[PCCraig]

Hey Everyone,

 I'm making a trip next week to Kiawah. The Girlfriend's Parents have a home there, and I believe have access to the two private courses there. I searched the back pages here and all I found was information on the Ocean Course. Can anyone who is familiar with the Island give me some suggestions/comments with regards to the other courses there?

 Also, I'll be playing a course called Briar Creek one day, I believe a Rees Jones Design, and I have heard great things about it...anyone play there?

 Thanks!

[DTaylor18]

Pat, I only had time to play the Ocean Course at Kiawah, but all of the caddies and members that I talked to said that Cassique was the clear #2 out there.

I also played Briar's Creek when I was down there and enjoyed it.  It has a very tough set of finishing holes and is rarely crowded.  It is a low key place that you will enjoy. My only real complaint is that there are a few too many long forced carries off the tee.

Report back and let us know what you think!

[PCCraig]

Thanks for the info so far.

How does Kiawah compair to Pinehurst in terms of golfing quality in the area and in general charm? Anyone have experience at both?

Thanks!

[John Shimp]

Pinehurst and Kiawah are very different.  Pinehurst is old and Kiawah new.  Pinehurst is all about golf with the courses close together and fewer houses alongside.  Kiawah is a multi-activity resort with beach activities, bike riding, etc as prominent as the golf.  Pinehurst Village and the older hotels (Carolina and Holly Inns, Pine Crest, etc.) have lots of charm.  Kiawah is really nice but charming is not a word that comes to mind.  

As far as golf quality, nothing at Kiawah is as good as #2 but I really like the Ocean Course.  It is more playable than it used to be and is a very high quality golf experience.  It is located at the end of the Island and is therefore quite isolated.  There are no houses along the course.  Caddies I have had have been good.  If the wind is up the Ocean Course can provide an over the top challenge though.  Pick your tees carefully if it is real windy unless you have a stellar game.  I haven't played the 2 private courses but have heard some good things.  The Fazio River Course is supposed to be hard.  The other public courses are fine but nothing spectacular.  

[Jerry Kluger]

Pat: Kiawah is very special and a very enjoyable experience and I have vacationed there a number of times with my family.  Cassique is a very good course and wonderful to play with a caddie.  The River Course is good but not nearly the quality of Cassique.  The Ocean Course needs no introduction.  Of the others, I am in the minority but I believe that Cougar Point has the most interesting holes.  Dining is limited but there is one really good restaurant and I believe it is called the Red Sky Grill - you get to it by turning left toward Seabrook when leaving Kiawah and it is in a little center on your right just before the entrance to Seabrook - it isn't in the center with the marina.  

[Glenn Spencer]

Pat,

First off, that sounds like a great trip!! I have done all that you are asking, I didn't play at Briar's Creek though, I just walked it. It looked like you had to hit your driver. I think the Kiawah and Pinehurst comparision is a pretty good one. These are two of the few places that make you feel like golf is the only thing that is important. Pinehurst #2 is a great golf course if that is what you like-GOLF. If you like GOLF with a splash of absolute beauty and a bit of wind and salt air, you are much going to prefer the Ocean Course. The charm at both places is amazing and I don't know how they do it, but the Ocean Course in my mind, is one of the great expriences in America. The golf is probably better at 2, but if asked I would play the Ocean Course every time. Don't know if that makes sense. Kind of like picking a woman I guess.

[Matt MacIver]

I am playing The Ocean Course tomorrow, my favorite course I've ever played.  #2 at Pinehurst is probably in my top 5 (again, that I've played and that list is short  ).  

All the comments above are right on.  Goes without saying, but you'll play one ball all day at #2 and you can go through a dozen at TOC; draw your conclusions re: recovery shots, options, etc.  But the setting at TOC puts it a step ahead of #2 in my book...I've seen a lot of pine tree-lined fairways but rarely do I get to see/smell/hear/feel the ocean on every shot.  

I think the TOC clubhouse is under complete renovation, so you'll miss that part of it, vs. the wonderful clubhouse, history etc. at Pinehurst.  

I too have heard that Cassique is the better of the two private courses and is the one I have more interest in seeing, but I've not seen either.  

I've played the other 4 public courses 1x but don't remember enough about any of them.  I think the general consensus ranking is Turtle/Osprey, then Cougar and last Oak, which is actually just off the island proper.  

Enjoy your week, I'm looking forward to mine.  

[Glenn Spencer]

Matt,

Should Pat even ask himself to try and swing a club at those other courses? I am sure that they are great and all, but isn't there really just one course at Kiawah?

[Doug Sobieski]

Pat:

Not a lot of time to elaborate, but I was very pleasantly surprised by Briars Creek. It is one of the better Rees originals that I've played. My only suggestion is that you know EXACTLY where you are going on the way there. The sign that indicates where to turn isn't very prominent (I think it was simply a picture of a bird or something)!

Play well!

Sobe

[Glenn Spencer]

Doug is correct,it is like one of those stork or whooping crane type things. It is a nice drive down those back roads though. We found it no problem, but it could be hard if not really paying attention.

[Matt MacIver]

Personally, I really didn't think there was anything special about any of the other 4 publc courses and won't pay to play them again.  Despite TOC's $$ I would play it again and again before the others, or go towards Charleston and play some courses there.  

But never having played either Cassique or River, if I had the chance I would give both of those a go.  Maybe it's the $150k price tag that has piqued my interest (oops, wrong thread).

[Sean Leary]

Cassique and the River are DEFINITELY worth playing...

[Mike Vegis @ Kiawah]

The River Course is closed as they are doing extensive renovations to it.  You might consider Turtle Point, our Nicklaus design.  It's the site of this year's Carolina Amateur.  We're building a new clubhouse at The Ocean Course near the 18th hole so the back of the driving range is a major construciton site.  Here's an artist's rendering of it:



Pending we don't have any major storms through here this summer (knock on wood), it should be done for next May's Senior PGA Championship.

[Dave_Miller]

The River Course is closed as they are doing extensive renovations to it.  You might consider Turtle Point, our Nicklaus design.  It's the site of this year's Carolina Amateur.  We're building a new clubhouse at The Ocean Course near the 18th hole so the back of the driving range is a major construciton site.  Here's an artist's rendering of it:



Pending we don't have any major storms through here this summer (knock on wood), it should be done for next May's Senior PGA Championship.

Pat:
Three weeks ago I played the Ocean Course twice and Turtle Point once.  
Turtle Point was very enjoyable and worth playing.
Enjoy.
Best
Dave

[Jay Flemma]

As far as charm goes, Pinehurst wins that hands down.  As far as the golf course goes, edge to Kiawah...more horizontal movement in the holes, more lines of charm, more wind.  That's splitting hairs to be sure.

Stay the heck out of the bunkers at all costs.

[PCCraig]

Thank you everyone for your great comments, I am super pumped now for my trip there! The Ocean Course looks and sounds great, but what suprised me most about all of your comments was how much everyone enjoyed the Cassique Course. It looks like a fairly wide open golf course that has some neat looking green complexs, is this Tom Watson's only golf course in the US?

One sorta-nerd question for you all down there often , where is the hole that they built for the 18th in the movie verision of Bagger Vance? Can you play it?

Thanks again everyone, this was a bit of a last second trip, and it's turning out great. I'll be driving all the way from Chicago monday, maybe the only thing I'm not looking forward to is that southern heat!

[Brent Hutto]

One sorta-nerd question for you all down there often , where is the hole that they built for the 18th in the movie verision of Bagger Vance? Can you play it?

NLE, alas.

[Mike Vegis @ Kiawah]

Cassique is a great chest-thumping course.  It looks a whole lot harder than it is so when you're done, your score is usually pretty good.

Like in the book, the Bagger Vance 18th hole has returned to its natural state....  In this case, it's natural state is a driving range.  The green was directly out from the current clubhouse right on the last dune.  Theron and Damon charactors had their arguement walking backward up No. 2.  Their 17th green, where they decided to move forward with the match, was shot on the 9th green.  Jack Lemmon had his movie heart attach on the 11th hole on Cougar Point (our Gary Player Course) and the Theron/Damon scene on a park bench was shot between the 9th green and the driving range at Turtle Point (our Nicklaus course).  The rest of the golf scenes were shot at the Dye Course in Colleton River Plantation near Hilton Head.  The town scenes were shot in Savannah.  The war scenes were shot near Beaufort and the clubhouse scenes were shot at Jekell Island.  And, I'm probably one of the few people who can say he played golf with "Bobby Jones" and "Walter Hagen!!"

[PCCraig]

Well that is a bit of a bummer that the hole is no longer...what course was the hole near?

Every time I had watched the movie I alway thought that the golf scenes were all a Kiawah. If the area is half as pretty as the movie shows it as I think i'll be in good shape!

Thanks!

[Mike Vegis @ Kiawah]

Well that is a bit of a bummer...does anyone know what courses they filmed on?

Thanks!

See my reply above.

[Tim Pitner]

Pat,

I've only played the Ocean Course and Osprey Point, the Fazio course.  The Ocean is fantastic, but very difficult when I played it (pre-softening).  I enjoyed my round at Osprey, but the course isn't much to speak of--pretty standard resort stuff.  In an ideal world, you'd play the Ocean Course more than once on your trip.

[PCCraig]

Thanks again everyone for all of your great responses. I am super excited to get down there...I'll do my best to take pictures.

To the people who are familiar with the area. Can you give me any suggestions to some good local lunch/dinner spots either on or nearby the island?

[PCCraig]

Thank you everyone for all the help!!!

I'll be sure to post when I get back home a report on my trip.

Thanks again,

Pat Craig

[PThomas]

I liked Osprey better than Turtle Point...and probably liked Cougar better too

[Chris Moore]

As far as charm goes, Pinehurst wins that hands down.  As far as the golf course goes, edge to Kiawah...more horizontal movement in the holes, more lines of charm, more wind.  That's splitting hairs to be sure.

Stay the heck out of the bunkers at all costs.

Jay:

Can you describe what you mean by horizontal movement?

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