[Rick Sides]

I'm headed to Orlando over Christmas break. Has anyone gotten a chance to play the new Coore/Crenshaw course Sugarloaf Mountain? What did you think of it if you did?

[Adam Clayman]

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,33590.0.html

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,33277.0.html

[Frank Sullivan]

I'm headed to Orlando over Christmas break. Has anyone gotten a chance to play the new Coore/Crenshaw course Sugarloaf Mountain? What did you think of it if you did?

Hey Rick,

I live in Tampa, and I am a member at Sugarloaf...I highly recommend it...as you will notice on this forum, there is (mostly) a very positive opinion of the layout and the topography...very different for Florida...elevation drops other delights...

It is not Coore & Crenshaw's best (Sand Hills), but it is the best I have played in Florida (I have not played Seminole or Calusa Pines, but everything else noteworthy on GCA)...it is more interesting that Sawgrass, and has more variety than Pine Barrens (which I love as well)...and more variety than Black Diamond Ranch...

Of course, to each his own...just my opinion...

As a recommendation, try playing around 10 am and then play another 18 at 2 pm...the sunset is beautiful and the course overlooks Lake Apopka...please let us know your thoughts once you have played it!!!!

BTW, when playing 2, 3, 8, 9, 10, 11, 15, 16, you feel like you are in the bush in Africa:)

Best,

Frank

[David_Madison]

I played the course a few days ago and enjoyed it very much. An excellent routing, very natural and unforced, with a good variety of challenges.

The one thing I was struck by was the similarity to Cuscowilla. It had a number of holes that felt very similar in look, feel, and shotmaking demands. Less water in play and hillier, especially surprising for a Florida course. Some examples of similar holes - - a wonderful Cape hole (#14) from an elevated tee that felt very similar to Cuscowilla's 10th; a tiny 110 yd. par 3 with a green that looked from the tee impossible to hit (#11 at both courses); and a 250 yard par 3 (#17 here vs. #8 at Cuscowilla) that tumbled downhill and where the best play was running the ball on. Also there was a short driveable gently uphill par 4 with a very challenging green.

The bunkering was of a similar style but not so severe that they looked like they might collapse. And, the greens were a little milder than Cuscowilla's. Overall the type of course that you could play many times and find new things every time.

[Nick Pozaric]

Just checking for any updates on the course.  How are things going down there?

[Sev K-H Keil]

I play Sugarloaf Mountain a few times a year while visiting family in the area --- my next tee time on Black Friday (!) --- great layout, excellent routing, many of the C&C characteristics we all like --- HOWEVER, conditioning has become a major challenge. I'm not picky and I'm absolutely fine with English summer links conditions, don't mind brown at all. However, the last time I played, the course condition didn't do the great design justice (not even remotely) --- the desolate (bankrupt) housing community doesn't help either.

It still is my favorite course in the area. To be fair, green fees are now $50 (down for just under $200 when they opened). Alternatively, I'd drive 1-1.5h to World Woods, Black Diamond or OM.

Has anybody played the new Dye course at Southern Hills (!) in Brooksville?

[Adam Clayman]

Sev, Southern Hills plantation is not one of Pete's best, but it's far from his worst. Not much to remember, but there are a fair number of decent holes.

Can't be much help other than it's not worth a special trip. If you need a break from World Woods or The Dunes at Seville, it's a nice addition for variety's sake.

[Ben Kodadek]

There's been some writeups in local papers that detail the condition of SM.   They're not very positive.

On a lighter note, WW Rolling Oaks just opened back up for play with new greens.  Supposedly they re-established the square footage that they had lost over the years, about 20%.  I'm hoping to get up there in the next week or two, so I'll report back. 

I second Adam's take on SHills.  It's fine, but you're not really missing much. 

While we're on the topic of FL golf, can anyone report on the condition of Juliette Falls?

[Sev K-H Keil]

Thank you, Adam and Ben --- I just booked my Thanksgiving tee times and will play WW Pine Barrens, Black Diamond, Sugarloaf Mountain (worth another try --- at least nice views) and Juliette Falls. I just talked to a friend who plays at BD and JF and he felt that the condition of both courses is equivalent (with the exception that JF has water falls)... hope this helps?

[Pete Buczkowski]

There is no doubt that conditioning has been an issue over the past 6 months.  Maintenance budget has been very tight and with the summer growth and rains, it got a bit out of control.  Played last weekend and they have cleaned most of those areas up, playing pretty well IMO.  Just overseeded the greens so they have a bit of growing in to do but should be fine for Thanksgiving.

For those who played the course upon its opening, it has gone through quite a few changes over the last couple years.  Specifically 14&15 have been modified due to the torrential rains of last summer.  Many of the bunker faces on those lower holes fell in so they have removed bunkers and flattened existing ones.  Those two holes are not as visually striking as they once were.

For full disclosure - I am a member there and a fan of the golf course.  Not one of C&Cs best but a solid 5-6 on the Doak scale.  Be interested in your thoughts.  Some of the locals do not like it since its quite hilly and has a few blind tee shots.  Also the 18th has its detractors, including many on this board.  Typically they are the ones who try to reach in 2 and get an Other instead.   (Tip: layup to 100-120 for your third, that area is quite flat.)

[Carl Nichols]

Thank you, Adam and Ben --- I just booked my Thanksgiving tee times and will play WW Pine Barrens, Black Diamond, Sugarloaf Mountain (worth another try --- at least nice views) and Juliette Falls. I just talked to a friend who plays at BD and JF and he felt that the condition of both courses is equivalent (with the exception that JF has water falls)... hope this helps?

Is Black Diamond now public, or at least permitting some public play?  It sounded like they were struggling a bit about two years ago, and I suspect things may not have gotten much better lately.

[Sev K-H Keil]

Carl --- my latest information is that they are still 100% private. For a long time, they've even insisted that all guests play with a member --- things have changed slightly since Troon took over the management and I hear they see quite some reciprocal play from other Troon courses. While private, I'm quite certain your club pro can get you on and they won't mind the (unaccompanied guest) green fees.

[Joe Andriole]

Played Sugarloaf 2 days ago and was surprised how well the course played. Greens were a tad slow but were quite full and smooth. Bunkers are being maintained adequately and better than previously.  The course is scruffier around the edges but I actually find that attractive. Can't beat the price  @ $31.

[Sev K-H Keil]

Excellent --- thank you for the condition info. Great deal --- I think I've been quoted $58 for a weekend round at Thanksgiving.

I'm now playing Sugarloaf Mountain, Black Diamond (Quarry), World Woods (PB) and Juliette Falls over Thanksgiving. I look forward to playing Feather Sound CC (thanks to a generous invitation by Ben) and OM on my next trip.

Of course, I'll post a condition update...

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