If GCA is 90% drainage, Mike Dasher gets an A

[Jason Connor]

Pete Dye said something like 90% of golf course architecture is making draining look aesthetically pleasing (I'm paraphrasing since "aesthetically pleasing" probably isn't a phrase Mr. Dye uses).

Anyway, yesterday, after a weeks worth of rain from Tropical Storm/Hurricane Fay, I played Mike Dasher's North Shore GC in Orlando.  We even had another 1.5 inches of rain at the course overnight.

Yet when I played it at 7:30 yesterday morning, it was basically dry.  The rough was soggy in parts, and some low areas were wet, but the fairways were amazingly dry.

I'd always heard North Shore drained better than just about anywhere in Central Florida, but yesterday proved it.  Mike Dasher and the construction team did an amazing job.

Now to my question:

Obviously bad weather is a huge hit to a golf course -- lost green fees lower revenue and additional maintenance increase costs.  This is especially true if the draining is so poor that the course has to remain closed even for a few days after the rain has stopped because it's so wet.

How much do developers pay attention to a GCAs ability to drain a course and keep his course-to-be open for business?

[Ronald Montesano]

As an amateur tyro GCA, I assert that it is the GCA's responsibility to do the homework and assess the importance of beyond-excellent drainage, and to then present this information as part of a bid for service.  Marketing 101 is the most important course any adult can ever take at college or the school of hard knocks. 

Drainage is not an issue in areas where there is less rainfall, nor would it be as important in sandy areas versus the clay island in the midst of the Niagara River that I call home.

Knowing that I could be incorrect on all counts, I approved this message.

[Jeff_Brauer]

Ronald,

Not to bust your chops, but you are wrong on both counts.  Drainage counts equally anywhere.  Rain may fall less or more, but when it does, you gotta get it out of there.  It may be that surface slopes can be less, or pipes smaller, but you still have to account for it.

And, I was at a Sandy soil course the other day with drainage problems.  The problem is, that over time silt and grass clippings build up in the surface reducing drainage. 

[John_Conley]

Jason, I got an e-mail invitation to come out and play Walkabout in Mims on Friday.  Despite all the rain they said they were playable.  Kudos not only to Dash, but Jan Stevenson as well.

[RJ_Daley]

The Dixie Cuppers will get a peak at Dasher's work at Dunes of Seville.  I reckon that is another course where drainage is in the spotlight this week... Anyone know how that course fared this week in TS Fay?

[John_Conley]

The Dixie Cuppers will get a peak at Dasher's work at Dunes of Seville.  I reckon that is another course where drainage is in the spotlight this week... Anyone know how that course fared this week in TS Fay?

RJ, I was on the West Coast of Florida on Thursday.  There was a little rain, but nothing unusual.  The Dunes surely fared well versus Fay since the storm wasn't over there.

Brevard County was hit worst.

[TX Golf]

When there is thatch, silt, grass, etc. buildups on a golf course is that something that can be fixed through substantial aeration or is a more invasive and drastic approach needed?

[Ronald Montesano]

Jeff,

Let's rephrase it...the extent of drainage...I cannot believe that the amount of drainage utilized is the same in all circumstances.  Where the surroundings lend themselves to it, you would logically need less of it, correct?  In contrast, when you have drainage problems, you would need to allow for and correct them.

I'm not speaking of unanticipated monsoon situations, just the expected rainfall and watering demands.

[Dan Herrmann]

Ron - you being from Buffalo know the importance of drainage more than most of us.  I know how wet golf courses can be up there in the spring, due to all the snowmelt combined with the thawing underground ice.

Shoot - my beloved old Sheridan Park muni didn't open every year till Memorial Day - largely due to the wetness.

[Ronald Montesano]

You can't blame the wetness at Sheridan.  You can blame Harries and the drainage people of his day for not knowing how to put in proper drainage, even with Two-Mile creek running through the course.  In WNY, poor early-season drainage issues are caused by frozen ground, not by anything else.  During the summer, heavy rains cause drainage issues at courses that don't have the proper system in place.  The point I'm trying to make is that drainage issues are NOT standard throughout the world.  The makeup of the ground and the weather patterns determine what degree of drainage is needed.  I cannot believe that you would build the exact same drainage system in northern Michigan as you would in Orlando, in Palm Desert and in St. Andrews.

Sheridan still doesn't drain well and even adds a few moving water hazards, created when the town grounds crew leaves the sprinklers on all night!

[Jeff_Brauer]

Jeff,

Let's rephrase it...the extent of drainage...I cannot believe that the amount of drainage utilized is the same in all circumstances.  Where the surroundings lend themselves to it, you would logically need less of it, correct?  In contrast, when you have drainage problems, you would need to allow for and correct them.

I'm not speaking of unanticipated monsoon situations, just the expected rainfall and watering demands.

Yes, the extent of drainage varies.

I spent over $600K draining a housing course in Vegas once - and that was after the Owner had spent $300K putting in a herringbone system to lower the water table.

The surface system pipes could have been small in the desert. I was really trying to pick up all the nuisance water coming off future surrounding houses outside the cart paths.  Only trouble was, the runs were very long because i wasn't allowed to shortcut anywhere through housing.  And, the site was very flat.  Since you can run bigger pipes flatter than smaller ones, the main line drainage runs got quite large.

So, there was more drainage in a drier climate, with bigger pipes!