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Evan_Green

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The Best Military Courses?
« on: February 07, 2006, 10:06:57 AM »
What are the best 3-5 military courses in the US?

Surely Bayonet/Blackhorse and the Presidio had to be up there before they were turned into public courses. But I am wondering what are the best remaining military courses.

A couple of the ones I've seen pictures of in Hawaii appear to be at the very least scenic.

Phil_the_Author

Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2006, 10:25:15 AM »
The La Oma course at Ft. Sam Houston, Texas is a wonderful Tillinghast course. In addition, Suneagles at Ft. Monmouth, is another Tilly. There is a concern for this due to potential base closing, but they also just had Mark Fine do a master plan and renovation recommendations.

rjsimper

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2006, 10:37:14 AM »
Kaneohe Klipper on Oahu has a couple of very pretty holes (I think 13-15) and I'd consider myself pretty fortunate to be able to play there at the military rates.  I hear the Hickam AFB course is supposed to be decent as well, but I've not seen it.

Many rave about the Destroyer Course at Los Alamitos (think Tiger Woods) in So. Cal, but I thought it was just another golf course with nothing particularly rave-worthy except maybe the 1/100 scale mock-up of military battleships in the pond on the back nine.

david h. carroll

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2006, 10:57:08 AM »
USNA in Annapolis...Flynn

wsmorrison

Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2006, 11:13:44 AM »
The former Norfolk Country Club was a wonderful design with sandy waste areas reminiscent of Pine Valley.  It is now Sewell's Point GC, and owned by the US Navy.  It is not a Donald Ross but a William Flynn, a second military course to the USNA one listed by David.  Ross designed another course for NFCC but it is NLE.  I haven't seen other military courses, so I have no idea how Flynn's two courses stack up against other military courses.  As the courses are today, I doubt they'd be among the better ones.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2006, 11:21:36 AM by Wayne Morrison »

Top100Guru

Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2006, 11:20:14 AM »
The Base Course on Parris Island near Beaufort, SC is pretty darn good. I am sure Mark Brown could weigh in more on this since he is down in that area.

It plays 6900 yards Par 72.......opened in 1957. Do not know who designed it.

Is Considered one of the Top 10 Military Courses around.

John Keenan

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2006, 02:28:28 PM »
Curious as to the architect who did these course was there a government contractor for golf design?  Seems Tilly and Flynn did 2 noted above..

Did the commanding officer decide on who designed them. How did they get designed?
The things a man has heard and seen are threads of life, and if he pulls them carefully from the confused distaff of memory, any who will can weave them into whatever garments of belief please them best.

Tim Leahy

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2006, 06:03:37 PM »
Kaneohe Klipper on Oahu has a couple of very pretty holes (I think 13-15) and I'd consider myself pretty fortunate to be able to play there at the military rates.  I hear the Hickam AFB course is supposed to be decent as well, but I've not seen it.Many rave about the Destroyer Course at Los Alamitos (think Tiger Woods) in So. Cal, but I thought it was just another golf course with nothing particularly rave-worthy except maybe the 1/100 scale mock-up of military battleships in the pond on the back nine.

I agree with Kaneohe and I also liked Hickam, right on the water, palm trees, great shape. Similar to Kaneohe is Coronado Island military course in San Diego, not quite as spectacular but right on the dunes on a couple of holes. My favorite is Marshalia Ranch at Vandenburg AFB in Lompoc, central coast, CA. Lots of trees, elevation changes and iceplant.
I love golf, the fightin irish, and beautiful women depending on the season and availability.

Pete Lavallee

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2006, 06:34:55 PM »
We have 5 Military courses in the greater San Diego area. I like Marine Memorial at Camp Pendleton the best. Built in a small river valley by Billy Bell Jr. on the inland side of the Camp; it's a very peaceful setting with some fine holes. The condition is purposely kept a little on the shaggy side; apparently the last general spent a little too much on maintenance.

MCAS Miramar has a great greenkeeper; his putting surfaces are superior to anything on the publuc side here in SD (with the exception of Barona Creek). Jack Daray built an interesting course on a faily flat and featureless parcel; wind is often a factor here.

Sea 'n Air on NAS North Island has 9 very poorly laid out holes on the original front 9; parallel fairways, in course OB, just generally crammed into too small an area. The back 9 was added much later and has wonderful topography and seperation; 3 holes play through the sand dunes on the beach. The course is closing for a few months for a renovation project which will effect 3, 4, 5, 6 14 & 15.

Admiral Baker, just down the road from Qualcom Stadium has two 18 hole courses. The South was executive length and was recently stretched and given tif dwarf greens. The North, done by Jack Daray, has a great routing and makes good use of the canyons and hills in the area. Common bermuda greens are a big dissapointment however; very slow to putt and almost featureless. A green redesign would make this the best Military course in the area by far.
"...one inoculated with the virus must swing a golf-club or perish."  Robert Hunter

Brian_Sleeman

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2006, 06:37:49 PM »
How does the Bayonet Course at Fort Ord stack up to all these?  I haven't played it - or any of the others - but with the reputation it has I have to imagine it being up there with the best of them.

Pete Lavallee

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2006, 06:40:20 PM »
Navy Marine in Oahu, right next to Pearl Harbor, is a very good Military Course; much tighter than I expected for such a windy area.
"...one inoculated with the virus must swing a golf-club or perish."  Robert Hunter

Evan_Green

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2006, 06:50:15 PM »
Thats the military course next to the Honolulu Airport that you see when you come in?
« Last Edit: February 07, 2006, 06:51:53 PM by Evan_Green »

Jason Hines

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2006, 07:25:28 PM »
Interesting this topic came up today, I flew over Ft. Bliss in El Paso this morning and saw that the greens were covered on their course?  It was 25 degrees overnight but getting up in the 60s.  Thought it was curious.

Here in Omaha (Bellevue) Offutt AB went public, it is a Robert Trent Jones Senior course.  Decent holes, goofy piece of property though...

Jason

Larry_Rodgers

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2006, 09:38:50 PM »
Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs is exceptional followed by the old course at Eglin. The Eglin courses are off base and available for non DOD people.

Adam_Messix

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2006, 10:00:40 PM »
I agree with David Carroll, it's the Naval Academy's course designed by Flynn.  What amazes me the most about that course is the rolling nature of the terrain that the course was built on, given the flatness of the middle to lower Chesapeake Bay region in general.  The 1st hole at the Naval Academy is a real eye opener, with it's steeply uphill approach shot.  The 10th is unusual for Flynn with the tree in the middle of the fairway.  The 17th hole is an excellent shortish par 3 hole where a good shot is rewarded and a miss is really punished (without water.)

Evan_Green

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2006, 11:56:39 PM »
I'm curious as to whether military courses are strictly an American phenomenon or other countries also have them?

Does anyone know of any non-American military courses (e.g. not built on based occupied by American military). Are any of these good?

Travis Ripley

Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #16 on: February 08, 2006, 01:14:10 AM »
Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs is exceptional followed by the old course at Eglin. The Eglin courses are off base and available for non DOD people.

i've heard nothing but good things about AFA.  I think/recall it gets ranked in the college courses rankings.  great setting, no doubt about that.      

Tom Huckaby

Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #17 on: February 08, 2006, 11:18:25 AM »
How does the Bayonet Course at Fort Ord stack up to all these?  I haven't played it - or any of the others - but with the reputation it has I have to imagine it being up there with the best of them.

Brian - the military moved out of Fort Ord several years ago, so this has been open to the public for awhile.  As for how it stacks up, well... it was a pretty incredible golf course during the military era - BRUTALLY hard, taking no prisoners.  Since then a lot of the trees have been thinned or removed, and all underbrush cleared out, such that it's still tough, but nothing much unique.

It's been discussed in here MANY times.

TH

Pete Lavallee

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #18 on: February 08, 2006, 11:32:15 AM »
Evan,

I have played at a 9 hole course in Koahsiung, built by and for the Taiwanese Navy. Very jungle-like and long, with the requisite coarse Asian grasses. They even had female caddies with large bonnets whose favorite phrase was: OB!
"...one inoculated with the virus must swing a golf-club or perish."  Robert Hunter

ForkaB

Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #19 on: February 08, 2006, 12:18:23 PM »
Evan

Lahinch was built by the Black Watch when they were suppressing the Irish.  Not sure if it was technically a military base, however........

PCCraig

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #20 on: February 08, 2006, 01:41:40 PM »
There used to be one right outside Chicago at the Naval Air Base that was here. The base was closed and sold off piece by piece to the village of Glenview. Half of the old course's land was used for The Glen Club, Tom Fazio's 120 million dollar course he built for Kemper Sports.

I was young when I played it, but I never thought it was too bad. Anyone on here remember it better?

thanks...
H.P.S.

Patrick Hitt

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #21 on: February 08, 2006, 09:01:25 PM »
Pat,
The course that you mention was the NAS Glenview golf course designed by Joe Roseman. It was originally the 36 hole Pickwick Golf Club before the Navy turned Lake Michigan into a place to learn carrier landings in WW II. When you get to the south east corner of the property you can still see the tree lines from the parallel 17th, 16th, 18th, 10th, and 1st holes. Roseman also laid out the Waveland GC - now Maravitz on the Chicago lakeshore. The best hole at NAS was the 4th or 5th - both featured nice crossbunkering that was impressively high and in the line of play.

Mark Brown

Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #22 on: February 08, 2006, 10:17:30 PM »
Paris Island in Charleston, SC newly rennovated

Richard Muldoon

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Re:The Best Military Courses?
« Reply #23 on: February 09, 2006, 07:16:37 AM »
Evan,
Tidworth Garrison Golf Club is on Army land. It's in Wiltshire near Salisbury. I've not played it but have heard that it is quite good. I'm not sure if it is run by the Army or is now a private members club, but I think the majority of members are current or ex Army.
Website is www.tidworthgolfclub.co.uk
I believe Muirfield, Royal St Georges, Swinley Forest amongst others have very strong links to the military.