[Norbert P]

 It's a natural occurance.

 " Telegraph Road "

A long time ago came a man on a track
Walking thirty miles with a sack on his back
And he put down his load where he thought it was the best
He made a home in the wilderness
He built a cabin and a winter store
And he ploughed up the ground by the cold lake shore
And the other travellers came riding down the track
And they never went further and they never went back.
Then came the churches then came the schools
Then came the lawyers then came the rules
Then came the trains and the trucks with their loads
And the dirty old track was the telegraph road

Then came the mines - then came the ore
Then there was the hard times then there was a war
Telegraph sang a song about the world outside
Telegraph road got so deep and so wide
Like a rolling river . . .

Mark Knopfler  From the Dire Straits CD "Love Over Gold"

It also reminds me of "The Mosquito Coast" where paradise was lost through disdain for security and government. (Over-simplified explanation)

Anyway, I think it's a naturally occuring event.  As much as I love Bandon being quaint and out of the way, more will come and I'm afraid that it may never be the same as the first days of discovery.  But, we do have another course going in in 2005 and then... shees, I can't wait to go back this winter.  
  (Ed, maybe they'll put runrigs in the runway.)

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Slag, One of my favorite albums and probably Dire Straits most prolific.

I also live not far from a Telegraph Road, and went to school on Telegraph Road.

[Dan Herrmann]

Of course the owners should make $$ - It's capitalism, after all.  I think the fear is what the town will possibly transform into.  Heck - I lived in Beaverton, OR for 9 years and only got down to Bandon twice (sans golf course).  The only course that ever got me down there was Sandpines up in Florence.  

And, the earlier poster is right on about Bend/Redmond, OR.  It used to be such a charming place, but now it's all overgrown and has lots of traffic problems.   If I were a golf developer, I'd check out the Madras, OR area - great weather, great scenery, and very unspoiled.

If Bandon gets more and more high-roller types, maybe I should quit my job and caddie there!  

It's funny that Knopfler's music was mentioned.  He did the soundtrack for "Local Hero", which could easily be a movie about Bandon metaphorically.  (however, in Bandon's case, they pretty much welcomed the golf due to the depression in the lumber industry).

[Steve Lang]

 

Get over it!  No problem.. take the airport at Southern Pines, NC.. a true golf mecca.. you see many small jets parked there, but rairly have they invaded my vacation golf experience in that area.. even right next door... and not nearly as much as the big army cargo planes from Ft. Bragg.. they're really huge,  as they lumber across the sky!!

[Peter Galea]

"No-growther's" & nimby's" on GCA! This is what stifles many projects in California. Mine included.  
Planned, intelligent growth makes the world (and the golf ball) go round.

[Dan Herrmann]

Nah - it's not NIMBY, it's nostalgia  

Honestly, with the winds and visiblity along the OR coast, it'll take a good IFR pilot to get in there most days.

I just hope they keep it walking-only

[ChasLawler]

"Looking for a course with cachet for your next business-golf outing? Look no further than these stellar new layouts"

Such is the title of a new article on MSN which puts Bandon Dunes at the top of the list.

http://agility.msn.com/article9.asp

[Patrick_Mucci]

Scott Borroughs, et. al.,

A man builds a world class golf desination far removed from any substantive population centers which includes two existing golf courses, another to be designed by your favorite firm, with another in the wings, and you've all raved about it for years, and now......

You don't want anybody to come and play it.

If the tee times remain 10 minutes apart, and play continues at a reasonable pace, what difference does it make ?

Why do you think Mike Keiser built it, to be looked at or photographed by those who just happened to be driving up or down the coast.

Isn't Mike Keiser supposed to recoup his investment in the land, golf courses, buildings and infrastructure ?

Why is he expanding the facility ??

Could it possibly be to attract more golfers ?

[Scott_Burroughs]

Pat,

Did you purposefully avoid answering the $ issue?

Bandon costs too much already and this catering to the jetset will put the fees into the stratosphere (most likely), pricing out many regular folks and THEN it will NOT have full tee sheets, because it will be just a resort catering to the rich, NOT a good thing IMO, but Keiser can do whatever he wants.  If the price hits $250-$300 in the next few years, look for the 'novelty' and difficulty in getting there to take it's toll on the desire of regular folks (a lot of current customers) to get there.

Also, if Keiser cares so much about recouping his costs, then why was he so surprised that Bandon was so popular when it first opened?  He said that never expected the place to be so popular and the fees were 'only' $100 then?  With an expected small number of patrons and half the green fees, how could he have EVER recouped his money?  Now he has full tee sheets and double the fees.  I think he's recouping it just fine.

[ddavid426]

I am not sure about the economics.  Just returned last night from Bandon.  The three days I was there, the accomodations and courses were not full.  Plenty of available tee times.  Granted this was mid week, but in August.  I can promise you that Pinehurst and Pebble are jam packed now.  Not sure if it is the recession or the remote location, but Bandon is not booming.  The caddies were lamenting the lack of loops and small tips compared to 2 years ago.  I would bet the fees stay level for awhile.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Scott Burroughs,

With respect to the money issue,
it's not cheap to get there from almost anywhere,
Texas, Florida, Minnesota, New Jersey, Maine.

With repsect to costs to play, you have to look at the golf course like an apartment building.

When vacancies are high, you lower rent.
When vacancies are low, you raise rent.

Airlines and hotels are no different.

You make adjustments in your price based on market conditions, supply and demand.  It's that simple.

The market will determine the fees.

But, Mike Keiser is increasing capacity, today, and into the future, and I would think that might help on the pricing.

[Joe Hancock]

Pat,

That capitalistic mindset is what we all bitch about when gas prices are jacked for every holiday and weekend....yet when golf courses do it they seem to deserve a pass on criticism, fee-wise.

How many golf courses do you play where the greens fees are the same weekday vs. weekend? I, for one, refuse to punish the working stiff because he has a full time job.
I'm also aware that I am not making as much MONEY as I could with a different point of view.

Joe

[Scott_Burroughs]

Pat,

"What the market will bear" is exactly what has RUINED golf in the last 20 years.  Pricing most people out of repeat golf.

I don't understand jacking up prices so high when Keiser didn't expect to do so well in the first place.  Pacific Dunes was only built BECAUSE Bandon did so well and the land had already been bought long ago, so it cost very little to build, net.

Based on DDavid's comment above, I guarantee you they'd have full tee sheets if the fees were lower.

With outrageous prices, Bandon isn't a 'pilgrimage' anymore.

Ask the folks who played Pebble in the 70's for $15 feel about the current $380 fees.  Or Huckaby about the fees at Pasa once they greatly increased the fees immediately after getting placed in the GD Top 100 in the early 80's.  It is media hype and rankings that greatly contribute to these sky-high fees.

[JohnV]

As a former Oregon resident who knows how the people there are fareing with the highest unemployment rate in the nation, I think that anything that helps the Oregon economy would be good.  I certainly wouldn't want to see Bandon become like Bend, but Carmel is still a pretty nice place that wouldn't be a bad example.  Fortunately without the ski business that Bend has, I can't see Bandon getting too big as it would be sustainable over the winter months.

[Norbert P]

It's funny that Knopfler's music was mentioned.  He did the soundtrack for "Local Hero", which could easily be a movie about Bandon metaphorically.  

 DanH, I actually saw the beach where they did some of the filming for that movie.  It's located near Mallaig, Scotland.  Just down the road from Traigh Golf Course.  Love the soundtrack, btw.

 Back to the jets...  We do have to remember that Mr. Keiser is competing with golf courses around the world.  If someone from the Eastern seaboard was deciding to come to Bandon, they'd definitely have to consider the ease of travel and the sacrifices as opposed to taking a trip to Britain or Ireland.  With the advent of jets for accessibility, it just adds to the continuing security of the resorts self-sufficiency.  

  I believe the employee+agent (caddies) count of the Bandon resort is somewhere near 600 in the summer.  That's the largest employer in the area, including the casino in Coos Bay.  We tend to avoid realizing golf is an industry, but it is.  And it's not all bad because of that.  

  Bandon is changing and there's nothing to do but marvel at it while it's in its chrysalis.

[Norbert P]

"Slagbert,

I will only tell you one more time!

"Il n'y a pas des choses qui change, sauf le changement."

Nothing changes but change itself.

Henri Bergson.  NOT "unk!"

... As Mr Richard (pronounced Reeshard) Goodalet so pointedly stated to me by private message a long time ago.  (I can't bear to delete it as I know I'll never memorize it and fear another scolding.)

[golf54]

It has been a couple of weeks since I received the Bandon survey, but I seem to recall that it was just that, a survey to see if alternative modes of transportation were worth pursuing.  I think they will have to be very careful how they continue to expand the offerings at the resort or they could destroy the experience.  The master plan has some very sensitive possibilities, as I recall.....So far there can be no doubt that they have been hitting the mark...

[Patrick_Mucci]

Scott Burroughs,

Are you aware of the amount of money the recent purchasers of Pebble Beach paid to acquire the property/ies ??

To recoup their investment, or to get a decent return on their investment, they have to charge top dollar, provided they get market support.

I don't believe Mike Keiser's acquisition costs will reach the stratospheric proportions of Pebble.

Those are two totally seperate properties, each with their own unique financial dynamics, and I think comparisons are invalid.

[Forrest Richardson]

This is, without any question, one of the most absurd posts I've ever encountered. It reminds me of the CB radio era when people with CBs spoke over the airwaves to other people with CBs...about their CBs.

[Tom_Doak]

Scott B:  Pacific Dunes did not cost "very little to build, net," unless you think that $4 million for that property (it wasn't part of Mike's original purchase) plus $2.5 million for course construction plus $1 million for grow-in and equipment plus my fee is "very little."  Not that the course won't make it back with some profit in years to come.

This is just a survey, and it's pretty natural to be considering it since damn near every article about Bandon Dunes is prefaced by the author complaining how difficult it is to get there.  Doesn't mean they'll do it ... but it's probably inevitable.  Once they have three courses and 200 rooms, those 160 seats per day from North Bend to Portland may not be enough.

They've also been frustrated from the beginning with North Bend's facilities for private aircraft.  They don't even have the equipment there to clean out the toilets on the planes, when all they'd have to do is increase the landing fees $5 or $10 per corporate jet ... but they don't want to do it.

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