[Sean Leary]

I nominate a return to Cypress

It is a shame that Cypress refused to open up its admissions policy so that it was non-discriminatory or the the Crosby/AT&T would hopefully still be there.

Cliff -

I'm sure others will chime in but I believe your comment is incorrect, based on an assumption.

You are assuming that CPC's admissions policy discriminated ...

Mike...from the New York Times,  January 31, 1991:

Last year, Cypress Point was the first of five private clubs which chose not to conform to PGA Tour's new antidiscrimination policy for tournament sites. The policy was enacted after the issue of racially exclusionary private clubs erupted before the P.G.A. Championship at Shoal Creek, which was then all white.

Cypress has never had a black among its 240 members, and no black is on its seven-year waiting list for membership. When the club in August was presented with the new PGA Tour guidelines that required "satisfactory evidence that the club would take appropriate and immediate action to encourage minority membership," it voted to stop its association with the A. T. & T.


When a club refuses to conform to an anti discrimination policy I would have to say discrimination is a factor in the club's admissions policy.

So they should take someone and put them ahead of the the people that have already been on this list?

I had read at some point that they permitted the tour to be there out of respect to Bing, but after he died, this gave them an excuse to get out of the rota.

[Dave_Miller]

I nominate a return to Cypress

Cary:
Doubt that the members of Cypress would agree
Dave

[Cliff Hamm]

I don't want to hijack this thread and turn it into a political rant.  I have no idea whether Cypress Point has any current black members.  And no a minority should not go to the head of the list.  That doesn't mean though that a black should not be on the waiting list.  Again, I don't want to turn this into a discussion of discrimination, but it is the reason that Cypress Point was removed from hosting the tournament.

[Jeff Taylor]

Maybe it wouldn't be a big deal if more clubs would openly discriminate. All that is needed is an all black or all women club. Problem solved.
Back to your regular programming.

[Adam Clayman]

Joel. That's interesting about the extension. I'd assume the argument was because the course had to be closed for modifications to satisfy Tour standards it would only be fair to extend the deadline to make up for those closures. The very first month I lived on the Peninsula Spy was working on the drainage. All championships were moved to poppy hills and the tee sheet was open to NCGA members to play the open 9 holes twice for $45. What a steal!

[Bill_Yates]

NOTE: This is a THREAD ANTI-HIJACK POST

Back to the question at hand.

OK! So it's not:
Cypress Point - Closed membership
Poppy Hills - Pros complain
Spanish Bay - Was a dump, now it's too "green"
Bayonet - Should be a parking lot (oops! "car park")

Should another venue be used? If so, which one?

[Mike Hendren]

The tour record of 59 would likely be broken at Cypress Point Club should it be returned to the rota.  I suspect it would not want to be included on the short list of courses that yielded such a round.

Mike

[John Keenan]

Poppy may not be the level of SP or PB but it is fine. The NCGA is I have heard working on its drainage so the nickname of Sloppy may no longer be relevant.

One other point Poppy is truly public in it affordability as compared to PB or even SP which are not inexpensive to play.

Pro complain about the greens at PB. I think the take away is Pros complain.  Also as noted the logistic of moving farther away would be an added hardship to the Tourney.

[JohnV]

Pat, The NCGA and The PB Co. went into partnership to build Spyglass Hill. The deal allowed the NCGA to use the course as it's home for 50 years. That fifty ends in 2016.

The agreement was for the NCGA to get 30 days a year for tournaments through 2016.  Last year the agreement was modified.  We now get 20 days a year through 2016 and 10 days a year through 2024.

Over the years, the Zone qualifiers (events where each club got to send 4 players) were played at Poppy and Spyglass so players got to play both courses each year.  They have been moved to Poppy and Bayonet starting this year.

 As a result a few days were freed up so the NCGA Junior Championship has moved to Spyglass from Lake Merced this year (also LM is hosting the California Am this year and couldn't take the Junior.)  We will continue to rotate some events through Spyglass, but given that 5 days are allocated just for the NCGA Match Play each year, there is a limit.

[Jed Peters]

If CPC would not hold up to the modern game of the Pros, they should just bring in Rees or Tom Fazio to lengthen it/tighten up the bunkering a bit.
 

[Jason McNamara]

Is it right to assume that the PGA is stuck holding the toon-a-mint in one of the few months when that area has lousy weather?

(At least they aren't in FL any longer for the peak of hurricane season.)

[David_Tepper]

Jason -

The whole point of having the tournament at this time of year is to attract tourist business to the Monterey Peninsula during the off-tourist season. If they could push the tournament back a few weeks and make it the last stop on the West Coast swing, that might increase the odds of marginally better weather. Other than that, the Monterey Peninsula area has all the tourist business it can handle thru the spring, summer and fall.

Remember Pebble Beach basically forced out the Cal State Amateur a couple of years ago, after that tournament had been held there in June for about 80 years.

DT

[Jason McNamara]

Thanks David.  I figured this was one of the few places where the Tour has always had more or less zero input on the scheduling. 

Then again, given some of the threads on GCA a few months back regarding tee time availability at Pebble, maybe this is the Tour's big chance to renegotiate!   

[Adam Clayman]

There has been a pattern that has developed over the years. When I first came to the peninsula, The At&t was on or about the 24th of Jan. and that was Toon-a-mint Thursday. Over the last 13 years they have slowly moved that date to it's current mid-Feb. I assume that slow move was an attempt to miss the seasonal rains.

The really sad part is the total lack of regard for the origins of the event. Bing's clambake. Those guys played in snow.

While this Sunday's weather was not all sunny, it was no where near bad enough to consider canceling a true sporting event. (Lightening) The Pros are a bunch of pussies. I guarantee if there was a Men's club tourney down the road at Pacific Grove, it would not have been cancelled due to high winds and some drizzle.  And, before someone tries to throw out the tree falling on the third fairway (as reported) I highly doubt that tree was anywhere near the third fairway.

[Kalen Braley]

[Steve Pozaric]

While this Sunday's weather was not all sunny, it was no where near bad enough to consider canceling a true sporting event. (Lightening) The Pros are a bunch of pussies. I guarantee if there was a Men's club tourney down the road at Pacific Grove, it would not have been cancelled due to high winds and some drizzle.  And, before someone tries to throw out the tree falling on the third fairway (as reported) I highly doubt that tree was anywhere near the third fairway.

Did you see the McCord and IB Finch playing out there on Sunday?  Those guys were getting blown over on their follow throughs!  On 8, McCord barely carried the inlet with a 3 wood and Finch hit driver off the deck.  With the gusts they had, I am sure balls would have been getting blown around the greens.  With gusts of 60 mph, I don't think you could have fans around those kind of drop-offs, especially when you have a tree like the one pictured getting knocked down.

[Mike Benham]

Mike...from the New York Times,  January 31, 1991:

Thanks Cliff, I guess I misremembered ...

[JohnV]

While this Sunday's weather was not all sunny, it was no where near bad enough to consider canceling a true sporting event. (Lightening) The Pros are a bunch of pussies. I guarantee if there was a Men's club tourney down the road at Pacific Grove, it would not have been cancelled due to high winds and some drizzle.  And, before someone tries to throw out the tree falling on the third fairway (as reported) I highly doubt that tree was anywhere near the third fairway.

There is a difference between the Men's club tourney at Pacfic Grove and a professional golf tournament..  Saftery concerns for spectators, the camera men (a tower was blown over) and the players were foremost.

We did have a members outing up at Poppy Hills on Sunday and 103 players played.  But, it was a bit crazy and it was nowhere near as bad up there in the trees as it was down at Pebble.  The greens were flooded and the winds were extreme.

[Adam Clayman]

John, I'll admit that safety for spectators is important. I just lament that we only get to see these guys play in real conditions once a year, if we're lucky, in the Open Championship.
Case in point.... Tiger's 83 at Royal St George's back in '03 or '04(?)

[Rich Goodale]

Adam

Don't forget Tiger's 80-something at Muirfield too.......

....or his 3 Open wins, or his demolishing of the field at the 2000 US Open....

Rich

BTW, it was 50 degrees and sunny on the Old Course on Sunday (I was walking the course then and there).  Maybe the AT&T should be moved to St, Andrews?

r

[Joel_Stewart]

According to Geoff web site, MPCC Shore will replace Poppy Hills.

[Bob_Huntley]

According to Geoff web site, MPCC Shore will replace Poppy Hills.

Geoff could be jumping the gun. There is much opposition to this.

Bob

[Will MacEwen]

According to Geoff web site, MPCC Shore will replace Poppy Hills.

Geoff could be jumping the gun. There is much opposition to this.

Bob

Danny Gans won't be there.  That can only help.

[Bill_Yates]

Bob,
Perhaps you have an inside track to the facts.  What is the membership's primary opposition to hosting the AT&T?

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