I didn't want to sidetrack the 18th hole at TOC scoring roll-call thread but I'd like to ask because I've never been to TOC---how those who've been to both would compare and contrast the short open 18th at TOC to the short open 18th at North Berwick?

I agree with Mike.  It's pretty similar though, coming back into town.  If you hit it right, though, you are apt to land in the parking lot rather than Rusacks....

A bit off-topic, but Prestwick's finale is even less inspiring than TOC or NB, IMO.  Machrahanish (spell?) is pretty forgettable, too.  Nairn is OK but not great.  Dornoch is pretty good, I think.

Do real links just fit #18 into the routing to get back to the clubhouse?

If yes, then presume U.S. routings must logically do the same.  Why do there seem to be so many more really good finishers in America?  Examples = PB, Merion, PVGC, WFGC, Riviera.  Inverness' and CPC's #18 are no great shakes but those seem to be the exceptions as many (most?) "great" U.S. course seem to have memorable finishing holes.

Coincidence?

Chip Oat said;

"A bit off-topic, but Prestwick's finale is even less inspiring than TOC or NB, IMO.  Machrahanish (spell?) is pretty forgettable, too.  Nairn is OK but not great.  Dornoch is pretty good, I think.

Do real links just fit #18 into the routing to get back to the clubhouse?

If yes, then presume U.S. routings must logically do the same.  Why do there seem to be so many more really good finishers in America?  Examples = PB, Merion, PVGC, WFGC, Riviera.  Inverness' and CPC's #18 are no great shakes but those seem to be the exceptions as many (most?) "great" U.S. course seem to have memorable finishing holes.

Coincidence?"

Chip:

Maybe that is off topic somewhat but a very interesting point and comparison nonetheless. Some of the 18th holes of the courses you mentioned in Europe are very old and obviously were simply finishing points that were fixed for obvious reasons---the point in the town of St Andrews the course begins and ends is older stil (fixing the 18th hole of TOC)l.

But in America the routings probably had far more latitude and consequently 18th holes too. At the point architecture began to be dedicatedly made in America (routings) in the 20th century the idea of basically the last word (18th) was perhaps the most important word had become part of the mindset of golf architecture.

Does the "open" or bland status of several of Scotland's finishing holes have anything to do with the heightened focus over the centuries on match play?  The penultimate holes in most matches are holes 15-17, where one player is trying to close the deal, and the other tries to gamble to take the match to 18, or to taks his opponent to extra holes.  

At TOC, 15-16 test accuracy with drives between bunkers and boundary lines, and of course #17 has match play elements of whether a player plays for 4 or 5.  At Prestwick, 15 and 16 are short, tight holes, with possible disaster awaiting just off the fairway on 15 (gorse, whins) and just over the 16th green (cardinal bunker), and 17 is the famous alps hole, where the approach and placement on the sloping green is important.  I have never been to North Berwick, but I will say that the pics I've seen of the 16th green seem to indicate there is some strategy involved.

In the US, there is a higher focus on stroke play, and the 18th hole stands as the final test (Tom's idea of the last word).  There are some exceptions to every rule, but many courses, especially those that have hosted championships, end invariably end with a 450+ yard par four.

I have been to 21 courses in Scotland and Ireland, and many seem to follow the trend of a weaker (in comparison with the rest of the round) 18th hole:

Weaker: Ballybunion, Rosses Point, Enniscrone, Tralee, Prestwick, Royal Montrose, TOC, the New Course, Cruden Bay

Medium (for sake of discussion, not character-building): Carne, Connemara, Waterville, Duke's Course (parkland), Nairn, Western Gailes

Strong: Leven, Moray-Old, Royal Aberdeen, Dornoch, the Jubilee course

So, only 4 of 21 have particularly strong finishers, and I think you will find that many of those in the weaker and medium categories will have great stretches of holes in the middle of their back nines!    

-Brad

Sean, you are exactly right about the location of the sunken pro shop wide left of the 18th at North Berwick!  I stood on the tee there a week ago with the green well within range, downhill, downwind, dry and firm, 280 yds away.  I had just parred 14 Perfection, 15 Redan, 16 Gate (the swale hole), and 17 Point Garry In, and was pumped up.  Solid controlled swing with the driver, aiming for a little cut from the left side.  I guess I tightened up, because I double crossed, the ball hooked wildly left and I wound up at the bottom of the chain link fence sunken behind that pro shot, 50 yds left and almost hole high.  A drop, a pitch and two putts later, bogey.  Rats.  

The finishing holes at North Berwick are super, starting with the 13th Pit hole, with the green tucked between a wall and a sand dune.  I think it may be as much fun as any six holes in golf.

Great photo, Mike.  Is that young John K?  

I think the biggest concern a golfer faces at the 18th at Berwick is not pushing one into the windshield of a car on the right of the fairway. In fact, the pro tip in the yardage book says, "concentrate - car repairs are expensive." I managed to hit the green with a 3-iron in both my rounds at Berwick.
That said, the wider fairway at the TOC meant I was never really thinking about the right side of the 18th there.

A lot of links courses, in my estimation, have weak closers necessitated by the need to head back to the clubhouse. I'm thinking of Murcar, TOC, Crail, and even Muirfield, whose 18th has a neat green and fine bunkering, but isn't really that interesting from the tee.

That's not the John K. who used to frequent this site?