An underutilized design feature

[Robert Mercer Deruntz]

This tight lie depression is located to the right of the 8th green at Ballyneal.  There are some more of these at Ballyneal, and I don't think Tom Doak is adverse to using them in his other courses, and Crenshaw & Coore use them, but I would enjoy seeing more tight lie depressions, bunkers, ect. built into courses.  What's great about such features is that high handicappers can escape with a putter and comfortably take 3 strokes and be happy, while a good player may take 3 strokes and walk away unhappy and penalized.  At the same time, a good player could pitch, chip or putt in or up and in.  Of the one's I've seen, this is among the best if not the best.

[RJ_Daley]

Oh my, I heard they had a wet spring out there at BallyNeal, but I had no idea they had this much growth after the rains!!! 

[JC Jones]

Are we looking at this hole from the tee?  To me I see a bunker to the right of the green and the tight lie area to the left of the left bunker.

Maybe I'm missing something.

[Ben Sims]

Robert,

Not going to comment on the pic as it looks not to be what you wanted.

But short grass as a hazard??!!  Heavens to Betsy no!!!

Yeah.  I think we all agree that it does a fairly good job of helping us hackers and making the scratchers think.  Long Shadow had quite a few little "chipping areas" built into the sides of the greens.  I remember the right side of the 6th green being 20 yards or so of tightly mown depression.  It seems that many of the "new links" courses that we discussed on another thread have many of these areas.  In fact, I can't remember a single Renaissance or C&C course I've played this year that didn't have "chipping areas" around the greens.

Coincidence??  I think not.

[Tom Huckaby]

RMD - need to fix that picture... that's the 2nd hole at Colorado Golf Club (C&C).  Great hole for sure, but most assuredly not Ballyneal and not an example of a tight lie depression (which are great, btw).
 

[Damon Groves]

Is there a different Ballyneal than the one I played. Looks a little lush for the Ballyneal I know. And trees! No such thing at Ballyneal.

[Tom Huckaby]

Is there a different Ballyneal than the one I played. Looks a little lush for the Ballyneal I know. And trees! No such thing at Ballyneal.

Damon - see above - Robert posted the wrong pic.  That is the 2nd hole at CGC.

TH

[John Mayhugh]

Robert's pics are probably better than mine, but here's what I think he was referring to.




You better learn to putt from off the green.

[Jason McNamara]

Robert posted the wrong pic. 

Perhaps it was residual sunstroke from New Mexico.

(Robert, not to thread-jack, but that was you on TV at Twin Warriors, right?)

[Ross Tuddenham]

Not sure if I have got what you are talking about because I can’t see the photo at work. But I think I have an idea.

On Rob Rigg’s old MacDonald photo tour thread Tom Doak mentions that there is a chipping area over the back of it’s “Road Hole”.  He says that it was difficult to keep the ball on the green playing back to a front hole location.

So it shows that architects are employing such “hazards”.

Does any one else think that short grass around greens could work as a hazard because of the distance you end up away from the hole?

 If there is rough grass or a bunker then your ball will be stopped relatively close to the green.  So if there is space then a firm, what looks to be benign, short mown area around the green could be used to keep errant shots going.

Depending on pin positions, like mentioned by Tom, you may be left with an awkward distance to stop the ball.

[Robert Mercer Deruntz]

Sorry about the wrong picture.  I had a photobucket miscue.  It is not the use of chipping areas that I'm trying to point out, but the tight lie depressions.  Quite a few architects are building tight lie areas, but i really have not seen too many of these depressions built.


Yes, I heard that they showed a shot or two at Twin Warriors.  I had a choke in the 2nd round asnd made lemonaid out oof the cliche by visiting 3 great courses in 3 days.

[Ronald Montesano]

Here is a piece that GCA's Scott Witter did for my site, buffalogolfer.com.  It seems to fit this thread:  http://buff-golf.com/witter.htm#mj08

[Mark Pritchett]

This past weekend my approach didn't hold the green on the 18th hole of my home course.  Alas my ball came to rest behind the green with a very tight lie.  Of course the hole location was on the back of the green.  I debated chip vs. putt, decided to chip and of course this left me with a 60 foot putt.  Luckily I was able to negotiate it with two putts for a bogey. 

It would have been an easier shot for me out of the rough or even a bunker, however I would not have had the option to putt, so count me as a fan of the tight lie "hazard".