[Todd Kuspira]

I am looking for suggestions of where to play on a 10-12 day golf trip to Northern England/Scotland.  All of your opinions are welcomed!!!

Many Thanks

[Tom_Doak]

Todd:

The answer depends on what, if any, courses you have played before in Scotland.

If you haven't played any at all, then you're staying in Scotland for the entire trip:

Prestwick/Troon/Turnberry and maybe Western Gailes
Muirfield/North Berwick/Gullane No. 1
St. Andrews/Kingsbarns
Royal Dornoch/Brora
and maybe Cruden Bay on the way to/from Dornoch

[Todd Kuspira]

Tom,
I have yet to travel to Scotland.  My sister lives in St.Annes, literally across the street from Royal Lytham.  I have had the opportunity to play Royal Birkdale and Lytham.

Thanks..

[David_Tepper]

Todd -

The topic gets raised often here. You will get a lot of different responses. A lot depends on how much you will wish to travel around the UK? Are you traveling by yourself or with a group of 2 or 3 other golfers? Are you interested in playing a lot of different golf courses or would you rather settle for a week into one area that has 3 or 4 quality courses and play each of those courses 2 or 3 times?

The Lancashire Coast, from St. Annes down to Liverpool, could be the strongest stretch of links golf in the world. After Birkdale and Royal Lytham St. Annes, courses such as Formby, Hillside, Southport Ainsdale, West Lancs and Royal Liverpool (Hoylake) all merit a visit.

Working your way north from St. Annes, you could visit Silloth-on-Solway (in Cumbria) and Southerness (near Dumfries) across the water in Scotland. From there, you could head up the west coast of Scotland to play Troon, Turnberry, Preswick and Western Gailes.  

That would fill up 10-12 days of golf quite nicely.

DT

[Ash Towe]

Todd,
Make full use of the Lancashire option.  There are many superb courses in the area.  Those not on the Open rota are not to be underestimated.  I would particularly endorse Formby and Hillside.

[Tom_Doak]

Todd:  Do not be swayed by these English apologists.  The twelve courses I listed in Scotland tot up a ridiculous 97 points on the Doak scale.  There are a lot of outstanding courses in England, but the top twelve in the entire country don't add up to 97 points; in fact you would be hard pressed to find twelve courses at any destination which scored a total of 97.

[Chris Kane]

Tom, your top 12 English courses add up to 94 (Rye, Royal Worlington & Newmarket 9; Lytham, Ganton, Woodhall Spa, St Georges Hill, Sunningdale Old, Swinley Forest, Sandwich 8; Formby, Birkdale, Hoylake 7) - not far behind at all.

Diverting the thread slightlky, for someone playing second-tier courses, is England signficantly stronger?  You mentioned in the Confidential Guide that Scotland lacks a world-class second-tier - does this still hold?

Also, I wasn't able to find a score for Brora - if you've seen it, could you give me a general idea of where it fits?

[Bill_McBride]

Agreed that a 10-12 day trip must include Dornoch.  I've been over twice and never had enough time to get up that far.  But with 10-12 days, it is a not-to-be-missed, or so Rich Goodale says!  

[Mark_F]

Chris,

I think England has a significantly stronger second tier.

In Scotland, maybe you would count Nairn, Royal Aberdeen and a few of the courses around St Andrews.

In England, you would count all the heathland courses, aside from the big couple, which could keep you busy for quite a while, as well as the treasures of East Anglia, Deal, the Midlands...

[mike_beene]

I think I might do what Tom Doake says here.Spend several days in St Andrews is the only thing I would add.

[Jon Wiggett]

Sean is right, There would be alot of road time and if the top 12 courses in england are not worth the trip because they don't reach '97' points on the Doak Scale then maybe the the scale needs revamping! I would add how ever the list is pretty awesome.

P.S. Cruden Bay is no maybe rather a must golfing experience. To have the opportunity to experience it but not play would be like been able to play Pine Valley or Augusta but turning them down.

[Tom_Doak]

Chris:

I knew the top 12 in England were pretty good but they are even further apart than the Scottish courses -- only four of those Lancs links among the twelve.

England does have a significantly stronger "second tier" if you are talking about courses number 20-40 or even 10-40.

Brora would get a 6 or a 7 on the Doak scale, depending on my mood.  I didn't include Machrihanish which is an 8 I think, just because the drive is so far for one more course, or Scotland would have gone 99 for 12.

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