[Patrick_Mucci]

reaching critical mass, enough to dictate the revision of maintainance practices when it comes to the application of water, and the attainment of "Fast & Firm" conditions as the norm ?

Will TV expedite or impede the achievement of F&F ?

[Doug Siebert]

What percentage of a typical course's operating costs is water?  How much is fuel and fertilizer?  I'd guess that between oil used to make fuel for maintenance equipment and oil used to make fertilizer, that the price of oil would have a lot more bearing on maintenance practices than the price of water, at least outside areas where there are long term water shortages - i.e., areas served by the overburdened Colorado River.  Many areas of the US have no water shortages, and have no prospect of such in the future, outside of the occasional drought which would only result in shortages for a summer or two.

The effect of TV probably has more to do with what the announcers say than anything else.  If they decided to "sell" F&F conditions to the public, things might change.  Getting people to accept courses that aren't emerald green as being well-conditioned is one thing, getting them to accept courses where their iron shots don't leave a big ball mark and stick is another entirely.  They'd have to be convinced that the game is more fun or the options and advantages they gain (bouncing the ball in, more roll off the tee, etc.) are worth having iron shots that hold less well.

That said, I don't really see what incentive TV networks would have to do this.  To wit, they seem to actively endorse things that cause slow play.  Witness the constant mentions of preshot routines, restarting your routine if you are distracted, plenty of coverage of players lining up putts from all angles and getting that cheater line set up just so, and so on.  These are good things for pro caliber players so I suppose its right that they mention them favorably on air.  Unfortunately, soft and wet conditions are also more favorable for pro caliber players versus F&F conditions so I don't expect to see them helping even if outside factors dictate a change to more F&F conditions in many regions.  For most average players I suspect F&F conditions are an overall advantage, at least on courses that don't require middle iron or longer approaches with a forced carry.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Doug,

Water is becoming a precious commodity in Florida and elsewhere.

Effluent water use is now being dictated in many counties.

The cost of water is increasing to the point that it will become a tax or revenue stream for municipalities/agencies.

With respect to TV, it remains a visual medium.
The viewers see what the courses look like, irrespective of what the announcers are discussing.

When the viewers see lush green conditions, that's what they think their course should look like.

[Steve Lang]

  Interesting link on quantities:   http://www.allianceforwaterefficiency.org/golf_course.aspx

now what are regional costs?

[Doug Siebert]

Patrick,

I'm not denying that water isn't scarce in SOME places but I'm curious what percentage of the operating cost we're talking about here for water.  You and many others here are familiar with operating budgets so hopefully someone can toss out some example figures.  Are we talking 1% or 10%?  If the former quadruples its unwelcome but not a disaster, if the latter quadruples, bankruptcy becomes likely.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Doug,

Some clubs use many, many, many millions of gallons of water.

Without determining whether the gallons used are appropriate, let's take 30,000,000 as a number.

Water is no longer unregulated or unmetered when applied to a golf course.

More towns/counties and agencies are mandating the use of effluent water.

I used to know the cost of water in South Florida, in Palm Beach County, and will try to reaccess that info for you.
Perhaps Anthony Nysse can save me the trouble and list the current cost per gallon or per million gallons.

But, let's hypothesize that it costs 50 mils per gallon.
That's $ 150,000 per year.
If we double that to a penny a gallon that's $ 300,000 per year.
Two cents a gallon, $ 600,000 a year.
Now, the cost may be well below that, but, it's the volume that can be the killer.
Any small increase is magnifiied by the enormous volume used on golf courses.
Hence, the need for water should be evaluated more carefuly.

In South Florida, many, if not most clubs are populated by snow birds, residents from other states who visit Florida in the winter.
So, most members aren't Florida residents, ergo, they can't vote.
So, they're a perfect target for a "tax" increase in the form of higher water fees from the muniicpality/county supplying the water.

In addition, the cost to convert to effluent water is significant, and, the quality of the water can damage a golf course and the filtering system at the golf course end.

All clubs should examine their water usage, for a number of reasons, one of which is cost.

The other is "need".

I like brownish, yellowish, greenish looking fairways and greens, but, many, and probably most members don't.
So, there has to be a change in culture.   That takes a tremendous educational and cultural effort and time.
But, A spike in water costs, would introduce the evaluation process almost immediately.

[PThomas]

reaching critical mass, enough to dictate the revision of maintainance practices when it comes to the application of water, and the attainment of "Fast & Firm" conditions as the norm ?

Will TV expedite or impede the achievement of F&F ?

I certainly hope so Patrick

What will TV do?  I'm not confident that Johnny Miller et al will promto the saving of water , but i could see news features criticizing over-watering possibley having an effect

[Jud_T]

Somehow members have to want to be seen as having environmental credibility in their maintenance practices.  Not sure how this is accomplished, but it's possible.  Just look at the car industry.  Even luxury makers are adding "green" technology to their high-end models.  Some customers are willing to pay up for a sometimes marginal increase in fuel efficiency simply because of the halo effect. 

[JC Jones]

perhaps we should look at why water is becoming scarce.  Instead of focusing efforts entirely on using less water while continuing those practices that are reducing supply, maybe it would be wise to look at both.

[Patrick_Mucci]

perhaps we should look at why water is becoming scarce.  Instead of focusing efforts entirely on using less water while continuing those practices that are reducing supply, maybe it would be wise to look at both.

That's nice in theory, but, it would have no meaningful impact on a club's water usage.

Each club has to re-evaluate its needs.

Now more than anytime since the Great Depression, costs are or should be the focus at clubs.

And water, may become a very expensive problem.

Clubs need to solve their problems before solving the problems of the world

[archie_struthers]

 

Most golf courses in our area don't buy their water and irrigate from their own ponds . however it's probably just a matter of time before the eye of Sauron (the state) turns to taxation of their water (LOL)   To date thank goodness , the costs are more in keeping your wells and pumping equipment in good condition and staying within your allocation permit, which varies from course to course.

Obviously the courses that pay for water are in for a rough ride going forwards . Most of the water makes its way back to the aquifer , so golf courses are certainly less toxic than housing developments to the environment .  Until the politico's embrace courses , and perhaps consdier them for some tax breaks like farms , things are going to stay dicey for many operatiors.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Archie,

What's Twisted Dune's allotment, and what's the financial penalty for exceeding your allotment ?

[archie_struthers]

 

Pat I'm not totally sure anymore but I figure our water allocation permits allow for about 60 million gallons at greate bay and 50 million yearly at Twisted ....will verfy manana

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