Your In Charge:what Architect do you Hire?

[jim__janosik]

You are the Director of the Redevelopment Agency for the
City of La QUinta,CA. You just bought 525 acres of some of the best land left in the desert. Mountain backdrops, down valley views. The property is centered in the middle of TPC
Stadium, Tradition, Quarry, Citrus, Mountain, Dunes, and others.  You have to request that interested parties submit an
SOQ, statement of qualifications for review. The architect has to compete for the job. Beyond architectural merit the candidates must work within a budget, work with team, produce a set of plans for review by the world. Who do you invite, who do you choose? How do you choose. 45 holes of resort golf.  You are trying to upstage the City of Palm Springs
resort golf, Taqhuitz Creek, Indian Wells TEd Robinson layout,
Palm Deserts Hurdzan Fry's Desert WIllow.

What do you do?

[cary lichtenstein]

Answeer a few questions first.
1. What is the budget?
2. What type of Hotel or Hotels will be on the property?
3. Housing?
4. What type of courses do you vision for the property?
5. Which architects do you presently like and who do u dislike?
6. How do u want to distinguish yourself from your competition?

[A_Clay_Man]

I know of the origins of this soon to be course and they were in one guys head. Todd Pringle went to the Mayor of LaQuinta and said how the people of that little city didn't have a muni for their own. I know for a fact that that outdoing another community attitude will almost clearly ruin any hope the course will be "for the people" of La Quinta. But, If I were a fly on the wall and I could have input I would argue till I'm blue in the face for something different than the local fare, i'd get the bunker hill boys to do a number on all that house lined crap that's in the neighborhood. After all why would you want to enter a shrinking market with the same product. Gauranteed loser. New different and bold would be my advice. Also gauranteed not to be listened to.

[Brad Klein]

Whenever I'm asked this question I have four stock answers, in order. They usually think I'm kidding, which I'm not.

1. myself
2. dead guys
3. guys you never heard of
4. no, not him, he's overrated

[Don_Mahaffey]

Jim,
I'm sure all the usual suspects will get a shot, but let me add a few, Neal Meagher, Mike DeVries, Todd Eckenrode (sp?)
I grew up in La Quinta, where exactly is the site?
Thanks, Don

[willhammer (Guest)]

Choose Reese Jones, Tom Fazio, or a PGA Touring golfer.

[Joel_Stewart]

Choose Reese Jones,.

Its spelled Rees.

This question is a no win situation.  This group obviously is going to say C&C or Doak or Devries etc. except this project and the people in power have no idea about classical architecture.  You are talking muni golf for retired people which is not a market or demographic that this web site has the ability to talk about.

[Jim_Kennedy]

Jim,
Ken Dye

[jg7236]

Neal Meagher
4457 Linda Way
Pleasanton, CA 94566
925-417-7513 (office)
925-200-3395 (mobile office)

[John Chilver-Stainer]

Probably the fairest way and one which would squeeze the optimal possibilites out of your site would be to set up a competition.
Put up a good prize for the top 5 places.
Have a grand jury of at least 9 persons including 2 GCArchitects, environmentalist and accountant.
Define the course perimeter, restrictions and budget.
Invite all Golf Course Architects who are interested through the public domain.
They should submit their ideas in Plans and sketches, a Report, a Cost Estimate including their fees within 40 days.
The winner doesn't necessarily get the job.

 

[Flint]

Joel

It's spelled "it's", with an apostrophe.

[TEPaul]

Here's an interesting name for consideration.

I once asked one of the architects who most everyone on here seems to admire tremendously who he admires the most in architecture. He said; "Probably a guy nobody much has ever heard of".

When I asked why, he said---"Because I think he's about as creative as anyone I've seen but he doesn't say much and he sure doesn't speak in the "sound bites" apparently necessary to sell yourself well today".

So I said, well, who is he anyway?

He said---"A guy named Rod Whitman."

[Jeff Fortson]

This new site I think is just north of PGA West off of Jefferson Rd.

Jim Janosik,

How are you doing?  I don't know if you remember me but I worked at La Quinta Resort and Golf Club as an Assistant Golf Pro when you were the Super there.  How's life and where are you at now?  By the way, Indian Wells Golf Resort, and Tahquitz Creek, from a course merit standpoint, aren't going to be tough properties to upstage.  Desert Willow will be a tougher challenge for the City of La Quinta to outclass in my opinion.  Hope all is well, and take care.

Jeff Fortson

[guest]

Whoever it is had better be able to produce a set of plans and specs and all that goes with it. No scratching in the dirt with a stick will do.

[A_Clay_Man]

40 days! I guess the lessons from Friar Head hasn't reached the status quo, yet.

I'd take each archie out to the site and see who spends the most time has the most passion about it and then I'd pick him or her. Another thing I would do is hire Dan King to make sure that history isn't repeated.

[Kelly_Blake_Moran]

Jim,

You should consider Todd Eckonrode and Geoff Shackleford, because they are probably close to your area, and probably practice a style of architecture that would get the most out of the land.  In a similar vein if you know architects that practice in the same way are in the area doing other courses then you should contact them, like Hanse, Doak, etc.  I can not vouch for TE or GS but you can do the homework and see if they are what everyone says they are.  

If you are trying to outdo Ted Robinson then hire your grandmother and save the architect's fee.  If you are trying to outdo Dana Fry then hire Dana Fry and instruct him to outdo himself.  If you want a great golf course then hire someone who will live with the site.  Insist on visiting their work during the interview process and choose some of the more exotic places on their resumes.  Have some fun with it because it will be one of the greatest experiences in your life.  

[Ben Cowan-Dewar]

Tom Paul,
Whitman's experience extends to the La Quinta area, where he worked for Dye. However, most would not know that either!  

[jim__janosik]

Don:  The site is in between the Tradition and PGA West, North of %@ and West of JEfferson, used to be called the Ranch Project when Landmark had it. Jeff, I'll never forget you
buddy, life is good, can't complain. Leading contenders for the project are Jacobsen HArdy and Palmer. I am recomending to to the City they invite Todd, C&C and others of that "catagory: to submit qualifications. Its a complicated review process.  No houses planned, just one hotel and some time shares. To all interested call the City of La Quinta 760-777-7100 and ask for Mark Wiess. The RFQ will be issued in the next 4 weeks. To those really interested the conceptual master plan is on the City's web site.

[GeoffreyC]

Some good choices so far-  

Just make sure they agree to hire Tommy Naccarato as a design consultant.  

[Mike_Cirba]

I'd simply want to hire someone who would view the project as a once in a lifetime opportunity, and who has shown a passion about finding golf holes in his architectural ventures to date.  I'd want someone who would move there for the duration and tell me honestly if there were actually 45 holes of golf on the site.  I'd want someone who would be more interested in creating/building a reputation through the resulting golf course than someone who is looking to inflate their financial portfolio.  I'd want someone who has proven that they can work in a variety of settings and who has similarly proven that they can enhance the naturally unique features of disparate sites.

Given those criteria, a lot of really good names have been mentioned, so I'd just add Kelly Blake Moran to the list because besides meeting the criteria above, he's also too graciously humble to add himself.

[TEPaul]

"No scratching in the dirt with a stick will do."

Guest:

That's a damned shame. Dirt scratching, particularly in the beginning but frankly at any time is one of the best conceptual expressions and communication devices known in the history of golf course architecture.

But if voluminous plans and specs is what you want you won't have any problem buying those these days. Would you like the width on the parking spaces measured and included too?

[Jeff Mingay]

TEPaul,

Whitman's one of the best at scratching in the dirt with a stick - a skill he acquired from Pete Dye and Bill Coore, no doubt  

We had a pretty neat situation at Blackhawk in suburban Edmonton that enabled us to scuplt the golf course 'on the fly' sort of speak. Over the two year duration of the project (2001-02), I can't recall a drawn plan of any sort appearing on-site. But, I can assure you, there was a lot of scratching in the dirt with a stick!

[A_Clay_Man]

Let's put a twist on the proceedings and guess who will be given the job.

I'd say with his keen interest in that particular community, Arnie Palmer may low-ball an estimate just to get his name on the project. A perfect compliment to his resturant.

[jim__janosik]

TPaul,

I have built by dirt scratching and the laborious public works process. Both had plenty of arm waving, freedom to create.
But, you can't turn anyone loose with $15,000,000 of taxpayer
money without any accountablity. Where the "process" comes in is for example after a greens complex is built and sand in the core and someone says I don't like it lower it a foot you have an approval process that the designer signs off on it before. If he wants it changed then he pays for it. Not everyone can work in that environment.

Ocean Trails fell in the Pacific because of "dirt scratching"
methods. It was a 22 million lawsuit settled out of court. My previous employer did the foresnic project management for
the insurance company.

As far as Palmer being a shoe in, its not about price. All interested parties submit an SOQ, statement of qualifications,
for review. You submit two sealed envelopes, one with qualifications, one with price. If you are ranked #1 they open your envelope to discuss $$$.

[A_Clay_Man]

I heard the land was 6 mil, added to 15 is 21 mil. Outrageous.