply because it represents the outside edge of the excess that can be America. You see golf architecture is not the only area I believe in the "Big World" theory.  

[John Foley]

Jimmy,

I stand corrected. What I should have said was highly rated, great place to be out to dinner entertaining your customer on the companies dime.

Sort of like a CCFAD!!

As a value, food in Vegas is waaay out of line!

[rjsimper]

Tom-

If you have not been to Vegas since 1970 then you have not been to Vegas.

Hell, if you haven't been to vegas since 1992 and/or since the Mirage, then you haven't been to Vegas.

Again, I am not saying it's objectively a good thing...but today's Vegas is a different world.  Some love it, some hate it...but I have to think that a far higher percentage love it (or at least recognize the reasons why many love it) now than would have in 1970.

[Joe Hancock]

The Liberace Museum.

"I didn't see that one coming...the women LOVED him!"

[Patrick_Mucci]

TEPaul,

I think John Foley, Joel Stewart and Jim Franklin have provided you with a number of reasons why it's worth going for a few days.  There are other reasons as well.

It is what you make of it.
If you want to have a good time you will.
If you don't, you won't.

A man has to know his limitations, and in Vegas, definitely don't try to exceed them.

You should visit in the spring or fall.

Jim Franklin,

They send Jets and limos to bring guys to Vegas who claim to have great betting systems and super money management skills.  If you spend enough time at the tables, they will own everything you have.... and more.
They'll even put you in luxurious suites, comp you for food & beverage, shows and golf.  They didn't build those spectacular facilities from charitable contributions.  
You've been lucky.  It happens.  
But, don't mess with The Law of Large Numbers.

[TEPaul]

Patrick:

Las Vegas is definitely a town for you and your wild crowd. I'm far too much the shy, sensitive and retiring type to frequent a place like that.

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