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mark chalfant

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Rouge Park's architect ?
« on: November 12, 2007, 09:39:08 AM »
This  michigan course has  nice terrain, good doglegs, and a
winding brook that enlivens  strategy. Has anyone played here  the vintage is c, 1930  is this a Wilfred  Reid deign ?

thanks
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Chris_Blakely

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2007, 09:52:45 AM »
I do not believe the course is a Wilfred Reid design.  The greens do not have a lot of similarities to Bald Mountain, Brae Burn or several of the others I have played.  Rouge Park's greens are much smaller in size than the Reid courses I have played.
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Jeff_Mingay

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2007, 01:12:17 PM »
mark,

Word around the Detroit area seems to indicate Rouge Park was originally laid-out by Donald Ross. I'm not sure though. I've never been there. Yet, I too, have heard interesting reports on the course.
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Chris_Blakely

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #3 on: November 12, 2007, 01:59:08 PM »
I too have heard Rouge Park was laid out by Ross.  The greens have some resemblance to other Ross courses (public) that have not been under the best maintenance upkeep.

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Chuck Brown

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Re:Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2007, 02:13:31 PM »
I had always presumed that it was one of the Ross courses like Rackham or Warren Valley.
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Brett Hochstein

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Re:Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2007, 04:05:30 PM »
this is something i've always wondered as well.  word says Ross, but nothing lists that as being true.  i can't give a definitive opinion, since i have not played it since a rainy jv match 6 years ago.  seemed slightly Ross-like at the time but not entirely.  i hope someone can figure this out
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Chuck Brown

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2007, 04:38:27 PM »
I just checked and the American Golf (management) website says that the architect is "unknown."  I can think of no good reason that if the designer had been Donald Ross, for a municipally-owned golf course, that fact would be "unknown."

Just curious, for my own confused benefit; was the Billy Rogell Golf Course a Ross design?  in all honesty, I've never played Rogell or Rouge Park...
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Sean_A

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Re:Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2007, 05:09:20 PM »
Quote from: Chuck Brown on November 12, 2007, 04:38:27 PM
I just checked and the American Golf (management) website says that the architect is "unknown."  I can think of no good reason that if the designer had been Donald Ross, for a municipally-owned golf course, that fact would be "unknown."

Just curious, for my own confused benefit; was the Billy Rogell Golf Course a Ross design?  in all honesty, I've never played Rogell or Rouge Park...

Chuck

The now New Rogell course owned by the Greater Grace Temple is a Ross.  I think the course is very much intact only because it has been neglected for as long as I've known the place.  I am hoping the new owners put some cash into the course.  Maybe remove trees and fix some glaring drainage problems to start with.  In any case, its well worth a look.  For me its one of those sleeper courses like Brae Burn.
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« Last Edit: November 12, 2007, 05:10:55 PM by Sean Arble »
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Tom Roewer

Re:Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2007, 09:56:04 AM »
I spoke with an asst professional there and he said they got archives from the attic that had much details, (land acquisitions, etc.) and no where was an architect stated.  
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Jeff_Mingay

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2007, 10:02:50 AM »
Sean,

I, too, hope some monies are dedicated by the new owners of Rogell to jazz the course up.

Some tree and bunker work along with some adjustment to mowing lines would do wonders. It could be a real gem, in a historic sense especially.

I think they realize what they have, too.
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Mike Bodo

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2020, 09:11:05 AM »
Sorry to bump such an old post up, but I am trying to solve a conundrum and I'm hoping the experts here can help. I came across the architectural plans for the Rouge Park Golf Course from an article posted in 2018 on public radio station, WDET's website asking its listeners if they have information on who designed this Detroit municipal gem.

Hand-drawn map of the course from 1928.WDET/Laura Herberg

As many here and elsewhere who have played the course have posited (I have not played the course, just FYI), it has many attributes of a Ross course and other known Ross designs in the area built around this time. Second, the typeface and font size choices at the bottom of the architectural plan look eerily familiar other Ross Associates plans I've seen. Problem is, there is no name that appears on this document attesting to the designer, which is baffing, as normally Donald J Ross and or the Donald Ross Associates names would be on what appears to be a finished plan. The style of the hole line drawings contained in the plan and hole features (green complexes, bunkers, etc.) look similar to those I've seen in other Ross plans. Given the period the course was built and the projects Ross was known to have going on at several courses in the area at the time, is there enough evidence here to say with a high degree of certainty that Rouge Park is in fact a Donald Ross design course?

There are some interesting connections made in the article to the likelihood of it being a Ross, which you can check out at the link below, but at what point can we declare it being so?


https://wdet.org/posts/2018/08/20/87182-curiosid-who-designed-the-rouge-park-golf-course/
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"90% of all putts left short are missed." - Yogi Berra

Jeff_Brauer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Rouge Park's architect ?
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2020, 09:46:01 AM »
Mike,


My guess is that if they had a DR designed course, they would have touted it, no?  While the plan is similar in style, I recall many searches of old courses up in Chicago where the drafting style was similar, but it turned out to be some local landscape architect.  Then as now, I wonder if a park district course would always hire an architect, much less a signature one.


I played Rackham and Rouge a few years back.  Rouge didn't strike me as having any architectural genius or similarity to Ross.  If it did, I do think there are many cases where some of the big name guy shapers or crew managed to find their way to other projects as side jobs, or between Ross jobs, whatever.


I will point out I am merely speculating.
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