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George_Bahto

  • Karma: +0/-0
If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« on: January 19, 2006, 10:21:16 PM »
which hole would you want to play?

.... no sense asking why, I guess but if you want to explain, go to it.

4 Redan ?

17 ?

the Bottle hole ?

18 ?

Alps ?

Hole #1 ?

the great Short ?
If a player insists on playing his maximum power on his tee-shot, it is not the architect's intention to allow him an overly wide target to hit to but rather should be allowed this privilege of maximum power except under conditions of exceptional skill.
   Wethered & Simpson

Patrick_Mucci

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2006, 10:26:54 PM »
George,

For me, there's no doubt.

Par 3 = #  6
Par 4 = #  8
Par 5 = # 18

And, I could play them every day for the rest of my life and never tire of the fun and the challenge, especially when the wind is up.

Ian Andrew

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2006, 10:27:35 PM »
George,

I assuming it's more than one play.......

The opener, because I'm convinced it would take a dozen times down the hole to figure out how to get to each of those diabolical pin positions. I have no clue how to play the hole, and I like that. Those are always my favourites....or I'm clueless, one of the two. ;D

George_Bahto

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2006, 10:41:20 PM »
No - let;s do it this way -

as if there is ONLY ONE LAST HOLE YOU COULD PLAY THERE FOREVER
If a player insists on playing his maximum power on his tee-shot, it is not the architect's intention to allow him an overly wide target to hit to but rather should be allowed this privilege of maximum power except under conditions of exceptional skill.
   Wethered & Simpson

Patrick_Mucci

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2006, 10:41:39 PM »
Ian,

The fascinating thing about # 1 is, that depending on the hole location and your drive, you could hit every club in your bag on your second, or approach shot.  It's that much fun.

Patrick_Mucci

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2006, 10:43:13 PM »
George,

I"m stuck between # 8 and # 18 and will have to sleep on it, but as I log off, I'm leaning toward # 18.

Does clubhouse proximity count for anything ?

Gerry B

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2006, 10:46:24 PM »
alps / punchbowl / the finishing hole  - in order of preference

George_Bahto

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2006, 10:52:21 PM »
Patrick: you asked: "Does clubhouse proximity count for anything ? "

nope - just a one last time stand-alone hole (you'll go for 18 I bet ... you just love those flags hanging up there on skyline greens  ... )
If a player insists on playing his maximum power on his tee-shot, it is not the architect's intention to allow him an overly wide target to hit to but rather should be allowed this privilege of maximum power except under conditions of exceptional skill.
   Wethered & Simpson

Steve Lapper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2006, 07:15:10 AM »
George,

   I too am torn :-\. I'd like to think there are simply too many wonderful holes there to only be limited to one. That said, I'm convinced that the Redan (#4) is the finest example of it's kind this side of the pond and it's a hole that each and every time I play it, I just want to go back and play it again, and again, and again ;) ;D.

  Perhaps it's due to the fact that so many different shots are called for to hunt any pin there.........classic matrix thinking...love it.


PS...I could play Alps, Bottle, Home, Leven all over and over.... ;D
The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking."--John Kenneth Galbraith

TEPaul

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2006, 07:27:07 AM »
It's a seemingly tough choice but there's no question in my mind---it would be the redan. But only if the course was really firm and fast. And there's no question either that I'd try the traditional redan shot over and over again. In my opinion, there's scarcely a more exciting shot anywhere in golf.

Mike_Cirba

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2006, 08:08:47 AM »
The 3rd.

I'm not sure I'd ever tire of trying to carry the blind approach to the green and the subsequent excitement of hustling up there to see the result when I think I've hit a good one, but if I ever did tire, I could always play it the long way as a par five as the years progressed.

BCrosby

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2006, 08:10:24 AM »
I've never played NGLA, but the hole I am most anxious to play is the Bottle Hole. It has always struck me as a hole of conundra (pls. note usage of the correct plural form ;)) at many different levels. And I've never seen any serious attempt to replicate the Bottle Hole elsewhere.

Bob  
« Last Edit: January 20, 2006, 08:35:44 AM by BCrosby »

Jfaspen

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2006, 08:44:23 AM »
I think it's 17.  

The one with trouble left, a bunker in the fairway, a bunker short of the green, the peconic in the background (par 4).

jf

Jim Franklin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2006, 08:50:16 AM »
I'm with Lapper, I wanted to play the Redan hole again as soon as I hit my tee shot. I could have hit a bucket up there and just had a blast.
Mr Hurricane

Patrick_Mucci

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2006, 09:05:13 AM »
George,

You're right.  # 18 would be my choice.

The Redan is a great par 3, but, the approach shot is rather limited, whereas on the 18th, a par 5, the drive, second and approach are all EXCITING and diverse, as are recovery shots.

George, when that hole is cut all the way back, it's one of the scariest shots in golf, from ON or OFF the green, especially when you can hear the American Flag snapping.

And when you're OFF the green, whether it's 5 yards or 150 yards, it's frightening.

There have been late afternoons when I've gone back and played it two dozen times, and each time, it just gets better and better.

While playing it casually is fun, playing it in a match or tournament adds an entirely different element.
The risk on each shot escalates dramatically.

In medal play, one must be guarded.
In match play, being one up, one down or all even brings different pressures and perspectives to the play of the hole.

The configuration of the bunkering, the roll and elevation of the terrain, the absence of visual guides on your second and approach shot, and the wind all conspire to produce one of the greatest holes in golf.

bstark

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #15 on: January 20, 2006, 09:08:29 AM »
  17 sums up National best. Standing on the tee, the windmill, the Peconic, the North Fork, Robins Island in full view. Then you get to hit either driver into the throat, or a stinger 2 iron laying up in front of the trap. Second shot could be a low runner to a back pin, or if you laid back with the 2 iron a full lob wedge. Then you must think about the prevailing breeze (SW) and try to stop it or risk going over into the back bunker (death).

   The 18th is always fun because the "southsiders in the birdcage" are just around the corner.  

TEPaul

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #16 on: January 20, 2006, 09:18:13 AM »
"I've never played NGLA, but the hole I am most anxious to play is the Bottle Hole. It has always struck me as a hole of conundra (pls. note usage of the correct plural form ) at many different levels. And I've never seen any serious attempt to replicate the Bottle Hole elsewhere.
Bob"

Bobzee;

In my opinion, the Bottle hole at NGLA is very much an acquired taste, particularly the green and green-end. Talk about manufacturered looking! NGLA is pretty manufactured looking if one really looks at it hard with that thought in mind, but the stretch one can hardly help but notice it is 6-8. When you come over the hill and first see the 7th green that's about the first thing that hits you. And if you really look at the entire green-end of the Bottle Hole you can't help but notice it.

I'm not that much of a fan of the second shot on the Bottle Hole although I know plenty of people who are and that's fine by me. My reaction to it and those like me may be the reason it wasn't much copied. But frankly, the "Bottle Hole" concept is the design "through the green" in my understanding and not necessarily the green of NGLA's #8 and it's look.

Yes, indeedee, I'm impressed by your use of 'conundra'. However, I looked it up in a couple of my dictionaries and they have no plural for conundrum which makes me wonder whether it's true or whether I should shit-can those two dictionaries of mine. But from seven years of Latin 'conundra" would make sense for conundrum's plural. However, since I can't be sure of it just yet it may be best to describe the many mysteries of the "Bottle Hole" as a puzzle inside a riddle wrapped in a conundrum!

;)
;)

Gib_Papazian

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #17 on: January 20, 2006, 10:22:08 AM »
Uncle George,

In trying to take my mind off this morning's looming courtroom drama, I am going to choose one not obvious at first glance, but which has an impossibly interesting number of strategic elements.

#16. . . . . . . if I have to choose a favorite at NGLA, there it is.

Now, let's see anybody guess why.  


Tom Huckaby

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2006, 10:29:26 AM »
What's interesting to me is I could live with any of the choices set forth so far.

The possible reasons for Gib choosing 16 are infinite.   ;D

As for me, well, just to be different, and just because the hole has always fascinated me more than any other at the course, probably because it seems to get the least attention among the cognoscenti is.... #2.

I want to drive that green.  It might take me a life-time to do it.  But man that tee shot has more choices and more possible outcomes than damn near any par 4 on earth.  And then the variety of pitches/putts/etc. into and on that green?  Yeah, I'd be a happy camper.

Of course you'd be torturing the hell out of me keeping me on just that hole with the other 17 near it, not to mention the two other 18s across the way, so screw you I don't want to do it.  But if forced to endure this hell, well then put me on #2.

TH

Robert Emmons

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #19 on: January 20, 2006, 10:35:28 AM »
George,
I like 17...the teeshot, the fairway, fairway and geenside bunkers, the green. all interesting and thoughtful...never would lose interest...and the views are great...RHE

Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #20 on: January 20, 2006, 10:36:30 AM »
First things first- I'd like to play them all and then decide. ;D
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Patrick_Mucci

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #21 on: January 20, 2006, 11:22:46 AM »
Gib,

Possibly because the tee shot requires precision, and while the lack of precision isn't unduely penalized, failure to ride the spine results in the "Bowl Evil".

From there, you're faced with a blind approach, albeit, to a forgiving surrounds,

It's a fun hole to play, but, if I had to play one hole repeatedly, for the rest of my life, # 18 would get my vote.

BCrosby

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #22 on: January 20, 2006, 12:37:05 PM »
TEP -

Among the conundra often missed by the media are design criteria used for tournament stadia. Alumnae of my school have presented memoranda on these conundra at many symposia.

« Last Edit: January 20, 2006, 12:39:22 PM by BCrosby »

Tom Huckaby

Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #23 on: January 20, 2006, 12:49:22 PM »
Bob - all of Gaul sure as hell is divided into three parts, and the rose remains white.  Very well done.

Your fellow Latinist,

Tomus Huckabus


BCrosby

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:If you could only play one hole at NGLA ...
« Reply #24 on: January 20, 2006, 12:54:17 PM »
Tomus -

I couldn't resist.

Robertus (?)

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