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Jeff_Brauer

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Paired Features
« on: January 27, 2009, 08:10:22 AM »
I think we have discussed this long ago, but I would be interested to know how many of you, while golfing, notice features paired (or placed only a hole or two apart) by the gca for maximum varietal effect?

Some examples include Ross and Dye alternating fade/draw and draw/fade holes.

Some Tour Pros I have worked with asked for long par 4's into the wind followed closely by a short par 5 downwind, so that on many days, "regulation figures" is effectively reversed.

I find myself pairing features on consecutive or nearly so holes.  Things like the biggest green followed shortly thereafter by the smallest green, a heavily bunkered hole by a bunkerless hole, wide fw followed by a narrow one, etc. 

Even on individual holes, I might follow up a pinched fw landing area with an easier approach to the green.

Does anyone really notice and what are some examples of the ones you DO notice?
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Jeff Brauer, ASGCA Director of Outreach

Joe Hancock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Paired Features
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2009, 08:36:50 AM »
I thought this was one of those "typical man in the morning" threads for a minute......
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" What the hell is the point of architecture and excellence in design if a "clever" set up trumps it all?" Peter Pallotta, June 21, 2016

"People aren't picking a side of the fairway off a tee because of a randomly internally contoured green ."  jeffwarne, February 24, 2017

Adam Clayman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Paired Features
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2009, 09:32:20 AM »
Jeff, I'd assume most golfers would not notice what you describe, consciously. Perhaps, reflecting afterwards, a few may. The affect of what you describe is likely felt sub-consciously though. The varietal aspect being key to ones enjoyment at a core level.

Repetitive bunker schemes are also something most would not notice until it was pointed out to them.
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"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Matt Bosela

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Paired Features
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2009, 09:49:00 AM »
I always thought Thomas did this quite well at Riviera.

- Short par five opener, followed by long, difficult par four
- Dogleg right par four 3rd hole; next par four (5th) is a dogleg left; next par four after that (7th) is back to a dogleg right
- long par four 9th followed by driveable par four 10th, which is then followed with the longish par five 11th

There are more examples even within the holes, with many drives calling for draws but approaches calling for fades, and vice versa.

Pretty brilliant, really, in my opinion.
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Peter Pallotta

Re: Paired Features
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2009, 11:07:23 AM »
Jeff - I do notice paired features, or at least I think I do. And I tend to enjoy the kinds of pairings you mention, i.e. different green sizes, bunkering, and fairway widths. For some reason, though, I don't much enjoy the 'reversing of regulation' technique. I think it somehow feels more self-conscious to me, if you know what I mean. I feel like I'm being played....

Peter 
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Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Paired Features
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2009, 11:12:08 AM »
Jeff:

Can't say I've really thought about this in the same way you do.  I am conscious of wanting to provide variety, but not of pairing opposites.

Matt:

That second hole at Riviera started out as a par five, also.  In fact Thomas started out with two par-5's at LACC too.
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