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John_Cullum

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Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #50 on: January 06, 2006, 10:07:06 AM »
As far as relating the clubhouse to the course, the best combination of clubhouse and course interaction I have seen is Royal Lytham and St Annes. The 1st tee is right out the proshop, the practice putting green is between the proshop and clubhouse, and the clubhouse is hard against the 18th green. Throw in the dormy house behind the putting green, and it is a pretty impresssive and efficient setup. The architecture of the proshop, dormy house and clubhouse combo probably outshine the architecture of the course.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2006, 10:08:35 AM by John Cullum »
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BCrosby

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Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #51 on: January 06, 2006, 10:41:25 AM »
Jeff -

My wife and I played Palmetto last spring. A beautiful, cool, breezy afternoon. The sun was settting as we finished and everything was closing up. My intrepid wife, a sometime travel writer, convinced Tommy Moore to give us a look at the old clubhouse.

I was a wonderfully spooky tour. The dark wood in the locker rooms, the engraved mantles, the parquet flooring, all pretty haunting. After Tommy left us, we walked back out to the first tee. A full moon had risen from behind the pines and Stanford White's little clubhouse was aglow. I will never forget that evening.

Bob

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jeffwarne

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Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #52 on: January 06, 2006, 11:04:09 AM »
Bob,
You mean I gotta go in there now?

I pity the poor person who gets the job at Palmetto after Tom Moore leaves-the guy is never not there-I mean never-I had Tom do a sneak attack on my daughters (i.e. giving them a lesson without knowing they were taking a lesson)
they loved it.
Whatever he makes is not enough.
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Eric Franzen

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Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #53 on: January 06, 2006, 11:16:29 AM »
Quote from: Pete Lavallee on January 05, 2006, 10:39:41 PM
How about a Clubhouse that is so close to the field of play as to be very intimidating? I can think of no better example than the 14th at Woking; nothing like skulling your short wedge off Mrs Pinkerton Smythe's tea cup on the verranda just behind the green.

Same with Prestwick St Nicholas 18th. Ends with a long one-shotter of 227 yds with the club house on the right side. An uncontrolled fade and something will break - either on the club house or on the close by parking lot.
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BCrosby

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #54 on: January 06, 2006, 11:20:40 AM »
Jeff -

Yes, you gotta go there.

This is how good Tommy Moore is. Without saying a word he talked me into buying a Palmetto club history that I had already decided I would not buy. He just stood behind the counter with that beatific smile of his. Next thing I knew I was handing him my credit card.

He's a pro at many different levels.

Bob
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John Shimp

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #55 on: January 06, 2006, 11:43:27 AM »
Tommy Williamsen,
I have been in the redone clubhouse at Palmetto. Just a beautiful little building.  Part of it is mens/womens locker rooms. Rest is formal areas that arent used.  I read in the newsletter that they just hired an architect to redo the proshop/other part of mens locker room.  

Agree with all the comments re: Tom Moore.

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Scott_Burroughs

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Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #56 on: January 06, 2006, 01:15:08 PM »
On behalf of Jason Tetterton, here is the Stanford White-
designed clubhouse at Palmetto GC:



and the separate pro shop:

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Brent Hutto

Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #57 on: January 06, 2006, 01:31:09 PM »
Scott,

Thanks for the photos. That's a great shot of the clubhouse. That looks like part of the eighteenth green in the foreground but my memory of the layout is fuzzy. I didn't recall the clubhouse facing in quite that direction.

Today would be a nice day to play at Palmetto. Sunny, 50 degrees, one or two clubs worth of breeze. Perfect golf weather at a perfect golf club.
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Tommy Williamsen

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Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #58 on: January 06, 2006, 04:46:36 PM »
I agree.  Tommy Moore is one of the great gentlemen in golf.  He is so proud of his club and loves being the pro there.  The welcome he gives is as good as I have experienced.
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Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #59 on: January 07, 2006, 04:30:07 AM »
I like a low profile clubhouse that is a part of rather than dominates the landscape.  Kingston Heath fits the bill.  I particularly liked it after I learned how much players on the first tee are scrutinized by those inside.

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T_MacWood

Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #60 on: January 07, 2006, 10:23:27 AM »
I think the clubhouse is important....often it is the first thing and last thing you experience. It doesn't necessarily have to be spectacular, in fact that might actually be a negative if it standsout too much. A nice modest clubhouse that blends well with its surrrounds (which includes the regional tradtition) and the golf course.

A bad clubhouse is difficult to overcome...some bad examples: Southern Pines and Firestone. For those who've played Banff from the old and new clubhouse, how does it change your experience?
« Last Edit: January 07, 2006, 10:24:51 AM by Tom MacWood »
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Craig_Rokke

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Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #61 on: January 07, 2006, 10:31:56 AM »
I don't want to go to far out on a limb here--I haven't played Phila CC,
and it's been a couple years since I've been in the clubhouse--but my
recollection is that the clubhouse is basically cream colored, and has
lines that are closer to contemporary than the classic ones you might
expect from a classic course built in a neighborhood of manor-type homes. The inside of the facility is nicely appointed and tastefully done. Does the outside relate well to the course?
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Patrick_Mucci

Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #62 on: January 07, 2006, 05:48:04 PM »
Scott,

It's amazing how good architecture stands the test of time.

That's a beautiful clubhouse.

Simple, but elegant.

I think that Atlantic, Metedeconk and Tuxedo used the same architect for their low key clubhouses.

Quote from: Scott_Burroughs on January 06, 2006, 01:15:08 PM

On behalf of Jason Tetterton, here is the Stanford White-
designed clubhouse at Palmetto GC:



and the separate pro shop:


« Last Edit: January 07, 2006, 05:48:36 PM by Patrick_Mucci »
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Brian Marion

Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #63 on: January 08, 2006, 09:14:25 PM »
Quote from: Craig_Rokke on January 07, 2006, 10:31:56 AM
I don't want to go to far out on a limb here--I haven't played Phila CC,
and it's been a couple years since I've been in the clubhouse--but my
recollection is that the clubhouse is basically cream colored, and has
lines that are closer to contemporary than the classic ones you might
expect from a classic course built in a neighborhood of manor-type homes. The inside of the facility is nicely appointed and tastefully done. Does the outside relate well to the course?

My recollection is that the men's locker room and the pro shop used what was the barn and the "clubhouse" was the old manor house for what I guess was a dairy farm. I think everything was white not cream colored.
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David Druzisky

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Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #64 on: January 09, 2006, 12:10:50 PM »
Many of the clubhouses that have been mentioned here so far are across the pond or old ones here in the states.  With that in mind it would seem that the cart and related cart paths have had a considerable effect on what can be done with the relationship between the golf holes and the building.

I know I have had to be very creative in efforts to keep the concrete to a minimum but it is difficult at best with cart staging, access, etc.  Now many emergency services need all sorts of concrete around the buildings for their purposes.

I like the set up at Kingsbarns for a new facility.  The parking lot is tucked back behind the mounds and the drop-off circle is very low profile.  The reltionship to the first tee is nice as you just sort of meander out the pro shop door onto the teeing area.  Again no extra area for carts.  The building is a nice size too with a pro shop and bar with the rooms up stairs.  More like a house than a place of business and that translates to a comfortable feeling.

That Stanford White building at Palmetto looks great and that new one at Redtail looks fantastic  Thanks for the pics.  I have always liked the look of the clubhouse at The Valley Club of Montecito.  (I have not been to Royal Melbourne but didn't someone tell me that is really simple?)

I assisted a club when they re-built their clubhouse recently.  Huge sprawling 50,000sf building.  I believe the work they had me do around the building (which was considerable) really helped it fit with the golf.  It does not appear that big and we were able to hide most of the concrete from all the key viewing points on the course and on the patios etc..  The old facility had the remote pro shop at the first and 10th tees and that was a nice situation.  As with most new facilities they moved the pro sjop up to the new building so they could make sure they got traffic through it easier - probably with sales in mind.  

Any club thinking of a new or redo building really needs to bring on their golf course architect to study site plan and traffic flow.  That intereface between the golf and the building can be very dynamic and is different between public, private and resort situations.  This does not happen near enough and the results are that dissconnect previously mentioned.  They all suffer the 10 lbs of potatos in a 5 lb bag syndrome it seems.

That odd situation at Toms Stone Eagle works well because it is quirky different. It is about leaving the cars and crap behind and entering a completetly different environment.  You are anticipating it all the way up the hill.  It would probably be better in a resort situation though - but who cares. After the round you are not going to want to leave the airee.

It all really does effect the overall experience.

DbD
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Kelly Blake Moran

Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #65 on: January 09, 2006, 01:03:26 PM »
The clubhouse at Colonial in Ft. Worth is nice.  You can watch tee shots to 16 green.  Teeshot on #17, and all the play on 18.  

Probably the best is Shinnecock.

I thought the clubhouse behind #18 at Pinehurst was a little dreary looking.  Not a good setting.

I often have weird dreams about playing golf and for some reason I am indoors and it is very discomforting trying to play shots from room to room, but I kind of got that same feeling looking at the green at Pinehurst, that I was about to play indoors.
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John Shimp

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Re:How the Clubhouse Relates to the Course
« Reply #66 on: January 09, 2006, 02:38:21 PM »
Thought I'd copy a link in on Stanford White, famed architect born in 1853 and murdered in 1906, who in addition to designing the clubhouses for Shinnecock and Palmetto (the 2 oldest in the US) was responsible for other famous architecture such as Madison square garden, arch at Washington Square, and numerous homes for the rich and famous such as the Astors and Vanderbilts.
http://www.antiquesandthearts.com/archive/stan.htm
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