Have we discussed these here before?  If so, please paste a link. If not, what do you think of them.  I ask because a client has put a maximum sq. footage and bunker number on a design I am doing......

I noticed that Kyle Phillips used many combination sand/grass bunkers at Morgan Creek on an earlier thread.  That is a way to extend the reach of a bunker and hold to target quantities.  Do grass bunkers in and of themselves do as much as sand bunkers as hazards, visually and play wise, IYHO?

i appreciate the psychological effect of the grass bunker... one expects that he/she might have got away with a miss, ending up in a swale with rough, but often, contrary to Paul's thoughts, i find them more difficult to play out of that sand.  almost invariably the player is severely disappointed in his lie, and the mental gymnastics start!

most everyone practices sand play, but who practices grass bunker play?

maintenance may be an issue... i think they're often neglected, and end up being kept too long - like in course deep rough (ie/ >6").

paul,

perhaps yes.. i suppose what i was saying was that with bunker maintenance these days, you're more likely to get a gnarly like in a grass bunker.

but yes, you're right... i perhaps overestimate the 22-handicappers ability to play out of a bunker, rather than slash one out of a bad lie in the grass trap.

Jeff, One caveat, if the grass is taught to be thirsty,
 many of these grass bunkers will remain softer than
normal areas. Most often they have drains at their bottoms.
 Even with the drains, the bottom of the bunker often gets deep equiptment tracks, in addition to the grass being
extra lush. Other than that, I think their judicious use
 is a great addition. Especially in key spots such as a
bail out alternative to sand. If the green's sections
are small and run away from this grass hollow,
 the shot is actually more difficult than sand. IMO.

Pinon Hills uses them exquisitely.
while this schematic doesn't depict it very well.
Just to the left of the middle of the green
 is a grass bunker that illustrates my above comments.

Jeff:

I wanted to ask you if the drainage ditches at Wildhorse in Davis CA were there when you started? Because they looked really natural.  This despite the fact that I saw nothing like these in the cv on the ground?  

Why not just do something like that?

Depressions and grassy hollows around greens can be very effective.  I would think a fairly deep grass bunker with gnarly rough near a green would pose more problems for the better player who expects to get it close than the average player who as stated before will be less intimidated by the grass.

I think even small hollows next to greens can add excitement and variety to the chipping areas.  

Pat,

You are absolutely right maintenance would be a problem for any green side bunker as it is for green side collection areas where balls usually collect in one place.   I think such bunkers would need to be carefully placed to avoid heavy traffic perhaps protecting the back third or rear of a green where weaker players who underclub 80% of the time never end up.  For example think of a green set at a 45 degree angle with bunkers in the front and a grass bunker or two behind on the angle.  That could be very effective when you have would have to hit back toward the sand bunkers and most weak players would never go over the green into those areas.  

Maintenance issues aside I wouldn't consider  grass bunkers to be designed and maintained solely to challenge the better players.   Compared to how they would play from a sand bunker, weaker players whose goal is to get on the green can usually can play from them as well or better than a good player whose goal is to get close .  In fact I think they would offer a good combination of difficulty for the better player and playability for the weaker player.  

I love the angle of the fairway bunker following the angle of the green in the first picture.  

As far as putting the sand back, tough call and hard to say without being on site to really see how they play compared to how they were intended to play with sand.  Those fairway bunkers would be pretty nasty with some sand in them.  

I would probably go with Langford's original intent but I bet the members want to keep them as is.  Good luck!

Adam,

I have played Lawsonia for many years and don't remember sand at the base of 7.  How long ago are you talking?  

Langford's Culver Academy course has similar grass bunkers to the one pictured by Mike. I assumed they too at one time had sand, but Bob Crosby (who attended Culver many, many, many years ago) does not recall them ever having sand, and he wondered if they ever did. Did Langford create grass bunkers that were cousins to his sand bunkers?

Tom -

The original drawings for West Bend (1930) showed sand in ALL the bunkers. I have found people who remember sand in most of them. The rest would need to be probed to find out for sure.

The grassing over of our bunkers occurred around 1944. They began  putting some sand back in 1955 because the members couldn't compete  when they traveled.

We have the board of directors minutes from day one. It is interesting to follow the timeline.  The members had a lot of struggles - depression/ wars etc.  

In some spots greenside recoveries without sand can be very rare.  A downhill lie to an elevated green running away from you.
The lower handicap would much prefer sand. We will be looking at this issue at our club this year.

Sean, I'm with you on the aeshtetic.
 All of the bunkers have been re-done since
 I was there. When I saw them they were much more ragged.
 However, this one dimensionality you bring up is not at work.
 It's not dictated that the explosion shot is the only one,
 it has been through my experience it's the proper shot,
 not the only.

And, No, I dont know which quote you elude to.

I also like this set up.



I'm no photoshop wizard but I think you all get it.  What a great little touch shot.  Might even be harder than rough or sand.  You could cut that with the step mower also for ease of maint.

Cheers!

JT