Jack Nicklaus at St. Patricks in Ireland

« **on:** October 27, 2006, 02:07:10 PM »

Did we not talk about this? I saw that they are begining to move dirt and I think it's going to be 36 holes.

Is Jim Lipe around and can share any details?

« **Reply #1 on:** October 27, 2006, 05:56:41 PM »

John

Yes, the shaping of the new St Patricks courses is underway. What would you like to know?

« **Reply #2 on:** October 27, 2006, 06:32:28 PM »

John Foley -

St. Patricks has been mentioned here a number of times over the past 3 or 4 years, well before Nicklaus got involved. My understanding is that there have been 36 rather rudimentary holes there for at least 5-10 years.

It would be interesting to know whether Nicklaus is creating entirely new routings for both courses or if he is keeping some of the existing holes.

DT

« **Reply #3 on:** October 27, 2006, 06:50:11 PM »

David - Thats what I remember, very rudimentary 36 holes, almost no support structure, pay at the B&B across the street, difficult to even find the course. I was suprised when I heard that Jack & team had somethign in the works, then I hear their moving dirt already.

Jim - What are the overall site plans? I recall the old owners sold it to a developer, is that correct? Will it be 36 or 18? How are the dunes at the site? Any permitting difficulties? What are the holes concepts? Are you involved at all? Can you share a routing map?

« **Reply #4 on:** October 27, 2006, 08:32:12 PM »

John and David

36 brand new golf holes

Beautiful large and small sand dunes overlooking bay.
18 hole course maximizing the seaside and 18 hole interior course.
I was involved in the initial routing "discovery" process. Jack took Chris Cochran and myself over on two occasions. We had a blast walking the property in knee high vegetation in several areas and is a constant rain. Imagine that!

Most of the holes lay in the natural terrain very nicely and Jack is emphatic to move as little material as possible.

We are very excited about the potential of this great piece of property. I am quite sure it will be a very special course. It will not be an Amercian parkland course in Ireland, in case some may be wondering.

Sorry, I do not have a plan I can share at this time.

Permitting not a problem. The site was going to be used as a RV site on the sea. What a terrible waste of a fantastic golf course site that would have been. Hard to imagine that was close to happening.

5 Star Hotel will be developed on site.

« **Reply #5 on:** October 27, 2006, 08:45:57 PM »

Is there still some time to experience how golf was played 100 years ago?

« **Reply #6 on:** October 27, 2006, 08:49:41 PM »

Jim - Thanks for the update.

Did you think about having both 18's near the sea?

How was the discover process compared to some of the less exciting sites you've worked on.

Are you continuing on there?

Do keep us posted.

« **Reply #7 on:** October 27, 2006, 09:09:08 PM »

John

yes, we did make an effort to have both courses touch the sea. However, in the final determination, Jack didn't want to compromise both routings just for that to happen. The land configuration allowed for one truly great seaside dune course that maximized the best part of the land. The interior course has views but is not right on the beach edge of the dunes like the ocean course. Without seeing the land configuration, it may be difficult to understand what I am trying to convey.

It may surprise you to know that on most course that I work on, there is little discovery and much more imagination and creation. All architects welcome the opportunity to work on land that allows the "discovery" process. This land is one such opportunity.

I don't know how much more, if any, input Chris and I will have in the construction of the course. We are both very busy with projects worldwide and our design associate that lives in Europe, Dirk Bouts, will be taking the lead on the project. Jeremy Miller, a very talented shaper, will be taking the lead in that capacity.
Jack will be spend considerable time on site as the project unfolds.

« **Reply #8 on:** October 28, 2006, 02:07:20 AM »

Jim, sounds real cool. Any ETA on finishing the course?

« **Reply #9 on:** October 28, 2006, 07:57:30 AM »

Mr Lipe,

A few questions if I may.

What was your opinion of the Hackett and second course (apologies to the female archy) previously on this land?

How rudimentary was it? What was deficient in the routing that led to the complete (this is a presumption that nothing has been kept, please correct me if I am wrong) overhaul rather than a renovation of sorts?

If a complete overhaul was the result what has been the reaction to losing a Hackett (albeit rudimentary) course to gain a Nicklaus group course. Are we on this website the only people who would even care? Is anything planned to celebrate the new project's heritage or does its history begin from 2007.

Thanks for any insights you may provide.

« **Reply #10 on:** October 28, 2006, 06:43:11 PM »

Sean

The second course existing done by the lady pro was little more than grass that had been mowed. Very rudimentary.
The Hackett course had 2-3 interesting holes, but in the total scheme of things none of the existing would be in keeping with the overall routing of the new course that included some land that Hackett didn't have for his disposal....and it is actually the most exciting part of the site. Eddie didn't have the same opportunity that lies before us.

« **Reply #11 on:** October 28, 2006, 10:57:31 PM »

This is where in Ireland, please?

Thanks.

« **Reply #12 on:** October 28, 2006, 11:05:23 PM »

Don -

St. Patricks is near Carrigart, Co. Donegal. It is 20-30 miles north of Letterkenny.

DT

« **Reply #13 on:** October 28, 2006, 11:22:44 PM »

Quote from: David_Tepper on October 28, 2006, 11:05:23 PM

Don -

St. Patricks is near Carrigart, Co. Donegal. It is 20-30 miles north of Letterkenny.

DT

Thanks, DT ---

« **Reply #14 on:** October 29, 2006, 04:28:49 AM »

Can anyone provide a link to the long thread on this a couple of years back. I believe TEP started it and called it something like "The true undicovered gem" (apologies for my memory). It played out something like a literary quiz or Borges on Golf.

It deserves to be in the GCA 'Hall of Fame' (N.Y.E.

).

« **Reply #15 on:** October 29, 2006, 04:42:06 AM »

Tony

Just type in "Carrigart" on the advanced search facility and you'll find it. The thread was started Jan 7, 2005 by TEP. I'd give the thread 1*.

« **Reply #16 on:** October 29, 2006, 10:54:11 AM »

www.stpatricksgolflinks.com

« **Reply #17 on:** October 29, 2006, 04:48:39 PM »

Quote from: Rich Goodale on October 29, 2006, 04:42:06 AM

Tony

Just type in "Carrigart" on the advanced search facility and you'll find it. The thread was started Jan 7, 2005 by TEP. I'd give the thread 1*.

No sorry I've had 3 different attempts and once again the search engine and I can't find anything. Anyone else find it using the info provided?

« **Reply #18 on:** October 29, 2006, 05:04:29 PM »

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forums2/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=16210;start=0

I think this is the thread that you are looking for.

Also search Donegal and you will find a plethora of info.

Special note of Mike Sweeney reply #8 ans Jack Marr reply #19 on the attached thread.

« **Reply #19 on:** October 29, 2006, 05:25:31 PM »

Thank you Bill that's the one.

Jack as much as I admire you for what you've acheived, forgive me for prejudging what you're doing.

They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot
With a pink hotel, a boutique
And a swinging hot spot
Dont it always seem to go
That you dont know what youve got
Till its gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot

They took all the trees
Put em in a tree museum
And they charged the people
A dollar and a half just to see em
Dont it always seem to go
That you dont know what youve got
Till its gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot

Hey farmer farmer
Put away that d.d.t. now
Give me spots on my apples
But leave me the birds and the bees
Please!
Dont it always seem to go
That you dont know what youve got
Till its gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot

Late last night
I heard the screen door slam
And a big yellow taxi
Took away my old man
Dont it always seem to go
That you dont know what youve got
Till its gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot

« **Reply #20 on:** October 29, 2006, 06:29:17 PM »

That is what is so great about th GCA. Mr. Muldoon can apoogize for prejudging Mr. Nicklaus, and then go ahead and prejudge his work.
One must wonder if that sort of thing would be done to C&C or and of the other class favorites on GCA.

« **Reply #21 on:** October 29, 2006, 06:34:37 PM »

Jim, Thanks for the input. I thought Jack was doting the I this weekend.

« **Reply #22 on:** October 29, 2006, 10:44:32 PM »

Tiger

Yes, Jack did dot the eye yesterday...and a little side note that you will appreciate. He told me Friday when we were talking a little football, and we joke around about OSU and LSU, so he told me that when he was out there waving his hat to the crowd, I should just imagine that it was purple and gold. When I saw him do that and smiling, I had to smile also, and I did imagine as he said.
We have to bring it this Sat, n'cest pas???

« **Reply #23 on:** October 30, 2006, 12:41:34 AM »

Q How many folksingers does it take to change a lightbulb?
A Two. One to do the work and the other to sing about the old one.

« **Reply #24 on:** October 30, 2006, 05:06:01 AM »

Quote from: Tony Muldoon on October 29, 2006, 04:48:39 PM

Quote from: Rich Goodale on October 29, 2006, 04:42:06 AM
Tony

Just type in "Carrigart" on the advanced search facility and you'll find it. The thread was started Jan 7, 2005 by TEP. I'd give the thread 1*.

Try again, Tony, and stop quoting Melanie if you want to retain your street cred on here!

No sorry I've had 3 different attempts and once again the search engine and I can't find anything. Anyone else find it using the info provided?

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