San Francisco Bay Area...LARGE AREA

« **on:** May 17, 2006, 09:07:57 PM »

Alrighty, I know there are more then a couple of GCAers who frequent the area. I may have a internship lined up from September 2006 to April 2007. I was just curious if the courses I have researched and listed below are all worth playing, and if there should be any more additions. I am simply looking for feedback on the courses conditions and attributes and design elements.

Public Courses
   San Geronimo Golf Club
   Harding Park Golf Course*
   Lake Merced Golf Club*
   Lincoln Park Golf Club
   Pasatiempo Golf Club*
   Indian Valley Golf Club
   Dark Horse Golf Club
   Pacific Grove Municipal Golf Links
   Haggin Oaks Golf Course*
   Northwood Golf Club*
   Sharp Park Golf Course*
   DeLaveaga Golf Course

Private Courses
   Mayacama Golf Club
   San Francisco Golf Club
   The Olympic Club
   Cypress Point Club*
   The Meadow Club*
   Marin Country Club
   Monterey Peninsula Country Club
   Fountain Grove Golf and Athletic Club
   Napa Valley Country Club
   Claremont Country Club*
   Green Hills Country Club*

Thanks, I appreciate the feedback!

« **Reply #1 on:** May 17, 2006, 09:22:17 PM »

Johnathan,

Why do some of the courses have an * by their name?

« **Reply #2 on:** May 17, 2006, 09:23:39 PM »

Dr. Alister Mackenzie!!!

« **Reply #3 on:** May 17, 2006, 09:30:20 PM »

Kind of a long list

« **Reply #4 on:** May 17, 2006, 10:26:06 PM »

The Preserve in Carmel, Stanford University GC, Half Moon Bay Hills course, Pebble, Spyglass Hill and Spanish Bay.

« **Reply #5 on:** May 17, 2006, 11:54:39 PM »

Johnathan,
Marin CC is not worth seeing. I can't remember a single thing about that course, other than it was fairly well conditioned. Everything else on your lists is worth seeing for one reason or another. I don't know about 3 of the last 4 publics as I haven't seen them. There is no Mackenzie connection to Harding Park I have ever heard of.
Two courses you don't have listed that are definitely worth seeing are Stevinson Ranch and Metropolitan Golf Links. SR is in the Central Valley (about 2 hours from SF), and Metropolitan is right next to the Oakland airport.
Pasatiempo is the gold standard IMO of public access golf in the Bay Area.

« **Reply #6 on:** May 18, 2006, 12:07:48 AM »

I would add Cal Club and Orinda CC to your privates list, and maybe even Sharp Park to your public...not much if any AM left, but as much as there is with some of the names you've asterisked.

Play 9 at Gleneagles near the Cow Palace as well.

« **Reply #7 on:** May 18, 2006, 12:09:00 AM »

Don't forget sporty little Tilden Park in the Berkeley hills. Very interesting course with some great views. I have no idea what the conditions are these days, it's been years, but I believe Kevin Reilley plays there some.

« **Reply #8 on:** May 18, 2006, 12:12:11 AM »

I am not trying to be a smarta** but if CPC is on that list (good course to have right there) then shouldn't Pebble and Spyglass be there as well??

« **Reply #9 on:** May 18, 2006, 12:17:01 AM »

Might as well add CordeValle and Peninsula G&CC as well

« **Reply #10 on:** May 18, 2006, 12:36:18 AM »

Quote from: Bill_McBride on May 18, 2006, 12:09:00 AM

Don't forget sporty little Tilden Park in the Berkeley hills. Very interesting course with some great views. I have no idea what the conditions are these days, it's been years, but I believe Kevin Reilley plays there some.

Good one Bill -- forgot that one. But pace of play is so slow most of the time I hesitate to recommend it. Go there some evening and just play #1...one of the toughest bunkerless par 4s anywhere.

« **Reply #11 on:** May 18, 2006, 12:37:03 AM »

Johnathan,

Here is my two cents on the courses that are worth getting to, either I have played them or had them strongly recommended...I've never heard Dr. MacKenzie was ever at Harding park. I want to say Willie Watson, and Jack Fleming.

Public Courses
San Geronimo Golf Club Yes (vernon macan)
Harding Park Golf Course* Yes (watson, fleming, PGA tour)
Lincoln Park Golf Club No hurry
Pasatiempo Golf Club* Yes
Indian Valley Golf Club
Embarassed to say have not heard of it
Dark Horse Golf Club Yes (Keith Foster)
Pacific Grove Municipal Golf Links Yes
Haggin Oaks Golf Course* No hurry, with Time Machine yes
Northwood Golf Club* Yes
Sharp Park Golf Course* Yes, gnarliest cypress trees I have seen
DeLaveaga Golf Course No hurry
Add ons:
Saddle Creek Yes
Roddy Ranch Fast and Firm, windy, Yes
Stevinson Ranch Heard it is cool.
Wente Vineyards No Hurry, concert series Yes
Metropolitan Better than I expected, but no hurry
Gleneagles 9 Yes, I've heard it is very fun
Pajaro Valley low price range, nice atmosphere
Seascape priced to high, but fun and nice atmosphere
Private Courses
Mayacama Golf Club Yes
San Francisco Golf Club Yes
The Olympic Club Yes
Cypress Point Club* Yes
The Meadow Club* Yes
Marin Country Club No Hurry
Monterey Peninsula Country Club Yes
Fountain Grove Golf and Athletic Club No Hurry
Napa Valley Country Club No Hurry
Claremont Country Club* Yes
Green Hills Country Club* Heard it is fun, never been
Lake Merced Golf Club* No Hurry, in Time Machine Yes
Morgan Creek Yes, unique and good (Kyle Phillips)
Preserve in Carmel Cool setting, underachieves though, Yes
Penninsula (beresford) Yes (Ross, Ron Forse resto, reno)
Add ons:
Orinda Country Club (willie watson, strong fairway contours, few fairway bunkers, small greens)
Los Altos G & CC (jeff brehaut, and julie inkster play it as home course)

I live in the area, so let me know if you are heading out this way.

« **Reply #12 on:** May 18, 2006, 01:45:59 AM »

GREAT....Thanks for the good recommendations so far, hope for even more!!!! Thank You All!!!

« **Reply #13 on:** May 18, 2006, 02:26:09 AM »

I'll comment on the rest later but Pacific Grove, at a minimum the back 9 and MPCC are must sees ...

Mike

« **Reply #14 on:** May 18, 2006, 04:15:52 AM »

Gleneagles was fun when I played there in the 1980's.

« **Reply #15 on:** May 18, 2006, 09:59:01 AM »

If you're going down as far as Monterrey, you might want to add on Bayonet and Black Horse at Ford Ord.

Andy

« **Reply #16 on:** May 18, 2006, 10:25:30 AM »

Mike your footnote does hurt everytime I see it. I should have mentioned Corde Valle as well. It is a wonerful golf experience much like Mayacama. Isn't there a course called something Oaks near Salinas that some of the guys on here have raved about? Tom "yahoo jet pilot" Huckaby should recall it.

« **Reply #17 on:** May 18, 2006, 10:29:17 AM »

Has anyone mentioned Presidio?

« **Reply #18 on:** May 18, 2006, 11:09:01 AM »

Tiger: not sure what course you're talking about near Salinas, but we do rave about Pajaro Valley, which is in Royal Oaks (near Watsonville) and is well worth seeing for sure.

I'd agree with all additions listed so far...

But Jonathan, you are covering a HUGE area if you go from Sacramento area all the way down to Monterey... There are literally hundreds of courses, damn near all of which are seeing for one reason or another. But I gather you want to prioritize...

Well... quick question: are you going to be able to gain access to all of these private clubs? I guess we'll assume so...

So first, I'd add a couple more worth seeing:

Mira Vista CC - near Berkeley - fantastic greens, smoothest, fastest in the area last I was there. You did ask for conditions... And in terms of design there is plenty of interest as well.

Cinnabar Hills GC - 27 holes, Harbottle, great stuff in wilds of San Jose. Goodale's fave, calls it better than Pasatiempo. One of my homes, I don't take it that far, but you won't regret going there.

There are plenty of others.

Next post I'll comment on the ones you listed already...

TH

« **Reply #19 on:** May 18, 2006, 11:14:56 AM »

OK, here goes:

Public Courses
San Geronimo Golf Club - very cool, quirky, two very different nines.
Harding Park Golf Course* - why the asterisk? No Good doctor here. Recent remodel, great for playing PGA events, not sure how great it is for us mortals...
Lake Merced Golf Club* - again, not much MacK left here... very fun course though.
Lincoln Park Golf Club - quirky to the max, must see just for your sense of humor - cool views of GG Bridge also
Pasatiempo Golf Club* - Ed's right, the gold standard for public golf
Indian Valley Golf Club - cool, quirky, set back in idyllic valley, some neat stuff, cable car from one green to tee.
Dark Horse Golf Club - very cool, Keith Foster, new, see it before inundated with homes
Pacific Grove Municipal Golf Links - must see for back nine at very least
Haggin Oaks Golf Course* - restored to what MacK is supposed to have done there - worth seeing just for that - VERY crowded
Northwood Golf Club* - 9 holer way up north, not really worth the drive, see only if you're up there anyway
Sharp Park Golf Course* - there's as much MacK in my back yard as at this course - decent muni, but don't get hopes up
DeLaveaga Golf Course - very fun, quirky, tight, weird, cool.

Private Courses
Mayacama Golf Club - awesome, well documented here
San Francisco Golf Club - ditto
The Olympic Club - ditto
Cypress Point Club* - megaditto
The Meadow Club* - ditto
Marin Country Club - I like it better than Ed - I found it to be kinda quirky and fun in that respect - but goes through houses constantly
Monterey Peninsula Country Club - both courses awesome, must see
Fountain Grove Golf and Athletic Club - is this really private now? Was always public before. Decent, nothing all that great - again see if in area (Santa Rosa) but don't make special trip for
Napa Valley Country Club - maybe a shade better than Fountain Grove, but not that much
Claremont Country Club* - must see - quirky - crossing holes - great fun
Green Hills Country Club* - no great shakes

Whew!

« **Reply #20 on:** May 18, 2006, 01:46:47 PM »

Skip Haggin Oaks at all costs, it will be a big disappointment, snack bar with history of golf in Sacramento at each table is the highlight. Have lunch there and instead go to Granite Bay CC, it's design was based on AMck concept and the members club house has some AM artifacts. Also if you make the trip to Dark Horse also play the Ridge in Auburn, supposedly designed by all three Jones and a good test, former home to LPGA. If you need a guide to Sac Valley courses, I would be happy to join you any weekend or holiday.

« **Reply #21 on:** May 18, 2006, 01:51:17 PM »

Hi Tim:

I've heard pretty much the same re Haggin Oaks - but it seems that Jonathan is a Mackenzie-phile... and as such, might it not be worth seeing for him just to see their ATTEMPT at restoration? I haven't played it since they did that... I found the course decent fun before, figured it might be of more interest to him now, that's all.

Great call re Granite Bay for sure.

But man... see how open-ended this could get? We haven't even scratched the surface of the greater Sacramento area really... there are many other courses worth his time... then we can start on Tahoe/Reno....

« **Reply #22 on:** May 18, 2006, 02:02:12 PM »

Quote from: Tom Huckaby on May 18, 2006, 01:51:17 PM

Hi Tim:I've heard pretty much the same re Haggin Oaks - but it seems that Jonathan is a Mackenzie-phile... and as such, might it not be worth seeing for him just to see their ATTEMPT at restoration? I haven't played it since they did that... I found the course decent fun before, figured it might be of more interest to him now, that's all.
Great call re Granite Bay for sure.
But man... see how open-ended this could get? We haven't even scratched the surface of the greater Sacramento area really... there are many other courses worth his time... then we can start on Tahoe/Reno....

I am not an AM expert but from the people I have played the course with who had AM knowledge it was a feeble attempt at redoing the original design and is AM in name only. The snack bar has the original plans on the wall and would be the highlight of a visit. The new holes that were added to the old layout are a big disappointment and frankly I like the old layout better. Since he is trying to play alot of courses in a short time I wouldn't waste a round on that course.

« **Reply #23 on:** May 18, 2006, 02:03:18 PM »

Tim:

Understood - thanks. Haggin Oaks then would have to be way down his list.

He's making a pretty damn large list though!

« **Reply #24 on:** May 18, 2006, 02:13:23 PM »

Quote from: Tom Huckaby on May 18, 2006, 02:03:18 PM

Tim:Understood - thanks. Haggin Oaks then would have to be way down his list.
He's making a pretty damn large list though!

Tom, if you or any of the other GCA AMck experts in NoCal would like to play Haggin and give me your opinions on the original design or what's left of it and the attempt made to restore it, let me know I'll make a tee time on any weekend, holiday, or afternoon during the week that I can sneek out on.

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