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bakerg

Cat out of the Bag?
« on: March 30, 2004, 10:32:19 AM »
I just saw the contents of Golf World's next issue and it has the title of "Nicklaus, Doak collaboration on tap" listed in the table of contents.  Hmm........
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bakerg

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2004, 10:41:31 AM »
Well said Redanman.

Pacific Dunes
Friars Head
Old Sandwhich
Barnbougle
Cape Kidnappers
Bandon Trails
Ballyneal
Sutton Bay
etc. etc.

We are getting spoiled.........
« Last Edit: March 30, 2004, 10:42:12 AM by Gary_Baker »
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Nick_Ficorelli

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2004, 11:26:37 AM »
April Fool.....methinks not.
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SPDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2004, 12:09:51 PM »
I note that Tom made the little noticed comment that there would be an announcement this week, and that it would surprise everyone.

I'm surprised.
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Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2004, 12:48:00 PM »
Maybe it'll be Jackie, or Gary, or Barbara -- and REALLY surprise everyone.
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"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Gib_Papazian

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2004, 12:54:29 PM »
I would have been less shocked to find out Howard Stern and Pat Robertson were gay lovers . . . .

Say it ain't so!

Of course, the idea of a Mayacama with some Doak touches is kind of appealling.
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A_Clay_Man

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2004, 12:55:45 PM »
Redanman- That is not a proverb, it's a curse.
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John Foley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2004, 01:53:06 PM »
HMMM,

So where would that be??

Long Island perhaps?

or possibly

Nebraska

or maybe

Australia, NZ or Ireland?

Anyone else besides me thinks that this may actually be a very good thing?
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Integrity in the moment of choice

bakerg

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2004, 02:04:09 PM »
As long Jack pays attention. ;)
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A_Clay_Man

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2004, 02:25:48 PM »
Bayberry's my guess.
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Joel_Stewart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2004, 02:28:29 PM »
Quote from: john_foley on March 30, 2004, 01:53:06 PM
HMMM,

So where would that be??

Long Island perhaps?

Of course its going to be Long Island.

It will be strange bed fellows, Nicklaus getting all the money and Doak doing all the work?   I volunteer to be a mediator for differences of opinions.
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Michael Dugger

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2004, 03:54:44 PM »
As much as we all think that this is weird......I bet Tom is thrilled.

It's Jack Nicklaus

I'd like to stroll around a piece of property with the Golden Bear and consider possibilities.  

So would you

I just do not see where Mr. Doak would let himself get involved in something that would limit his input and creativity.  Imagine Jack out there on the Bayberry property testing shots a la Jones at Augusta?  

Names sell.....good golf courses sell.

Only seems logical that the two together is a nice combination.

Long live Jack.  He's the Golden Bear!
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What does it matter if the poor player can putt all the way from tee to green, provided that he has to zigzag so frequently that he takes six or seven putts to reach it?     --Alistair Mackenzie--

TEPaul

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #12 on: March 30, 2004, 04:35:06 PM »
"Long Island perhaps?"

Likely a bit more than perhaps. Nicklaus should've given it up! I hope that land isn't star-crossed. First Macdonald knew he should have bought that too, then NGLA should've bought it when they had the chance instead of letting the Electriican's Union buy it. Then NGLA should've bought it when they had another chance. Now Jack won't give up and turn it over to Doak alone when he has to know he should. It'd be great if they'd allow site visits during construction. I'd give anything to spend the day watching Nicklaus and Doak work together ;)

This is what I'd like to see---Doak routes the course, designs all the holes, perfects every detail, grows it in and opens it and Jack flies in on his Gulfstream for the Opening ceremonies and says very loudly and publicly with his best squeaky little girl "Shake and Bake" imitation;

Aaah, haaalped!!

Get's on his Gulfstream and flies out again.  ;)
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bakerg

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #13 on: March 30, 2004, 04:58:46 PM »
Yeah, but we will all know the truth and in the end that is all that really matters.  Nicklaus can have his name on it as long as Tom gets it his way.  
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Michael Dugger

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #14 on: March 30, 2004, 05:32:19 PM »
TEPaul,

Genius take ;D

That's pretty much all I was saying.

I want to add to that, however, Jack Nicklaus' role in this is not merely as a name.  Let's give credit where credit is due.  This is the holder of six green jackets and 20 whatever major titles.

Jack Nicklaus is good at golf.  He's deeply steeped in the grand ol' game of gawf.  

I think it is total fabrication that he cannot bring more to this table than a "Signature" name.  

But I do agree that the routing should be Doak.  Jack should have input on the shot values, Doak and his crew should "massage" the land into a golf course.  

It's the Golden Bear!      
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What does it matter if the poor player can putt all the way from tee to green, provided that he has to zigzag so frequently that he takes six or seven putts to reach it?     --Alistair Mackenzie--

Nick_Ficorelli

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #15 on: March 30, 2004, 06:51:44 PM »
Who gets the best land today?
Where is the premiere, high profile ,seaside undeveloped property in the USA?
Who do you think is along for the ride?
 
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TEPaul

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #16 on: March 30, 2004, 07:58:22 PM »
You know all that ongoing mystery between Nicklaus and Muirhead about who did what at Muirfieild Village? Well, that can't possibly happen with Nicklaus and Doak at Bayberry---the eyes and ears of GOLFCLUBATLAS.com will be EVERYWHERE!!  ;)
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ian

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2004, 08:03:31 PM »
I'll place my bet on a 36 hole project, 10 minutes from a famous course in Nebraska, where they each do there own 18. Nicklaus first and Doak a few years later.
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Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #18 on: March 30, 2004, 08:38:09 PM »
Ian,

You lose.  (How much do you owe me?)  I have declined to sign up for that project in Mullen, at least until our project in Holyoke is complete ... it would have been unfair to my client in Holyoke to let the Mullen guys advertise my name for the second course, which they had already started doing.

It's Bayberry.  The official press release goes out on Friday, so I'm not supposed to say much until then.  And even then, I won't say too much, because the only way a collaboration like this is going to work is if neither of us tries to take all the credit or insist upon all our own ideas.

We have a great routing plan in place and we are hopeful that the golf course will get under construction before the U.S. Open starts up just two doors down.
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motodrive

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #19 on: March 30, 2004, 08:40:27 PM »
not nebraska   but their r some fairly smart people on this site   sorry  im sort of new, but in the know:) lol   watch out for nick f
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Mike_Sweeney

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #20 on: March 30, 2004, 09:29:42 PM »
Quote from: Tom_Doak on March 30, 2004, 08:38:09 PM
It's Bayberry.  The official press release goes out on Friday, so I'm not supposed to say much until then.  And even then, I won't say too much, because the only way a collaboration like this is going to work is if neither of us tries to take all the credit or insist upon all our own ideas.

Tom,

Can you comment on any restrictions that Nicklaus/Doak may or may not have at the site? Specifically there are alot of trees at the site, similar to The Bridge. Thus will you end up with a "linksy" feel pulling out trees or a "parkland" feel keeping trees?

My guess is you probably can't comment. Thanks either way.




« Last Edit: March 30, 2004, 09:49:02 PM by Mike Sweeney »
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McCloskey

Re:Cat out of the Bag?
« Reply #21 on: March 30, 2004, 11:28:11 PM »
The posts regarding the turn of events at Bayberry raise several questions.

TD
Congratulations and good luck!
Joel Stewart seems to think you will be doing all the work, is that true?   You seemed to indicate that the collaboration would only work in both contributed to the success and credit was not one sided.  That is admirable.   Does Nicklaus organization feel the same way.
Gary Baker doesn't seem to feel that Nicklaus will bring anything to the table.  Is that possible?

TEPaul
What do you mean Niclaus knows he should have given the land up.   Why should he pass on this great piece of property without residential?  He doesn't get many opportunities without residential component.  

Isn't the Golden Age replete with "collaborations"?   Why shouldn't we expect that both designers will bring "considerable" to the project and that Bayberry will become one of the great collaborations ever.
That is what I am hoping will occur.

Whoever commented on Mayacama, what "touches" were you referring to when you said it would be better with Doak "touches".   I thought it was terrific with just the Nicklaus touches myself.  
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